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Old 06-02-2008, 06:13 AM   #41
skypilot
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A little off topic but bears on the issue of people losing homes, jobs, etc.... KC MO is trying to get 'panhandlers' off the street. They are now putting in 'traffic meters' (painted yellow) and running a campaign called something like 'coins for caring'. Anyway, what they want is people to give their change to these machines which will be collected and then distributed to the various aid societies / homeless shelters, etc., in town. The goal is to get the panhandlers / people needing the money to go to these agencies where they can be put into the system and helped properly, not just left on the street living on what coins / monies they collect daily. The tragic part is that the news crew interviewed some of the panhandlers asking them what they thought and they didn't want to go the the agencies -- they didn't want to be put, as one person stated quite bluntly - 'back into the system that ruined me in the first place.'.

Well, my reason for bringing this out is that we all want to help (it is basic human nature to help in most cases) but there are just some who don't want the help that is offered; there are others who will, as shown in various comments above, use and abuse the system. Off my carboard carton (soapbox ??) and back on topic.

 
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Old 06-02-2008, 06:48 AM   #42
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yes its very interesting Mrs Country guy-better then watching the tv-it can be amusing when prople say they cant just hook up the monty and gowhen so many people need help but i think one said that is in Pa at a rally?
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Old 06-02-2008, 01:27 PM   #43
richfaa
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Some folks just have to say what they want to say without actually reading anything..yes we are at a rally in PA. We said in many post that we would still spend the travel money we had budgeted but were cutting back. We should be on a trip to the N.E States covering 3 or 4K miles..Instead we attended a rally in Pa round trip 800 Miles... That is called cutting back. And just where did we say" they cant just hook up the monty and gowhen so many people need help" I can't find that????

This is what I said "I guess I should just hook up the Montana have some fun and pretend those folks do not exist. Sorry, Can't do it..There are far to many people out there with a I don't care attitude and that is part of the problem."
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Old 06-02-2008, 05:26 PM   #44
rames14
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Lots of good info on this post. I have worked in manufacturing for almost all of my adult life. The U.S. was the largest builder of machine tools, cars, planes, trains, you name it. Manufacturing jobs were good paying, for the most part steady jobs. But, government policies discouraged investment and many jobs went elsewhere. Today, Toyota is the leading car manufacturer in the world. Boeing is getting serious competition from Airbus and China just announced they were beginning their own National Aircraft manufacturer. The leading machine tool manufacturer is no longer in the U.S., Europe or Japan - it's China. We graduate fewer engineers each year than Japan, China, Korea, Russia, and several others. Yet, there are still pockets of success. At Bucyrus International we can't hire enough welders and CNC machine operators - at $30/hr. plus overtime. Caterpillar pays $13/hr. for the same type of work. All I can say is we need to get back to basics - government policies that support investment in the U.S., and educational system that stresses learning instead of tenure, and family values that help to prevent drug use, pre-marital pregnancies, and a general dependancy on government help. I, like many, was very fortunate. I was able to get into a four year apprenticeship. Then I got my three degrees going to night school. I lost my job at Caterpillar in 1980 when they laid off 35,000 workers worldwide. It took me four months to find another job. I vowed I would never put my family in that situation again. I made sure that I got skills that were marketable. I was fortunate to learn my lesson early in life and to have many blessings from God. Bad things do happen to good people, but there's nothing wrong with people doing a little on their own. I sure would have enjoyed sitting at home and spending time with the family instead of driving 50 miles each way to school through snow and fog after working ten to twelve hours. I am only too happy to help those less fortunate, as long as they put in the same effort.
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Old 06-03-2008, 04:41 AM   #45
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This mornings bad news. GM will cease production at 4 North American Plants.. I am wondering what those affected folks did wrong, What poor choice did they make. What sacrifice did they not make. Their choice was to work for GM. Poor choice? Their choice was to buy a home and take out a mortgage... Poor Choice? Their choice was to take out a school loan for themselves or their kids..poor choice? Their choice was to live part of the American dream..Poor choice? Their choice was to save, for retirement and travel..poor choice? They worked and lived within the system.. Good old working folks..No drugs, No Meth labs in the garage. But wait a minute..I don't have those problems.. I am unaffected. I did everything right and they obviously did everything wrong so their plight is their fault.. and I will not spend a single minute feeling sorry for them.If they did what I did ..they would be OK.

Reality.. Your pension, your job, your business, your Mortgage, your truck, your Montana may well be next..What poor choice will you have made.

Now there is very little that I can do as a individual.. But I do acknowledge the problem and understand that the vast majority of these folks and one of them could be or is you and did nothing wrong. We cut back, we conserve, we volunteer to help those in need. As a member of The Lions International we stand in front of Super markets and beg for food for the needy. We give eye examinations to those needy who can not afford them. We do projects and support the community. We buy gifts for the needy kids for Christmas.. We are being overwhelmed this year.

