I didn't think I would ever have to say this..... - Page 2 - Montana Owners Club

bncinwv · 09-27-2007, 03:53 AM

jka,
Your post needs to be repeated on the Keystone-Montana.com site. Look at the lower left corner for a button that says "Send us your ideas".
Bingo

Glenn and Lorraine · 09-27-2007, 04:44 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by SlickWillie

Question for you, Glenn. I am assuming your truck has the OEM size; 245 75R X 16 tires. Will these mount up OK on the RV rims? Seems I read somewhere about that particular size being for wider rim widths. Any problems? Seems the steel wheels on the Mountaineer are 6" width, but I could be wrong. Are the OEM aluminum on the Montana's wider? Just curious, as I will be needing new tires on the TV in a few months. The Missions have always made me nervous. I feel the Chinese cut too many corners to keep the price on their products down. I am no tire expert by any stretch of the imagination.

Going back to my previous reply....

Quote:

quote:As soon as I get a few more thousand more miles on my TV's Michelin's I will be buying 4 new tires for the TV and put the used Michelin's on the Monty.

I should have also added...I will put the TV's tires on the Monty only after I have fully investigated the overall size; width/height and load range of both the TV's OEM tires and the Missions. I will also be looking at the wheel, width and load range capacity, before making the move.

For those of you that still have the LT235/75R16 E on your Monty you can replace them with the GM's LT245/75R16 E. The height and width difference is minuscule and the load capacity is exactly the same and the wheel width is within a 1/2 inch.
Had I kept by 04 2955RL this was exactly what I was going to do.

sailer · 09-27-2007, 05:25 PM

the safty issue on this must be addressed by keystone or they will start loosing the customer base and its hard to get back on top , if you stay on top you must performe and be good or you go to last place fast ,, if thats what they want is only profit and not quality it will show up fast ,, the tires are on the bottom and from there we go up ,, to the top , the rubber roof will be next as rubber is a short life product ,, talk to any roofer so lets not worry about what color counter tops yet lets fix the nuts and bolts of this thing before it goes down hill john

richfaa · 09-28-2007, 03:51 AM

According to the poll taken on this forum 39% of us are full timers or long timers and 51% of us are weekender's or vacationers. I asked a high ranking Montana exec at the rally about that and his reply was that the majority of Montana buy ers are weekender's. In would then make sense that that is the group they build the campers for..low use users. If you are a low user the tires, shackles , etc will no doubt last for a very long time. In our previous campers used as a weekender we never had a tire or shackle problem.we changed tires because they were cracking from lack of use. We are looking at @ 15K miles on this 3400..we did not have 15K miles on our last 3 campers combined. I am not defending Montana just observing the obvious.. many of us use these campers in a manner they were not specifically designed for..long time high mileage use so we can expect accelerated wear..or..we can purchase a camper designed for high use..or..we can upgrade what we have..Better tires, Upgraded shackles, better suspension. We expected this and we are doing this...

sailer · 09-28-2007, 05:37 PM

Rich if montana wants to keep the #1 spot and not loose its customer base , it needs to step up to the plate and face facts , there are a lot of long timers out there in montanas and we want a unit not broken down and 1 we can trust with safty and satasfiction john

richfaa · 09-29-2007, 02:33 AM

I agree with that John being a long timer ourselves but the fact is that long timers/full timers are not the primary purchasers of the product.The fact also is if Montana lost many of us that full time or long time(which they won't) the sales would not suffer that much. We note more failures because we use the product more and Montana does , as was evidenced at the rally, ask questions and take notes as to how to improve the product.IMO Montana will never make a"true full timers rig"( and I question that any manufacturere does) that is not the primary customer base they seek. All things considered the Montana was the best buy considering all areas. Now workmanship quality could improve as most of our problems were directly related to poor workmansip or questionable design. sagging main slide roof, Slides not adjusted properly. Leaks, Etc

Glenn and Lorraine · 09-29-2007, 08:19 AM

Well I for one, and a full timer at that, will never buy anything but a Montana. Oh sure I've had problems this year with the tires and very few minor problems which Montana took care of without question.

