New battery question

[Waynem]

Tim,
I missed this thread the first time around. We could have had a good discussion at lunch last week.

Here is some information that may help you decide:

Lifespan Of Deep Cycle Batteries and other information you may wish to know.

[bill maietta]

quote:Originally posted by Carl n Susan

We have a 12V pump with a 7-Pin plug that we use to transfer water from the bladder to the RV when we dry camp. Here in Quartzsite, we have found two Dodge's with blown fuses in their charge circuits (which the owners were unaware of) and proved to several Ford owners (newer than 2002) that one has to have the ignition switch turned on before the circuit will work.

[pbahlin]

One thing to consider with respect to the TV charging your 'house' battery is that this is not the best charging method to assure long battery life. The TV is charging by tapping off the alternator which is just a 'dumb' DC power source and also a bit of a brute. You can easily cook a deep cycle battery with an alternator.

If you look at Trojan T105s they're around $160 now. So even a minimal boondocking system, say 4 of them, is going to mean you've got $600 or so tied up in your batteries. For that kind of money I want to be sure they only get charged with the best charge cycle possible. That means a three stage charge cycle.

I haven't done this myself yet (still designing it) but I'm leaning towards having the ability to isolate my T105s from the TV. I'll keep the cheapo battery that came with the rig connected as built (and to the TV). This will serve as a bare bones house battery, basically as delivered from the factory. My T105s would be charged only by a smart charger (Solar converter or Iota with IQ4) and would be switched over to house duty manually.

This is admittedly more complicated but it gives me two separate house systems, one cheapo and one pricey, that can back each other up in case Murphy's Law strikes.

I did this on a sailboat many years ago and it worked great. I always had a fresh reserve for those times when you hit the switch or turn the key and only hear clicking, groaning, and cursing.

[bill maietta]

ThanksPaul,
Sounds like one gets a heavy charge just driving down the road. Does the converter charge provide a three stage charge when hooked up to the CG power? Or, is also too much for a golf cart batt setup?

quote:Originally posted by bill maietta

[SlickWillie]

quote:Originally posted by pbahlin

One thing to consider with respect to the TV charging your 'house' battery is that this is not the best charging method to assure long battery life. The TV is charging by tapping off the alternator which is just a 'dumb' DC power source and also a bit of a brute. You can easily cook a deep cycle battery with an alternator.

If you look at Trojan T105s they're around $160 now. So even a minimal boondocking system, say 4 of them, is going to mean you've got $600 or so tied up in your batteries. For that kind of money I want to be sure they only get charged with the best charge cycle possible. That means a three stage charge cycle.

I haven't done this myself yet (still designing it) but I'm leaning towards having the ability to isolate my T105s from the TV. I'll keep the cheapo battery that came with the rig connected as built (and to the TV). This will serve as a bare bones house battery, basically as delivered from the factory. My T105s would be charged only by a smart charger (Solar converter or Iota with IQ4) and would be switched over to house duty manually.

This is admittedly more complicated but it gives me two separate house systems, one cheapo and one pricey, that can back each other up in case Murphy's Law strikes.

I did this on a sailboat many years ago and it worked great. I always had a fresh reserve for those times when you hit the switch or turn the key and only hear clicking, groaning, and cursing.

Alternator is just a "dumb" DC source? I suppose that is why the batteries on my truck lasted 5 1/2 years, and the Mountaineer battery lasted three and I constantly have to add water?

[pbahlin]

The batteries on a truck aren't being deep cycled so they aren't as sensitive to charge cycles. You would probably find that if you tried to use your truck battery for a house battery it wouldn't last a week.

House batteries are deep cycled unless you're the type of camper that is always connected. If that's the case then your trailer battery is never going down far at all. As long as you're connected to the CG your battery is getting charged from your AC converter and in this style of usage, the quick, shallow discharges your battery will experience do not stress it much at all.

If on the other hand you dry camp for an appreciable amount of time, your house batteries are going down to (ideally no more than) 50% of capacity and then back up, over prolonged periods of time. When they go back up you want to apply a three stage charge cycle to get the most out of the plates and also maximize the amount you store. Without the three stage charge you are never getting the fullest out of the batteries and can easily reduce their life.

You almost have to think of the truck battery (and its usage) and the house battery(s) (and their usage) as two entirely different types of systems that each demand different system designs. Unfortunately, out of expediency or cost considerations (or even a bit of both), manufacturers use a combo type of battery that isn't ideal for either application. This works for 'most' customers. Most customers don't dry camp for extended periods.

If you have a battery that has an Amp Hour rating alongside a CCA (cold cranking amps) rating, you are looking at such a compromise made by the manufacturer. You won't find CCA ratings on T105s cause they suck at cold cranking. Likewise, you shouldn't find Amp Hour ratings on your starter battery cause it will suck at providing Amps over time.

This is why I choose to have two battery systems; one for those quick shallow cycles most people experience while in and out of CGs, the other will be for deep cycling and it will never see the alternator.

My deep cycles will only see the converter in my solar system or the Iota with smart charge option. Both of these are 3 stage.

[pbahlin]

Re: Smart Charging in Montanna

My rig is a Big Sky and it came with an Iota bulk charger (70 amp I think). This is a 'dumb' charger with a smart charger option the way it was delivered to me. I understand some newer Big Skys have the smart charger option installed. I ordered the option called IQ4

If you don't have it you can order one from

http://www.altestore.com/store/Charg...s-Series/p703/

I have no idea if this is the bulk charger in other models. Check before you order because this is made specifically for the Iota DLS series of chargers.

If you're a camper who is always connected I wouldn't bother with this because your battery is never being seriously challenged and the standard equipment should perform just fine.

[pbahlin]

Constantly adding water is one of the signs of over charging I think. One of the advantages of the 3 stage charge cycle is that it charges in such a way that it minimizes water boil off.

[pbahlin]

Just reread my last posts and forgot to mention that I did sleep at a Holiday Inn once.




It was a long time ago.



Be gentle with me.

[drjjj]

When I started this post I stated that the rig is stationary for awhile with no external A/C source. From what I have read in these posts, would a good plan for me be to remove the battery and keep it on a trickle charger at my stick house and only put it in when using the trailer? Another question - would I be able to hook up the trailer, raise the landing jacks, and pull it to my stick house (without the battery installed) and then install the battery?

[Art-n-Marge]

Yes, you should be able to do this because 12v is being supplied by the TV. I wouldn't use the slides because of the amperage draw, but the lights and the landing gear should be good. Just keep the truck engine running to minimize battery drain with no recharging.

However, what I used to do is take the batteries with me every time when I went to go pick up the rig. Part of getting ready to hitch up the rig was putting the batteries back in the trailer before hitching up, then you don't have to worry about the TV's batteries with the RV batteries in place. In my opinion it's a good idea to minimize any problems with the TV batteries.

[drjjj]

I visited with our local Interstate Battery experts yesterday. My OEM battery was shot (no surprise). When I described my use of the rig his recommendation was to buy one of their deep cycle "normal" batteries and then go to the local sporting goods store marine department and buy a solar panel/trickle charger "kit" that boat owners put on their boat batteries. This will work out perfect for me because the rig is stored under cover with just the nose exposed. Someone on the list had previously posted that they had done something similar. Any suggestions on how to do a good job of mounting the solar panel to the front hitch would be greatly appreciated.