New Factory Option

[Montana Man]

How about a factory quality control check option for new units. This option will pay for a seasoned assembler to QC every mechanical and electrical function, labels done correctly, water leak check, hvac duct integrity, wheel alignment, slide adjustment, tv cabling, refrigerator seals, etc., etc. Then provide a signed checklist.

If the manufacturing overhead rate was $50 per hour, a 40 hour inspection would only cost $2000. How many would opt for that?

[Texan]

Not me. I already feel I paid for that when I bought the rv. How would i know it was a seasoned assembly person that checked it in the first place. The only problem I've had with mine is the black tank valve leaking on my 2013. This was under warranty and if I had something checked off and then it failed then it would be under warranty anyhow as most problems happen within the first year. All this would do would be to give the manufacture a pass and the customer is already to easy on the manufacture to start with. I expect the manufacture and the dealer to do quality work to start with. I may not get it but I won't reward them for there inferior work by giving them 2,000.00 of my money. No other industry has this so why should the rv industry have it.

[MidMOTraveler]

100% Agree Texan

[Montana Man]

I agree but the QC isn't happening. There is no excuse for what we are getting. In fact, they could (should) implement this idea as a standard, and bake the cost into the price and nobody would know any better.

I made the suggestion in a semi sarcastic frame of mind but in reality, the issues we read a lot about should never be happening. Some things break, OK. But other issues are evidence that they are cutting corners in the wrong place. I used to be a welding inspector for a short while. Just knowing that welds were going to be inspected improved quality immensely.

[mlh]

$50 an hour. What company could stay in business at that rate?
Lynwood

[grumbolt]

Originally Posted by mlh

$50 an hour. What company could stay in business at that rate?
Lynwood

thats not what they charge for their labor,
thats what the total cost of their labor per man hour would probably be:



(hourly wage, social security match, 401k match, group health insurance contribution, holiday / vacation pay etc... )



that being said, quality control is already baked into the price of the units, but most of the quality control is lacking in the industry from what i have read.

[Montana Man]

At a minimum, a signed checklist would make a world of difference.

[mlh]

QC is expensive. I wonder how much people would pay fo QC. After the sale if you got a camper with a lot of problems you would be happy to pay more. Before you bought I suspect not many people would be willing to fork out what QC would cost.

[richfaa]

Those who have toured the factory at the fall rally will understand that there is QC on the line as noted by the red tape on units on the line and at the last station. Apparently it is not good enough and more effort needs to be directed toward Effective QC.

[jeffba]

Originally Posted by richfaa

Those who have toured the factory at the fall rally will understand that there is QC on the line as noted by the red tape on units on the line and at the last station. Apparently it is not good enough and more effort needs to be directed toward Effective QC.

I saw that Rich during the Rally. The cynical side of me was wondering if that was just for show, were they all that bad coming off of the line or do they really fix everything flagged.

[DQDick]

I think they do the best they can, but not everything is visable at the end of the line. It's also my personal opinion from monitoring this, facebook and other forums that they do a far better job or QC in the Montana factory than they apparently do in the HC factory. Of course the price is different also.

[richfaa]

Having some experience in Quality control I once asked while on the factory tour if they do a QC check at each stage of assembly and the answer was they do not. They do check on what they can see but if they can't see it ???? Effective quality Control is a expensive program that the RV industry does not choose to get involved in. Remember that Keystone only assembles these things and all of the parts are vendor manufactured and should have quality control checks at the vendor factories. I do see that most of the issues are related to the assembly and there should be more effective QC on the assembly line.That would be very expensive and slow down the line.It is not going to happen.

[jeffba]

I have posted this in the past. When we looked at out 3701LK when it hit the dealer's lot before they could prep it it looked a lot better than other Montanas on the lot. Our list of warranty repairs was also shorter. Knock on wood

[Montana Man]

I've spent a few years in charge of running manufacturing plants with revenues over $25m annually. When quality slipped, heads rolled. There is no viable excuse for many of the issues we read about with repetition. Things are being assembled with no check to verify if they actually work. Or even worse, checked but passed on to meet quotas. Don't get me wrong. I like my trailer but would have been happier not having to fix substandard workmanship. It will keep me from upgrading in the future.

The title of this part of the forum is Hey Montana... I challenge them to prove me wrong.

[bshgto]

AS before more propaganda.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khKkjbHMPRU&t=156s

[bobbrus1]

QC if done correctly would more than pay for itself in fewer rejects and better customer relationships

[E Rod]

That video is a joke. If my 2017 Alpine had gone thru those PDI's. They would of caught all the issues I had from day one like my In Command. I had to1 press the touch screen over 30 times each way to extend or retract my hydraulic slide outside among other issues. For $84k I agree with others. We already paid for what should had been repaired at factory. I bought my unit to enjoy not spend months at dealer getting repaired

[Montana Man]

After seeing the video, I suppose all the issues I had were the result of its first time on the road between the plant and the dealer... That must be a really bad road.

[Forsch]

I agree better quality control is needed. The issue at hand is what is the wage being paid to the assembly worker. I bet it is minimum wage or close. If you pay for skilled labor you will get better quality in most cases. The issue then becomes the cost of the units. It’s a never ending cycle. Some manufacturers have workers that pride themselves on the quality of the work they do regardless of their wage. Some dealers have the same. Unfortunately most manufacturers and dealers employ people that could care less about the quality of the work they provide. It’s unfortunate. Really the only thing we can do is not purchase from them and take our business elsewhere, but really what are our options when the entire industry is in the same boat. They have us all by the family jewels!

[Mark N.]

Originally Posted by Montana Man

How about a factory quality control check option for new units. This option will pay for a seasoned assembler to QC every mechanical and electrical function, labels done correctly, water leak check, hvac duct integrity, wheel alignment, slide adjustment, tv cabling, refrigerator seals, etc., etc. Then provide a signed checklist.

If the manufacturing overhead rate was $50 per hour, a 40 hour inspection would only cost $2000. How many would opt for that?

Say what?!? Are you kidding or serious? I hope NOBODY would pay extra for what Keystone SHOULD be doing with our money in the first place! Imagine what you just asked being offered during the purchase of a new truck! We'd all laugh and never look back at that manufacturer again. I'm guessing you aren't serious, just making a point about the lack of QC in the RV industry. Point made.