While we were at Ebys Pines CG just outside of Goshen we met a couple that owned a 7 month old tri-axle Teton Homes. On the day he picked it up and only 150 miles from his dealer his front hydraulic jacks started to drop as he was going down the hiway. In less than a month he found 50+ problems that his dealer supposedly fixed including the front jackets. In his travels he ended up having to go to Casper, WY, the home of Teton, for another 60+ problems including his still faulty front jacks. He spent 2 weeks in Casper waiting to get his rig finished. Back on the road again and heading east he found his front jacks still weren't fixed properly. He than contacted Lippert, they built the hydraulic system, and that is how he ended up a Ebys Pines. Two of Lippert's top techs came to Ebys and after 9 hours they were not able to fix the problem. The techs called in Bob, forgot his last name but anyone that was at the rally met him. He was the gray haired guy. Bob is the designer of all the hydraulic systems for Lippert. Bob spent 6 hours on Saturday and another 4 on Sunday trying to get to the root of the problem. It wasn't until he put pressure gauges on every line that he realized that Teton plumbed the hydraulic lines as they saw fit which had little to do with the Lippert instructions.
Last summer I was set up next to a 3 month old Prevost. The owner was fuming mad. He had over 125 problems, some major, in his $1.9 Mil bus and Prevost was giving him a rough time.

I point these 2 out as examples and I am sure any Montana owner can attest to the fact that we all have run into RVers with SOBs that have the same type of horror stories. Our Monty problems are no different than any other RV on the road today. We recently had a few MOCers that bought an SOB and I can almost guarantee them that their new SOB will be no different, problem wise, than the Monty they just traded.

There is NO MAN MADE product on the market that is not subject to problems. It is the Nature of the Beast. That beast being MAN or WOMAN. Everything we build is subject to a problem. Now take that MAN MADE rig and drag it down the hiway at over 60 MPH over pot holes, concrete joints, bridges, etc and tell me you do not expect any problems. If you don't expect to have problems than maybe you should rethink you rving lifestyle. And I don't give a rats patootie whether you are a weekender, a 2 weeker, a long timer or a full timer you will have problems. He%% even Mother Nature can't build anything problem free what makes you think Mankind is better.

Granted some of these problems are safety related and I am sure Keystone is looking into them as well as any other problems we addressed at the rally as well as anything we have posted here.

I loved my old 2955RL and I love my 3485SA and I am sure I will love whatever model number Montana I buy in the future. We all know that Dale's UserID "MIMF" stands for "Montana In My Future". I am thinking of changing my user ID to OMIMF...Only Montanas In My Future"

dsprik · 09-29-2007, 06:17 PM

Well said, Glenn...

steves · 09-30-2007, 03:19 AM

Agree - any unit regardless of price or brand can/will have problems. The important consideration is the efforts a company puts forth on quality control and then how they stands behind their product when a problem occurs. Keystone (Montana) has always been very fair with me and that's why I am on my 2nd unit and will stay with the Montana line in the future. Unfortunately, dealers get involved and sometime you do not get quality service. Again, this is the same situation with any brand - Research the dealers service history before before you buy.

richfaa · 09-30-2007, 05:22 AM

Let me explain why it is doubtful that I would purchase another Montana. We are perfectly satisfied with this one,,having said that this is our 5th camper , all different brands.We purchase what serves our all over needs and budget regardless of brand. the only reason we would purchase another camper would be to upgrade and the only ungrade from the 3400 in the Montana line is the big sky and we have considered that..If the budget allowed we would buy the big sky..we can't see purchsing another 3400..we have one of those..the other models do not meet our travel and living requirement..so if we got another camper in the Montana line it would be the Big Sky..if the big sky did not meet our needs it would be a brand that would...simple as that.

Annem · 09-30-2007, 03:31 PM

On our trip to Alaska from Florida we had a tire fall apart in Oregon, right side back tire, tore the underside apart, finally found a spare, not easy to do and went on our way, few days later half hour into British Columbia, same side front tire blew out, this time taking the fender with it, breaking the shock off, it was a mess! We figured now we have a problem, we called Keystone and they said it wasn't their problem, gave us Tirecos number to try to get some help there, Albert said they would pay for any damage done to the rv and for new tires, damage is $3800, just to the trailer and we had to buy five tires on this trip, once we got the new tires on we were on our way on to Alaska and never had another problem with tires. My husband didn't want the Pressure Pro moniter but I think he has changed his mind. We had no problems last year so this was a surprise this year, not a lot of miles of the trailer. Hope we can get this fixed soon since we also have a trip to Destin for Thanksgiving!

bncinwv · 09-30-2007, 04:45 PM

Annem,
Topsail????? We'll be there the whole week of Thanksgiving. Sorry to hear of your troubles, but it sounds like Tireco came through???? Please tell me they weren't Mission tires. I am trying to convince myself that they will get us to Florida from WV non-stop.
Bingo and Cathy

Annem · 10-02-2007, 12:42 AM

Yes they were missions,went to Yellowstone last year, no problems, I faxed the paper work to Tireco, waiting to hear but I see from other members on the forum they have been waiting a few months to hear also, I forgot to mention we also have a bent axle which has ruined two tires we bought, we don't want to go too far on these, of course since we bought them in Canada our local tire store doesn't have them and my husband is a fanatic about his tires!
Have you been to Topsail? You will love it!

exav8tr · 10-02-2007, 01:17 PM

Annem, I would vote for the pressure pro. Saved my bacon twice coming FROM Alaska.....Two flats and NO coach damage. Call me lucky if you wish, but when the pressure pro says you have a problem, believe it........

