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Old 07-09-2009, 04:10 AM   #21
sreigle
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Thanks, Art. I was not aware of that. That's a new one on me.
 
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Old 07-09-2009, 11:41 AM   #22
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We just bought a new to us 07 with the 6.7 and 6speed auto with very low miles. I also bought the extended warranty and I no longer worry about an apropriate gear to tow with. With our old truck 98.5 I never towed in OD and just let it rev up to around 3k.
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Old 07-16-2009, 08:16 AM   #23
sreigle
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Art-n-Marge
[I was getting confused so a quick check of the integrated brake offered on the Cummins turbodiesel is an EXHAUST brake not a JAKE brake. It is standard on dodge 3500 with a Cummins turbodiesel, but an option on the 2500 with a Cummins turbodiesel.
I didn't think this was correct about the exhaust brake being an option on the Dodge 2500 with Cummins as I'd been told by the dealer that all Dodge trucks with the 6.7L Cummins come standard with the exhaust brake.

So, I just went to the Dodge site and did the "build your own." The exhaust brake is STANDARD on the 2500 as well as the 3500, as I thought.
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Old 07-16-2009, 08:27 AM   #24
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Steve, I just was on the Dodge website where the 6.7L description list showed exhaust brake as an O (option) for the exhaust brake and S (standard) for 3500. I was surprised to see that and also read somewhere else that a Dodge 2500 owner was considered having the option enabled on their 6.7L and was asking advice.

It's just like websites to show conflicting information. Here's a link that implies an option on 2500 and there are others:

http://www.dodge.com/en/2009/ram_250...ty/powertrain/

That being the case, it doesn't make any sense for anyone to purchase an exhaust brake for a new Dodge with a 6.7L from any aftermarket company. To me, getting it from the manufacturer is always better for something like this.
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Old 07-16-2009, 08:34 AM   #25
sreigle
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Art, try the build your own link on the Dodge website. Build your truck. There is no option listed for an exhaust brake. However, when you finish the build, the "sticker" list shows the exhaust brake as "included."
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Old 07-16-2009, 08:39 AM   #26
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I was perusing the "build my own" part of the website and it does imply selecting a 6.7L engine will get you the exhaust brake, however it also has a list of axles to select (3.73, 3.42, and 4.10) and a statement, "A numerically lower axle ratio results in lower engine rpm and better fuel economy. A numerically higher ratio improves acceleration, climbing grades, carrying loads or pulling a trailer.", but isn't this statement wrong, in that the numerics are opposite of what it should state?

Sounds like there is a lot of contrary information coming out of the Dodge website. The web admins must have been the first to go at Chrysler Motors.
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Old 07-16-2009, 08:55 AM   #27
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A 4.10 axle is numerically higher than a 3.73 and thus their statement is correct. However, if talking "higher ratio" rather than "numerically higher ratio," then a 3.73 is a higher ratio than a 4.10. I hope that makes sense.

Everything I've been told by our selling dealer is that the exhaust brake is standard with the Cummins regardless whether a 2500 or 3500. I do not know about the 4500 and up. The Dodge truck site supports that also. Anyhow, the only reason I brought it up is I don't want a prospective Dodge diesel customer reading this thread to think they would have to pay extra for the exhaust brake. They don't. I know it can be confusing.
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Old 07-16-2009, 09:03 AM   #28
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Art-n-Marge



"A numerically lower axle ratio results in lower engine rpm and better fuel economy. A numerically higher ratio improves acceleration, climbing grades, carrying loads or pulling a trailer.", but isn't this statement wrong, in that the numerics are opposite of what it should state?
The Dodge Web site is correct. A ratio of 3.73:1 means the driveshaft turns 3.73 times for every one turn of the wheels. A 4.10 ratio requires more turns of the driveshaft (aka RPMs) to achieve the same one wheel rotation.
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Old 07-16-2009, 01:20 PM   #29
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Art: If I'm looking at the correct site per your URL link posting -- the 'Optional' that they are speaking about is that the cummins engine is standard in the 3500 series while the Hemi gas engine is the standard engine in the 2500 series; you can 'optionally' upgrade to the 6.7L diesel engine in the 2500 series.

Now, that said, all of the 6.7L come standard with the 'Variable Geometry' turbos. The literature 'strongly' recommends that you always run with the exhaust brake function (the button) turned on as it reduces sooting up of the turbo shaft which is a major problem for all 3 truck makers during the past few years. When you back off the accelerator, the variable vanes close somewhat, restricting the exhaust flow. Take your foot off all the way and hit the brake (and be in Tow-Haul Mode) and the transmission will downshift through the gears as your speed slows down, until about 15 to 20 mph when the torque converter unlocks. This is designed to help you slow down and, as mentioned earlier, can actually slow you down without touching your brakes at all (as I just experienced coming North through Raton Pass on I-25 a week ago...)

Sure saves on the brakes. Now, that said, engine RPM does go up, sometimes quite significantly, as the transmission downshifts. According to both the Dodge and Cummins websites, the engine is designed to withstand the higher, UNPOWERED, rpms without any problems -- in fact, best braking action from the exhaust brake is at the higher RPMs. The transmission logic will upshift (and will actually prevent downshifting) if the RPMs will be too high.

So, bottom line -- use the exhaust brake all the time (even in town driving where not prohibited by local law officials -- it will significantly reduce your CEL and turbo cleaning trips to the dealer); use Tow-haul mode (I use mine constantly -- in fact I recently asked if that could be made the default when I start the truck, it currently is not part of the programming ), and drive the new trucks with the 'Diesel Particulate Filters' on long enough trips to ensure that they keep that soot under control in the DPF! (Hot running, and long enough to burn it off are the requirements..)