I recall the man and wife who came out of Giant Eagle supermarket with 4 carts over flowing with food and and said take them,Last year we needed this an you provided it.. what a reward.. I do note that most of the posters on this subject understand the problem and some are affected but we acknowledge and we in our own way help.. The rest of us really need to wake up and look around.
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Old 06-03-2008, 06:18 AM   #46
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I can agree with some of everything that has been said by everyone on this thread, but I really feel that this topic has definitely gotten out of control.
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Old 06-03-2008, 06:52 AM   #47
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This is very interesting topic. I feel that no one as said any untruths. All have brought up very good points. Some have lived them or know someone that has. I agree with all things brought up. I would like to bring up one more thing and that would be" DO WE TRUST OUR LEADERS?" That would be leaders from top to bottom. Government, CEO'S And what else? We have been told so many lies from all these "LEADERS"that it is hard to trust any one of them. This seems to be a world wide problem and not just here. It is from company's and governments world wide. We all have seen ex samples of this,tires,toys,pet food and who knows what else? I wish I knew the answer. Just beware of whats happening is maybe the best defense.
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Old 06-03-2008, 09:32 AM   #48
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No disrespect to anyone.But could it be that some of us are hearing things we just do not want to hear???
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Old 06-03-2008, 10:01 AM   #49
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The amazing thing with regards to the OP is that in the eyes of the world, even the family in the dingy trailer pulled by the beat-up truck are rich and blessed!! Someone posted some revealing statistics before that included some realities such as: If you have a roof over your head, if you have shoes, if you have small change in your pocket, then you or they are richer than 85% percent of the people in the world. We are all truly blessed to live in this country, look up some web-pages of African missionaries if anyone doubts it. I think the biggest problem is that we tend to judge others by their outward appearances, their vehicles, even their houses, when those same people can be happier with their status in life than we can ever be. I am thankful that I have been blessed with the means to provide for my family and help others as Rich stated at the same time. The best way to help is through your local churches and your local charities and feel blessed to be able to do so (This does not have to be monetary but it can be your time). While I appreciate the gloom and doom posts and their realities of life for some people, I still have to maintain the belief that all of the people of this country are resilient enough to provide for their families in some manner IF THEY CHOOSE TO DO SO! I am not belittling anyone but at some point we have to accept that there are greater forces at work and one of those has to be self preserverence. Sorry about the length and I will now dismount from my soapbox. Blessings to all!!!
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Old 06-03-2008, 11:20 AM   #50
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You are a good person Bingo.It was our pleasure to meet you and your fine family at the N.E rally.
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Old 06-04-2008, 03:38 AM   #51
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Bad news for today,,united is slashing jobs and reducing flights because of the "fuel enviroment" More ordinary folks who made poor choices.Wonder if that will affect anyones ability to pay the mortgage, car payments, truck payments, Camper payments keep the kids in school, take family vacations, etc..What did they do wrong??? Well it does not affect me..I made all the right choices. If they did like I did they would not be in the situation they are in.. Think I will go out and fill the Diesel with fuel at 4.999 just to show those folks what it means to make good choices.
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Old 06-04-2008, 04:24 AM   #52
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I love your attitude. It is so easy to judge others and their choices. We need to return to the values that made this country great especially helping others in need. I think a lot of the anger is due to how the government distributes some of our money, but I really am not trying to turn this into something political. I miss the days of my youth where if someone needed help no one thought twice about stepping forward and never questioned whether they deserved the help or not.
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Old 06-04-2008, 02:06 PM   #53
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Seems to me that 'back in the old days' when somebody needed help, it came from family, fellow Americans, neighbors, the church and similar places. Now it all comes from one of our many government hand out programs that have run amok. A town near us came out with a new meal program. It started as underpriviledged school breakfast, went to breakfast and lunch, went to include summer breakfast, then to include summer breakfast and lunch. The new program allows ANY PERSON, under 18, to eat breakfast and lunch...totally free.
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Old 06-05-2008, 03:08 AM   #54
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This mornings news.Continental airlines cuts 3000 jobs and cuts flights due to the Energy impact.More mortgages,kids school tuition, truck payments,Camper payments,bill paying, Pension's, etc affected.Their choice was to work for Continental.What did they do wrong.But they can find another job..in a economy where thousands of folks are losing jobs it should be easy to find another. I wonder if there are 3000 of any kind of jobs available in that area.. Well they can pick up and move to another area,,hopefully not in a rickety camper..but stay away from that area were all those United folks just got layed off and not in my area where all the Ford and GM folks got layed off.I am sure there are areas out there that will welcome you..even if you are in a rickety camper. The severe impact of high energy is starting to show up and it will get much worse..Wonder how close the impact is to..you...As Carol said..."there but for the grace....
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Old 06-05-2008, 03:31 AM   #55
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The West Virginia coal mines (surface and underground) cannot find enough qualified applicants. Even hourly employees are getting incentive packages: sign-on bonuses, gas allowances, 90% insurance with no premiums, etc. etc. It is odd to see WV actually needing workers instead of exporting them to the Charlotte area.
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Old 06-05-2008, 05:06 AM   #56
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Bingo... is that because we are using more coal in producing energy? Is production up??WV is usually high in Unemployment. I am sure there are a lot of laid off folks in our local auto industry, a lot of them from WV that would go back.. Many folks from WV are here because of lack of jobs in the mining industry.
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Old 06-05-2008, 05:28 AM   #57
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Rich,
The coal market is through the roof on a world-wide market. Coal for power plants that a year ago was selling for $50 a ton is selling for $110 a ton now. Coal used for making steel that a year ago was selling for $70 a ton is now selling for above $200 a ton. I work for Massey Energy and we are trying to open new mines left and right as others in the industry are doing. Sustainability of the shortage is projected through 2010 and beyond. Help wanted ads are in the papers daily (wvgazette.com and dailymail.com) and take up entire pages in the Sunday editions. We are experiencing a coal boom like I have not seen in my 20+ years in the industry.
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Old 06-05-2008, 06:04 AM   #58
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GREAT! How soon can we get coal on the commodities market??? Those poor speculators are looking for another area to exploit with the Feds poking into their oil fun and games...
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Old 06-05-2008, 06:18 AM   #59
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Actually Dave, it is already there. Futures through the end of the year on web-sites that I monitor: Platts.com. This site tracks all energy, oil, coal, electric, nat. gas, nuclear.
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Old 06-05-2008, 06:22 AM   #60
richfaa
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The general definition for Commodities.." Anything that come from the ground"

Bingo..that is a great site www.platts.com
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