|
|
05-02-2021, 02:26 PM
|
#21
|
Montana Fan
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: BUZZARDS BAY
Posts: 117
M.O.C. #25753
|
Like I said previously is your coach level when connected? This is very important and is a major cause of chucking? I have a 41’ footer pulled by a GMC 3500 SRW and have absolutely zero chucking and the only time I know my coach is connected is if I have to stop quick.
__________________
2020 Montana 3781RL
2020 GMC 3500 Denali HD Diesel SRW
20k Demco slider hitch
|
|
|
05-02-2021, 03:56 PM
|
#22
|
Montana Master
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Keller
Posts: 525
M.O.C. #26851
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrpopgun
Hi everyone.
I'm a new Montana owner (3230ck) as well as a new Ram 3500 (SRW, Crew, 6'4" bed, Cummins HO and Aisin) owner. Andersen Ultimate hitch with the adapter block towards the cab to provide a little more room for the nose.
I came from a 35' tow behind and now have the 3230ck as my 1st fifth wheel. Guess I was expecting a HUGE difference in overall stability and ease of pulling. So far, well it isn't meeting expectations but I think it can be addressed.
Issue: Pulling down the road, any road, there is this constant back and forth push/pull down through the center of the truck from nose to tail. It really actually feels like a slight (but constant) misfire or like when you're running out of gas and there is that back and forth as you have power, lose it then regain, repeat. It doesn't feel like the porpoising I had when my WDH setup wasn't dialed in correctly or when tongue heavy for the suspension (fixed on my last truck with Sumo's).
What the heck is causing this? Only think I can think of is maybe I'm flexing the suspension just enough to feel sort of like a micro-porpoising? Trailer pivots on axles vertically at nose and tail. When nose goes down it's actually a down and back sort of angle and "pulls" the truck back. It then rises back to top dead center where the goose ball stops the motion in which case good ole equal and opposite reaction then forces it back down? Seems possible and crazy at the same time to me.
Any feedback on what might cause and more importantly FIX this issue? Didn't think I'd have any issues like this going with a 3500 and a trailer in this weight class. If it's a suspension thing am I simply looking at Sumo's, Timbrens or Bags to resolve?
Haven't made the time to do proper weighing, but here's what I have when running back from camping last weekend and running across the public scales.
Truck alone (different scale so I need to vet this)
Front: 4475lbs
Rear: 2575lbs
Truck with trailer attached
Truck Front: 5150
Truck Rear: 6700
Trailer: 11,350
Sticker info
Truck
GAWR Front: 6000
GAWR Rear: 7000
GVWR: 11,800 (I suppose this means I am 50lbs overweight?)
Combined weight occupants and cargo: 3718 (yellow sticker)
Trailer
Unloaded weight: 13,000
GVWR: 16,680
GAWR (each): 7000
|
What you are describing is called chucking. This is a horizontal , front to back motion caused by , as described previously, the slowing of the truck and trailer at different times caused by bumps, rough roads, etc. I have ridden with several people that claimed to have no chucking. BALONEY! They all had chucking, but to varying degrees. Check out the Lipert Air Ride, and Flex Air pin boxes. The Flex Air probably reduces the chucking effect the most. My pin box mount only takes the Air Ride pin box and it did reduce a lot of the chucking, but I still have some on bad roads, rough bridges and the like. I have not found any pin box, and believe me I have looked, that claims to eliminate all chucking. Its a matter of physics. You can certainly dampen it with a shock absorbing system. Check out the Lipert pin boxes. Best thing I ever did for the ride and chucking. It also reduces a lot of the shock, up and down motion as well. I have air bags and they really soften the ride and help level everything, but do nothing for chucking. A level rig will still have chucking. What is needed is something that will dampen that push pull effect and these pin boxes will do that, plus soften the ride by absorbing a lot of the up and down shock. I have done a lot of research when I was trying to solve this issue and none do a better job than these Lipert pin boxes. I have a 41’ 5er and have found the longer and heavier the rig, the more intense the chucking, because of the distances between the axles. Mor Ride has some good pin boxes as well, but none better. Do your research and you can decide. Worth every penny.
|
|
|
05-02-2021, 04:14 PM
|
#23
|
Seasoned Camper
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Gassville
Posts: 59
M.O.C. #22218
|
We switched to an Anderson hitch a year or so ago and it cut way down on the chucking. You'll never completely remove it, but we only notice it now on bad dips. If it's bothering you on a decent road, something is wrong.