Sorry for the long post but Hope this helps.
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Old 07-16-2009, 01:34 PM   #30
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Sreigle & Carl n Susan... thanks for that. I read it wrong. It's funny, I must have read it three times and still read it wrong. Reading it now, it makes perfect sense. I'll attribute it to not enough coffee this morning.

Skypilot, as for the link, this is the link for the 6.7L diesel, not the gasoline engine, so they are referring to the diesel engine availability and not the exhaust brake option. Got it.
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Old 07-16-2009, 03:02 PM   #31
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Art, on that link you provided, click on "handling and suspension" and then scroll down a bit. On the right is a section titled "Brakes." Here's what it says there...

Braking power

A truck as big and powerful as Ram needs large brakes. Huge calipers and rotors (up to 13.9 inches) contribute to stopping power and your peace of mind. Ram 2500 and 3500 with the Cummins® Turbo Diesel engine are the only trucks in their class with a standard integrated exhaust brake for reduced brake fade and increased stopping power.

The section where you see the exhaust brake listed as an option also isn't listing features for diesel trucks alone. It's for all trucks of that model and trim level, including gas engines.

So, let's put this one to rest.

To whoever started this thread, I'm sorry we hijacked your thread. We got a bit out of control. Sorry.
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Old 07-16-2009, 05:27 PM   #32
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Skypilot the info you provided explained the exhaust system on the 6.7 perfectly. I might add that Cummins installs the exhaust brakes at the Cummins factory on all the 6.7 motors they ship for the 2500. Dodge might have it listed as a option to hook them up as was the case on my 2007.5 Ram 2500. Thanks again for all the feed back it helps. I would not like to do something to the tranny on my tow vehicle.
Larry in "hot" Olympia
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Old 07-16-2009, 06:23 PM   #33
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I also have a Dodge, mine is a 2005, and a 4 speed automatic, not the 6 speed. First, the 6th gear is operating with the torque converter locked, you will not cause heat problems towing in high gear. On mine I tow in overdrive, 4th gear except in hill type areas, when your in overdrive with the exhaust brake turned on and want to slow down, just hit the tow haul button, it will drop into 5th, and stay there, the exhaust brakes work best at a little higher rpm, 2000-2500 with the exhaust brake it makes slowing down very nice, when your on those rolling hills, and it wants to down shift to 5th, just run it tow haul and leave it there. The Dodge, as do all Diesels, run there best towing at the max torque, I don't know what your 6.7 is listed at, but my 5.9 is 1650 rpm's, I find if I am at or just above that number the towing works the best, I hope this helps, Ron
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Old 07-17-2009, 03:52 AM   #34
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Skypilot wrote:
So, bottom line -- use the exhaust brake all the time (even in town driving where not prohibited by local law officials -- it will significantly reduce your CEL and turbo cleaning trips to the dealer); use Tow-haul mode (I use mine constantly -- in fact I recently asked if that could be made the default when I start the truck, it currently is not part of the programming ), and drive the new trucks with the 'Diesel Particulate Filters' on long enough trips to ensure that they keep that soot under control in the DPF! (Hot running, and long enough to burn it off are the requirements..)
I have 3 questions about this:
1. Is the now-standard exhaust brake ("Jacobs" branded or otherwise) prohibited, or is it the "real" Jake brake (having plumbing around the cylinders) that is usually prohibited (realizing that interpretation may vary from town to town)? I actually have no idea about how loud our Duramax is when going down a hill in tow/haul mode, except that it's not nearly as loud as OTR trucks using their Jake brakes.
2. The Sierra's programming detects the connection of the Monty, launches the brake controller and suppresses the back-up assist sensor annunciation. It would be a no-brainer to engage the tow/haul, too.
3. How does one use/engage the DPF?
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Old 07-17-2009, 09:29 AM   #35
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Ron, for the 6.7L Cummins, peak torque is at 1500 rpm. Peak HP is at 3013 rpm.
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Old 07-17-2009, 02:59 PM   #36
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Engine brakes are prohibited as opening the exhaust valves causes the noise. Exhaust brake are not as noisy so it should be allowed.
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Old 07-18-2009, 10:03 AM   #37
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I used to turn it off when I saw those signs. Then I realized our exhaust brake is no louder, in fact is quieter, than many of the regular vehicles on the road as they decrease speed. Many vehicles have mufflers louder than our exhaust brake. I no longer shut it off when I see those signs. We have several times approached the Kansas (and other state) toll booths with exhaust brake on while towing and have never had any indication that anyone knew it was on. So I no longer worry about it.
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Old 07-18-2009, 10:24 AM   #38
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We have the PAC brake on our FL it work off the air system and is very quite. It has two different settings HI/LO and it stays in one or the other, it saves a lot of braking and of course we have the 3000 series Allison and everyone who owns a GM Truck is aware of the Allison. However unless I am towing the 5th wheel I don't use the PAC brake on wet roads. GBY....
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Old 07-18-2009, 11:00 AM   #39
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Most or all of the signs I have seen say, "Use of unmuffled exhaust brakes prohibited."
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Old 07-20-2009, 10:47 AM   #40
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I tried an experiment that seems to work: On the flats, disengage tow/haul, then re-engage a couple of seconds later and carry on. What happened for me was the revs dropped from about 1900 to below 1500 when I disengaged T/H, but didn't go back up when I re-engaged it. When I came to the next hill, up or down, the T/H did its job as usual. Meanwhile the revs were low, the Duramax was purring and, I believe, the fuel economy was better. I think that the lower speed made best use of the torque, but an engine/transmission expert may say otherwise.

On edit: cruise control was on for all of this, maintaining speed.
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