Frame Flex dealer inspection

[Desert RVer]

I have been having some discussions with Montana Customer Service relative to front frame flex of our 2006 Montana 5th wheel where the right front side panel is moving up and down relative to the corner horizontal trim pieces. Due to this I am unable to keep the seam sealed with caulking.

Keystone will now pay for a dealer inspection of this but with no guarantees of paying for needed repairs. The dealer is over an hour away and I'm a bit concerned about going through all this expense and hassle and then have Keystone not pay for repairs. Anyone have any suggestions about how I could get more of a commitment to pay for the expense of the repairs from Keystone/Montana?

[wingerphil]

Not sure I have an answer for you but was in the same boat. We had ours back at the factory for other smaller issues and they noticed the bedroom wall was moving from the trim piece. They took the front cap off and trim pieces off and re-inforced the wall with longer (and more) screws and bracing. The frame itself was not the issue but where the aluminum studs for the wall attach to the frame was coming loose. The repair only took one day and have no problems since.
I guess the point of the story is that Keystone is aware of the issue and had no problem repairing mine even though it was out of warranty. I'm not sure if being at the factory service center made any difference or not. If you want information on the repair, Darryl at the Keystone Service Center is the man to call.
Hope this helps you some.

Phil

[richfaa]

Same problem with our 06 3400 last year. The problem is identified as such.

When the camper is standing on its own weight ..that is off the truck you will see separation along one or the other side of the overhang right above the molding. Mine was more that 1.2 inch wide.

When the pin weight is on the truck the separation will disappear .

THIS IS not FRAME FLEX,,, The gel coat siding is framed with aluminum ..I think one by ones and it has broken loose from the siding. The siding is moving up and down and it has nothing to do with the frame. Without Keystone seeing the camper they are trying to determine exactly what then problem is. Pictures would help. keystone saw mine at the fall rally and authorized repair.

Remember Darrell does NOT authorize repair..he does the repair.

[Desert RVer]

Not sure I understand the objection of "frame flex" designation. I agree that the siding and the internal aluminum framing (one by ones) are no longer moving together. Now I don't think the siding is providing the strength of the overhang so I suspect the aluminum frame inside is supposed to be providing the internal structural strength. Something is flexing and I suspect it is the aluminum wall framing and therefore I am calling it "frame flex". I don't see how the gel coat siding could move if the aluminum framing isn't moving.

Our wall is not moving nearly as much as you have described on your 3400RL. I would estimate ours as 3/8" to 1/2" of movement. I am concerned about what is causing this but I'm equally concerned about Keystone/Montana not taking responsibility for it and repairing it at their expense.

[8.1al]

I don't think you can blame Keystone for not agreeing to pay for something they know nothing about. They have asked you to take it to a dealer for inspection and have asked for pictures so that they have a better idea just what the problem is. I know it's can be frustrating but give them a chance

[Desert RVer]

8.1al

I don't recall blaming Keystone/Montana for anything and I don't recall mentioning that they have asked for pictures. So I don't fully understand where you are coming from in your response.

Our side panel is sliding up and down relative to the trim apparently while in transit as opposed to showing the huge difference that richfaa has mentioned when hooked up to the hitch vs the pin box not putting weight on the hitch of the truck. At least I haven't noticed it slide up and down based on whether there is weight on the pin box or not. My present guess is the flexing occurs while traveling down the road. I also haven't noticed anything amiss inside. It is probably obvious that I don't fully understand what is going on. I do know it shouldn't be happening. Whether Montana agrees with that is yet to be determined. It just seems to me that if any sliding of the panel vs the trim occurs it would be obviously something that is structurally wrong and Montana would admit it is something that needs to be fixed at their expense. I guess I won't really know until I bring it in to the dealer. I just wish there was a closer dealer.

[8.1al]

Sorry about the pics, I got you confused with someone else. You DID say however that Keystone has agreed to pay a dealer to inspect your 4 yr. old trailer and you are blaming Keystone for not committing to pay for a problem they know nothing about till it is inspected. Keystone has no idea who you,I, or anyone else is and what their experience, credentials are so the dealer is their go between. Once the dealer makes a report and yes maybe sends pictures then Keystone will have a better idea what the problem is and hopefully then they will make a commitment to you. As I stated before I know this can be frustrating and it's hard to be patient but give em a chance

[wingerphil]

Desert RVer,

The "movement" they pointed out on mine appeared to be very small as well. They noticed that the lower trim piece on the bottom of the bedroom wall (outside) had scraped the wall up and down about 1/8" to 1/2" on about the front 1/3 of the wall. As soon as Darryl at the service center saw this he had the techs tear into the front end to investigate and ended up doing the repair as I stated above.
I guess your only choice at this time is to have the dealer look at it and report their findings to Keystone. Not sure if you are having the same issue that Rich and I had but it sure sounds similier. Perhaps your dealer has run into the same problem on other units as well and can shed some light on the repairs.

Good luck,

Phil

[Desert RVer]

Thanks wingerphil,

The movement you describe is what I am observing on ours. Hopefully the local dealer will have some experience with this issue. Was not impressed with this dealer when we purchased originally so purchased elswhere. Will not go back to original dealer. It is a Camping World facility as well. Not sure if this is good or not. We have had more than our fair share of problems with this unit so am a bit tired of having to go through this kind of hassle again.

[richfaa]

My movement was 1/2 inch. The frame flex problem was in the early model years and was actually welds in the frame breaking. Take a look at the camper when it is free standing..is there a separation.
Take a look hooked to the truck...does the separation go away.

You may call it frame flex but it is NOT the frame flex issue that Keystone knows about and will miss lead them in effecting a repair.
They will need to have a qualified person look at it and identify the problem
Keystone DID repair my issue at their expense when they were able to identify what the issue really was. Yes it is obvious that something is structurally wrong and they need to find out exactly what is wrong before they can fix it. the "Frame flex" issue is a entirely different problem.

"I don't see how the gel coat siding could move if the aluminum framing isn't moving. " You are correct. Most likely the aluminum framing IS moving..but that is NOT the frame flex problem and that is what Keystone is attempting to find out...

[Desert RVer]

richfaa,

Ok, now I understand the problem with using the term "frame flex" since it has a previous and specific meaning due to prior Montana problems. How about it if I call this bedroom sidewall flex? The only indication I can observe is the outside gelcoat wall is sliding up and down vs the horizontal trim piece. And is noticed by the line on the gelcoat wall where it has occasionally moved lower than the normal position and the broken sealant due to the movement. I'm finding this hard to describe with words at the moment. It is immediately obvious when looking at the wall vs horizontal trim mating area under the master bedroom overhang.

[awaywego]

I had , I think, the same problem last year with my unit. When I had it hooked to the truck the trim with the vinyl insert would drop where it turned and went down to the front leg.
I dropped the front under the bedroom and looked for a broken frame but found all was OK. I hooked it back to the truck and watched as the weight came down.
On the side of the frame the factory spot welds a 1 1/2 inch angle the full length and then sets the 2 inch outside wall on the angle. They then run 4 or 5 inch self tapping screws through the angle then through the aluminum frame of the wall. Several of the bolts had backed out and was letting the front of the sidewall bounce and had broken the spot welds on the frame.
I called a welder and he came over and welded the angle in several places then I took the loose screws out and reinstalled then in new holes so they would tighten.
I hope this helps and I hope this is you problem and not a broken frame.

[richfaa]

Just describe the problem in detail with pictures and send it to Keystone or have a dealer look at it. Sounds like awaywego has the problem outlined. In addition to his fix Keystome put some supporting gussets on each side of the hitch. Call it anything you wish.