As has been said before, get that trailer as level as you can.
Are your truck tires aired up to where they should be? On occasion I run my truck tires lower when I'm not towing and if I forget to air them back up it really adds to the bounce.
Make sure you have both bolts and all 4 set screws torqued to spec on the pin box. The Anderson coupler on the pin box is pretty straight forward engineering, but if it's able to move even the tiniest amount you're in for a rough ride.
Also take a look at how you have it loaded. The more weight you have behind the axles, the worse the chucking will be.
__________________
2018 Montana High Country 331RL,
2011 Dodge Ram 3500 dually, Firestone air bags, Anderson Ultimate Hitch
|
|
|
05-02-2021, 04:29 PM
|
#24
|
Established Member
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: santa cruz
Posts: 33
M.O.C. #22049
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrpopgun
Hi everyone.
I'm a new Montana owner (3230ck) as well as a new Ram 3500 (SRW, Crew, 6'4" bed, Cummins HO and Aisin) owner. Andersen Ultimate hitch with the adapter block towards the cab to provide a little more room for the nose.
I came from a 35' tow behind and now have the 3230ck as my 1st fifth wheel. Guess I was expecting a HUGE difference in overall stability and ease of pulling. So far, well it isn't meeting expectations but I think it can be addressed.
Issue: Pulling down the road, any road, there is this constant back and forth push/pull down through the center of the truck from nose to tail. It really actually feels like a slight (but constant) misfire or like when you're running out of gas and there is that back and forth as you have power, lose it then regain, repeat. It doesn't feel like the porpoising I had when my WDH setup wasn't dialed in correctly or when tongue heavy for the suspension (fixed on my last truck with Sumo's).
What the heck is causing this? Only think I can think of is maybe I'm flexing the suspension just enough to feel sort of like a micro-porpoising? Trailer pivots on axles vertically at nose and tail. When nose goes down it's actually a down and back sort of angle and "pulls" the truck back. It then rises back to top dead center where the goose ball stops the motion in which case good ole equal and opposite reaction then forces it back down? Seems possible and crazy at the same time to me.
Any feedback on what might cause and more importantly FIX this issue? Didn't think I'd have any issues like this going with a 3500 and a trailer in this weight class. If it's a suspension thing am I simply looking at Sumo's, Timbrens or Bags to resolve?
Haven't made the time to do proper weighing, but here's what I have when running back from camping last weekend and running across the public scales.
Truck alone (different scale so I need to vet this)
Front: 4475lbs
Rear: 2575lbs
Truck with trailer attached
Truck Front: 5150
Truck Rear: 6700
Trailer: 11,350
Sticker info
Truck
GAWR Front: 6000
GAWR Rear: 7000
GVWR: 11,800 (I suppose this means I am 50lbs overweight?)
Combined weight occupants and cargo: 3718 (yellow sticker)
Trailer
Unloaded weight: 13,000
GVWR: 16,680
GAWR (each): 7000
|
Total newbies in RV world and got 3701LK in 2018 w AUH and towing w 3500HD GMC SRW shortbed. Drove 2yrs not knowing we needed lockout bars and now have them and don’t notice a lot of difference. Also have air bags. Have always had chucking and understand that’s just the norm. Recently got a new bed cover so raised the AUH ball to the 2nd notch and so far appears to be a smoother ride. Still chucking but not as much.
|
|
|
05-02-2021, 04:55 PM
|
#25
|
Montana Master
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: Bencia
Posts: 539
M.O.C. #25828
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrpopgun
.............I'm a new Montana owner (3230ck) as well as a new Ram 3500 (SRW, Crew, 6'4" bed, Cummins HO and Aisin) owner. Andersen Ultimate hitch with the adapter block towards the cab to provide a little more room for the nose.............What the heck is causing this?............. If it's a suspension thing am I simply looking at Sumo's, Timbrens or Bags to resolve?.........