MacDR50 · 10-18-2007, 02:09 PM

I am going to my dealer and check out the tires on the Montanas he has in stock. If they are Missions, I will not take delivery of my new Montana unless the tires are changed out for a better brand. Safety has to be Keystone's first concern, as it is mine and every responsible driver's. If it isn't, they need not be concerned with my business. Fixing a tire problem is easy! Buy proven quality. Pass on the cost. It will be a very small extra charge on the price of a new rig. Bad tires kill people, just ask Firestone. The reports here, in this forum, should be enough "evidence" to tell them they have a problem. Guys, Firestone's liability costs were nothing compared to the drop they suffered in market share. You want to keep boasting you are #1, fix it.

With regard to foreign products; As we have found out where I work, certain products from certain countries have very poor quality. Some buyer thought he was real smart and saved a bundle on chain we use on our navigational aids. Then we started getting premature failures. Our field people and their union invoked OSH regulations and refused to work with the product. We had the chain tested and more than 50% was substandard grade steel. It cost us mucho dinaro to change it out with good NA steel. Moral? A good price now can end up being a bad price down the road.

ole dude · 10-18-2007, 05:35 PM

The taste of poor quality remains long after the smell of low price---or something like that.

jeffwilliams1954 · 10-25-2007, 06:59 PM

Well, I hand wrote a letter to National Transportation Saftey Board, Attention: Office of Highway Safety at 490 L'Enfant Plaza, SW Washington DC 20594. They will not accept un-solicited e-mails through their website, you have to write them. I would suggest instead of just talking about here and other places to just do what I did. If they receive enough letters it will rise a concern. Maybe, just maybe, we can get them to do a recall with the Mission company. Keep your fingers crossed and do the same thing. Good Luck and be sure to check your tire pressures at every stop!

MacDR50 · 11-10-2007, 10:35 AM

Well I went to the dealer and yes they are Mission LoadMax tires on all the units. I looked at a customer's 3400 and there was a ridge along one tire's sidewall that didn't look normal to me. I talked to the manager and told him that when he goes to the big show in Goshen in January?? that he tell the Keystone people that I won't accept tires made by Nankang Rubber Co. I showed him the bad tire and he told me the unit was new this year. I suggested he read this post to get more information. He will give me steel tire stems for free.

12,000 lbs running down the road at 60 mph should be on good rubber.

Added on Edit.

The valve stems on the tires did not appear to be high pressure stems (chromed or brass tubes with hex nut caps). The used coach, the one with the bad tire, valve stems looked dried out with little cracks. I did some more research and discovered that some "Offshore" stems are made from natural rubber and age very quickly. This is the reason I asked for the steel tube stems for my new Montana. The cost is only about $2.50 a tire for the stems but it means demounting the tires. I will go with the snap in type. I do not know about the ones that have the inner mount (nut and lock nut). Lonnie can you give some advise on this?

exav8tr · 11-10-2007, 11:31 AM

Got notified yesterday that Tireco paid my claim for 4 new tires. They would not pay for the one that had a road hazard blowout and had been repaired, but paid for the others. $430.00. The check is in the mail to my Anchorage address. I know, the ole check is in the mail story.....We'll see on my next mail drop if they really came through...Claim has been in progress since Jul of this year. I guess my patience has paid off.

krtam · 11-11-2007, 06:59 AM

We had the same type of tire problems in August with our 2006 KEYSTONE Springdale. In the middle of Utah between Denver and San Diego a gas station attendant told us there was something wrong with one of our tires. At first we thought it might be a scam but upon closer inspection all the tires had bulges on them and needed to be replaced. We paid way to much money for the tires but what can you do? Kevin said he knew they were cheap tires but we didn't expect them to fall apart mid-trip. We thought the cheap tire issue was only on a entry level trailer, but now that we have our Montana on order we will have to address this issue, before we take delivery.

Thanks for the heads up,
Sharon

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