Water/ Wastewater Usage

[TheCoachPotatoes]

Since we would like to eventually do some boondocking, we have been giving a lot of thought to water conservation. I have an idea and wondered if anyone else has tried this. I would like to pump the gray water and use it to flush the toilet. It would help with water usage as well as water storage. I am thinking of installing a second pump taping into the grey water and a 3-way valve at toilet with check valve on original toilet feed line to keep from pumping back into fresh water system. Any thoughts would be appreciated!

Al

[Parrothead]

Al
A long time ago there was a blurb in Trailer Life from a guy that set up a special drain to collect the cold water to go into that runs while you are waiting for the hot water in the shower. That would also be a good way to conserve water when boon docking. To go one step further you could do the same at the kitchen sink and the lavatory sink.
Happy trails.......................

[Sweetfire]

That would save your fresh water if fresh water was the only concern, but now the problem becomes how much will the black tank hold before you have to dump. So if you have to move to a dump site you might as well get more fresh water.

[Montana_1240]

Sweetfire,

I'm assuming these folks would be keeping their flushing to a minimum, regardless of where the water came from. There have been threads about the various ways folks have utilized to hold that usage down.

We had a 2000 Gallon water tank at our brick & stick house in Fairbanks. (We were outside the utilities area when it was built,) and learned how to conserve a bit. We even bought a Swedish-designed washer and dryer that used very little water. Only needed cold water, at that. Heated its own while washing. I always hated to run the water until it got hot in the second floor master bath. It was all wasted.

I figure there'll always be easy ways to refill the fresh water for necessities...Even if it means skipping a shower. But one must really skimp when dealing with the black tank, unless there's a dump site right there.

Maybe that's one reason why we don't boondock that much.

Nah! It's because I wouldn't have my satellite TV or air conditioner!


Steve

[Sweetfire]

Gyro, your probably right. I'm one of those "count to 10 every time I flush" people. I tell Leona that she can't use too much water in the commode. I want everything to come out when it's time to empty the black tank.

[Countryfolks]

It might help to evaluate the level of boondocking you can/will do in a 40', 13k lb 5er, and what facilities would be available at those types of locations. We used to dry camp at a COE park that was closed part of the year, yet it was ok to camp there according to the patroling rangers. The dump, water to fill the fresh water tank and a pit toilet were available all year long. We could stay in place for about a week+ before dumping [minimal shower use in the trailor and a blue tank help]. You may well find the limiting factors are black and fresh water capacities, not grey/galley. Some locations allow you to empty the gray tank into a hole in the ground but that permission is decreasing all the time. You can probably dry camp for about 4-5 days with no changes to what is already installed.

Skip

Skip

[Montana_1240]

Sweetfire,

I was happy to know we had a septic tank installed for our old brick & stick home. And even though we had to buy the fresh water by the gallon, I didn’t much care for the old “If it’s yellow, let it mellow” stuff that dry camping pretty much demands.

I also like using loads of water to clear the bowl, here. And since we’re always hooked up, it’s no problem…But could be hard to break if we ever do get to a place where dumping isn’t readily available.



Skip,

That brings back memories of our early camping days. (After our use of a tent, I mean.) We had a Coachmen pop-up tent trailer with a sink, fridge, and porta-potty. When camping at some Canadian rustic areas, as well as some state, or federal campgrounds in Alaska, it was OK to let the gray water run out into a ditch. Come to think of it, I don’t believe that thing even had a gray tank!

I can imagine it’s still OK in some sites. I think I even recall stopping overnight at some places where they had sites without “Sewer” hook-ups, but regular gray water facilities. When we stopped by them, I never even bothered to hook anything but the water line up. Figured we could handle a day’s worth of gluttonous water use until we got to a “civilized” site.


Steve

[TheCoachPotatoes]

My point is that I would be conserving the fresh water. And since I am already using the gray water. Instead of using the fresh water up flushing the toilet, one could use the gray water. No water is wasted that way. The black tank will not fill up any faster as fresh water is being replaced by soapy water. Actually we are thinking of going to Quartsite at the time everyone else is going. From what I hear they will come and bring you water and pump you out, but who knows how often. This is just another adventure we want to try and thought our idea might work not only for us but for others as well.

Al

[Montana_1240]

Al,

Understood.

I was just thinking that fresh water, for coffee, etc., could also come out of bottles. Which could be gotten, no matter whether it takes a trip to a store or not.

But there is only so much room in the black tank. That's where I know I'd have a problem conserving, since I've developed bad habits based on being a full service sites all the time.

Your idea does sound good, too.

When we were contemplating water usage at brick & stick home, I was told that several folks who were up there, off-grid, had developed ways to route downspouts to barrles for use in ways gray water would also come in handy. I often wished I had managed to get such a system so we could water our lawn.

Then, of course, after having to mow it a couple times a week in the spring and early summer, (due to all that seasonal moisture and sunshine in Fairbanks,) I didn't feel too bad when the grass started going brown later in the summers!


Steve

[Countryfolks]

The idea is probably ok, If the used water had a separate connection at the john it would be more acceptable to me. Things go wrong sometimes. I just can't live with the idea of a used water line being directly connected with the fresh [to me drinking] water line.

Skip

[OntMont]

Our experience boondocking is that we run out of fresh water long before we have to dump. Roughly, it seems to work out to something like this:
Fresh water: 2 days.
Grey tanks: (combining the two tanks): 4 days.
Black tank: 8 days.

Re-using the grey water to flush is probably do-able with a bit of plumbing, and an extra pump.