|
Your trailer 16,680 lb GVWR is close to that of my 3780RL and I tow it with a 2016 F350 crew cab, long bed DRW with a 25K Curt fifth wheel hitch and Torklift A7200 Stable Load spring pads to replace the smaller, inefficient factory rubber bump stop pads, putting the factory springs back to work stabilizing the suspension and the truck's load (mitigated inch deflection)..............no issues. I have towed for 16 years with a standard fifth wheel hitch towing up to 14,000 lbs without the issues you described. Suspension upgrade and fifth wheel hitch might mitigate your issues.
https://www.curtmfg.com/5th-wheel/hitches
https://www.amazon.com/Torklift-A720.../dp/B002QH6N0G
|
|
|
05-02-2021, 06:07 PM
|
#26
|
Seasoned Camper
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Estherville
Posts: 53
M.O.C. #21904
|
Does anyone think the pin weight is excessive for this rig? I do.
|
|
|
05-02-2021, 06:09 PM
|
#27
|
Seasoned Camper
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Estherville
Posts: 53
M.O.C. #21904
|
I think you might be front heavy in the trailer.
|
|
|
05-02-2021, 08:03 PM
|
#28
|
Established Member
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Westerville
Posts: 39
M.O.C. #22500
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrpopgun
Hi everyone.
I'm a new Montana owner (3230ck) as well as a new Ram 3500 (SRW, Crew, 6'4" bed, Cummins HO and Aisin) owner. Andersen Ultimate hitch with the adapter block towards the cab to provide a little more room for the nose.
I came from a 35' tow behind and now have the 3230ck as my 1st fifth wheel. Guess I was expecting a HUGE difference in overall stability and ease of pulling. So far, well it isn't meeting expectations but I think it can be addressed.
Issue: Pulling down the road, any road, there is this constant back and forth push/pull down through the center of the truck from nose to tail. It really actually feels like a slight (but constant) misfire or like when you're running out of gas and there is that back and forth as you have power, lose it then regain, repeat. It doesn't feel like the porpoising I had when my WDH setup wasn't dialed in correctly or when tongue heavy for the suspension (fixed on my last truck with Sumo's).
What the heck is causing this? Only think I can think of is maybe I'm flexing the suspension just enough to feel sort of like a micro-porpoising? Trailer pivots on axles vertically at nose and tail. When nose goes down it's actually a down and back sort of angle and "pulls" the truck back. It then rises back to top dead center where the goose ball stops the motion in which case good ole equal and opposite reaction then forces it back down? Seems possible and crazy at the same time to me.
Any feedback on what might cause and more importantly FIX this issue? Didn't think I'd have any issues like this going with a 3500 and a trailer in this weight class. If it's a suspension thing am I simply looking at Sumo's, Timbrens or Bags to resolve?
Haven't made the time to do proper weighing, but here's what I have when running back from camping last weekend and running across the public scales.
Truck alone (different scale so I need to vet this)
Front: 4475lbs
Rear: 2575lbs
|
So the scales are wrong on this, that truck w the Aisin will weigh around 8200 lbs loaded w fuel, def and you. Payload is probably 3650-3800lbs.
So you are off about a 1000lbs. My truck tows a very similar weight trailer fine.
|
|
|
05-03-2021, 05:44 AM
|
#29
|
Seasoned Camper
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Artesia
Posts: 66
M.O.C. #27061
|
One thing to check is load distribution in your trailer. Over heavy front or back may cause havoc.
__________________
Roy, Georgia, Bear & Star desert rats USN vet
:dance
2015 375FLF MOUNTAINEER
2012 F350 SWD CREW
|
|
|
05-03-2021, 06:49 AM
|
#30
|
Established Member
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Westerville
Posts: 39
M.O.C. #22500
|
Doesn’t the Anderson hitch limit the options on the pin box? I thought I read If you have a pivoting head pin box that the head has to be locked out.
So like on a Flex Air pin box mated w the Anderson, the bottom section has an addition from Anderson that locks that section from pivoting, essentially making it into a trail air pin box.
Maybe someone knows.
|
|
|
05-03-2021, 09:39 AM
|
#31
|
Established Member
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Kirtland
Posts: 39
M.O.C. #22445
|
I have had a Montana HC with the Anderson Ultimate hitch. It is a ball and socket set up and it inherently DOES NOT CHUCK. Like the OP said, he is most likely getting "proposing" and this is most likely due to the one of 3 issues. 1. The trailer is not riding level. 2. The fresh water tank is full causing an imbalance. 3. And most likely, the hitch is not set up properly. The center point of the load must be directly over or just in front of the tow vehicle's rear axle. A simple thing to try is to reverse the position of the red hitch adapter.
|
|
|
05-04-2021, 09:48 AM
|
#32
|
New Member
Join Date: Mar 2021
Location: Medford
Posts: 5
M.O.C. #28345
|
Got busy with a host of other things this weekend and didn't get to do testing with the trailer and suggestions I've received in this thread. However, I will be sure to update as I try things. We're camping in a few weeks again so I'll have some info after that for sure.
Thanks everyone!
|
|
|
05-06-2021, 08:12 AM
|
#33
|
Montana Master
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Gardnerville
Posts: 1,280
M.O.C. #17163
|
Id check for too much weight in trailers rear.. Water?, Toy hauler.. Not enuff front weight will definitely cause chucking..
|
|
|
05-06-2021, 08:19 AM
|
#34
|
Montana Master
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Gardnerville
Posts: 1,280
M.O.C. #17163
|
Too too much weight in rear, not level?
|
|
|
05-17-2021, 01:44 PM
|
#35
|
New Member
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Spearfish
Posts: 2
M.O.C. #28599
|
I have a 2021 3790 and a 2020 DRW Ram. I started with an AUH. It towed fairly well. I swapped out the AHU because of warranty issues. I went with a Reese Goosebox. It is a much better system in my humble opinion. I like the extra room in the bed of the truck too.
|
|
|
05-17-2021, 04:27 PM
|
#36
|
Montana Fan
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: owen sound
Posts: 491
M.O.C. #17566
|
Towed the 2015 Monty that had the MORRYDE pin box and now tow 2019 Monty with the Road Armour pin box and can't feel any difference. Some roads are bad 23 South of Detroit being one of them. But usually if it is chucking badly try redistributing some weight forward in the trailer. Usually helps, also run your tire pressures close to the max on the trailer all will help...
|
|
|
07-03-2021, 07:42 PM
|
#37
|
Seasoned Camper
Join Date: Jun 2021
Location: Wilmar
Posts: 54
M.O.C. #29050
|
I’m a new member so just seeing your issue.
I have a Montana 305 rl - empty wt. 10,800 lbs.
loaded 14,000. I originally had a 2017 ram 2500 6.4 hemi short bed. I adjusted the height of my Anderson hitch trying to lower the nose of my 35’ RV.
It bucked and chucked so bad I had to pull into a parking lot and unhitched from RV and put ball back in old position. Rode smooth after that. I have since upgraded to a 2020 3500 crew cab diesel HO SRW. Short bed. Still have Anderson UH , just made a trip from South Arkansas to the Smokies and had very little chucking only when on extremely rough roads.
I would contact Anderson for advice. I think if your hitch is adjusted correctly and RV weight balanced you shouldn’t have an issue. Hope you have already resolved your problem.
|
|
|
07-04-2021, 09:58 AM
|
#38
|
Montana Master
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Battleford
Posts: 627
M.O.C. #26690
|
I think what has been quietly missed in all of this is that the AUH is not compatible with the factory RotaFlex pin box. Anderson themselves have a list of pin boxes and whether they are compatible, or in many cases what accessories are needed in order for them to work properly.
In the case of the OP, this is what you need:
https://andersenhitches.com/products...ex-lockout-kit
The above kit is specifically designed to solve the issues you are having, and to prevent damage to the pinbox and/or the hitch.
hth,
Brad
__________________
2021 Montana 3790RD, Legacy, Super Solar Flex
2020 RAM 3500 Limited, HO
|
|
|
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|
» Recent Threads |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|