I have always wanted to find a way to recirculate the hot water supply to the bathroom back to the fresh water tank, until it warms up. So far I have not given it enough priority to actually work out how to do it. We don't boondock that much, but if you were seriously into boondocking, that would save some fresh water (and a bit of propane).

Interesting idea, keep us posted on how it works out.

[315RLS]

quote:Originally posted by TheCoachPotatoes

My point is that I would be conserving the fresh water. And since I am already using the gray water. Instead of using the fresh water up flushing the toilet, one could use the gray water. No water is wasted that way. The black tank will not fill up any faster as fresh water is being replaced by soapy water. Actually we are thinking of going to Quartsite at the time everyone else is going. From what I hear they will come and bring you water and pump you out, but who knows how often. This is just another adventure we want to try and thought our idea might work not only for us but for others as well.

Al

Al, We only boondock and always need to dump the black water first. This is being as conservative in all water use as possible. Others may have different experiences but I couldn't see how any cross-over approaches would buy us anything. You may want to see how it balances out for you before bothering. As far as pump out services, we've never had a problem with the water brought in although we would always prefer to only use our well water that we fill. When concerned about this we use bottled water from the time we were filled onward for drinking.

[rickety]

Al and Gyro, I used to have an old VW Van that I fixed up for camping with my wife and young sons when we lived in Alaska. We ran all over that State, or as much as we could and I had a porta potty, and a little fresh water tank in it that held about 10 gallons. If we were going to be some where, like the headwaters of the Kenai, We would haul river water to dring and cook with and save the fresh fresh water for the baby. Loved that old Van, put 14000 miles on it camping in Alaska, bought it for 25.00 rebuilt it used for 3-4 years and sold it for $1000. Of course this was back in my late 60's-early 70's days. Was painted with stars and stripes and flowers that my wife put on.
The idea of recycling the gray water to flush with will work, and will work well, you wouldn't even have to put a large pump on it, just something to put enough water to flush with in the bowl, draw directly from the grey water tank.

[Parrothead]

Rick
Are you a retired "Hippy". I remember those VW buses well. Stars and Stripes!!!
Happy trails.......................

[rickety]

Ed, Who me? Not realy a hippie, just got tired of life for a while after "The VietNam Experience" and tried to lose myself in booze and
God's Church (the outdoors). Kind of mixed up back then, but I sure loved that Van!!! I've owned VW's off and on for most of the last 40 years. A great vehicle, easy to work on and they could climb like billy goats is you set em up right.

[TheCoachPotatoes]

Thanks everyone for your input. Whenever we go someplace without full hookups, we seem to fill up the grey tanks first! Everyone is different, what works for one may not for someone else. We do always bring bottled water for drinking. It's mainly the showers that use up the fresh water. That's why we were thinking of recycling the gray water and getting extra use that way. We would under no circumstance infiltrate the fresh water because we would install a check valve to insure this won't happen.

[315RLS]

quote:Originally posted by TheCoachPotatoes

It's mainly the showers that use up the fresh water. That's why we were thinking of recycling the gray water and getting extra use that way.

We find the on-off switch on the shower-head to be great to help save water.

[Montana_1240]

Rick,

That van sounds pretty much the same as how our pop-up trailer worked!

And I bet we went to a couple of the same places you may have been in! I always felt like I was someplace that no one had ever trod, just driving a few feet off the road up there.

Mainly because of that, I know what you mean by "God's Church."

Al,

You have the right idea, for sure. And our gray tank is constantly being drained, each day. We might be able to get a third shower into it, but that's the limit. The shower tub's always starting to fill on the fourth shower.


315RLS,

I have used that shower cut-off valve a lot on the outside shower head, when washing the dogs. I tend not to use it inside, though, because it's hard to get out of the way when I turn them back on and feel that blast of cold water. The shower's almost too small to get out of the way in!

Though, if we couldn’t dump for two days, I’m sure I’d deal with the inconvenience.

I still wonder why that happens, even though it may only be off for a few seconds....

Steve

[CountryGuy]

Gyro/Steve

We turn our shower faucet off too, and understand the problem you describe. One way to handle it is to unhook the entire faucet and hose from that little hose guide thing. Unscrew the screws holding that little round thingy, get the hose OUT of that thing, put the thing back on the wall, use a little silicone caulk when you put it back on, fill holes with caulk, you know the routine.

Now you have

1.) that little hose thingy just sitting there, waiting for a use, Al found a great one, lets me use it to put my shaver!! never bounces out, over 4000 miles and never bounced out!

2.) You now have the shower head that will move ALL around the shower stall, you can lower it wayyyyyy down to wash yorkies (wanna help??) or you can take it off,let it dangle, turn the water off while you soap up and then hold in your hand, direct the spray away from you while you turn it back on and get that little chilly blast. once blast is over, you can hang back up or whatever. Frequently I do entire showers with out hanging back up.

I think taking the hose out of that silly holder thingy was one of the first things Al did when we got Tana home. Prior TT same story, silly holder, very constraining.

[Montana_1240]

Carol,

That sounds like a great idea.

I dunno if I’d wanna put our Canine-American children into the tub, or not. But I do know that it’d be nice to be able to move that showerhead around a bit more for when I’m cleaning the glass off and want to rinse better. 40 pounds of pressure does not allow the stream to get all the way up the surfaces!

When I do have to shut it off with that valve, I have been holding it in my hand to deflect the chilly blast. It hasn’t been too bad, lately, though, since even the cold water seems to run at about bath water temperatures, due to the near 100 degrees we’ve been dealing with.

But since I dump the gray tank daily, it doesn’t get shut off for long, or frequently.


Steve