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12-03-2020, 06:41 AM
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#1
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Jacksonville
Posts: 382
M.O.C. #21993
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Back flushing grey into black?
I saw the below statement about this in another thread and thought it would be useful to see what others think and how you go about it.
"I backflush the shower grey water into the black tank and it flushes everything out".
__________________
I was once intelligent beyond my years. Now, I’m years beyond my intelligence.
2020 Montana 3561 Legacy, everything except paint.
2018 Silverado 3500 DRW, 50Gal Transfer Flow, Andersen hitch.
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12-03-2020, 06:48 AM
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#2
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Montana Master
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Florence
Posts: 945
M.O.C. #20472
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I have no idea who that’s possible, all your tanks tie in at a different point on the 3” main drain pipe.
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2018 Ram 3500 MegaCab 4x4 Aisin, 4:10 Gears
Titan 50 Gal Tank, Air Lift Wireless Bags
2017 3160 RL
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12-03-2020, 06:53 AM
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#3
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Jacksonville
Posts: 382
M.O.C. #21993
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I am just guessing here, I really nave no idea for sure but dumping the black leaving it opened, close the main dump valve and open a gray valve???
__________________
I was once intelligent beyond my years. Now, I’m years beyond my intelligence.
2020 Montana 3561 Legacy, everything except paint.
2018 Silverado 3500 DRW, 50Gal Transfer Flow, Andersen hitch.
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12-03-2020, 07:16 AM
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#4
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Montana Master
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Alton
Posts: 2,703
M.O.C. #24086
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You buy a Valterra twist on waste valve.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Valterra-...Valve/55356052
Dump your black tank. Close the Valterra gate valve. Open your grey tank 1 valve. Count to 30. Close the grey tank valve. Let it sit for a few minutes. Open the gate valve.
You can repeat this 2 times with each grey tank. Save enough in your grey tank 1 to flush the pipe.
Now use your black tank flush system to finish it off.
I keep my Valterra gate valve on permanently. Its great to prevent surprises when take your cap off.
Edit:
This last winterizing, I pulled in the slides, retracted the Level Up then raised the front up as high as it would go. I was really surprised how much more stuff came out of all 3 tanks.
__________________
Daryl and Marianne,
2019 3130re 20th Anniversary Edition
2016 F350 Lariat
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12-03-2020, 07:37 AM
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#5
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Montana Master
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Sebring
Posts: 3,659
M.O.C. #9969
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Would all depend on tank locations. My Black and Gray are in the drop down frame section, while my Galley is up in the belly, thus my Galley is 10" higher than either my Gray or Black. But I just use my Black Tank flusher, multiple flushes.
__________________
Michelle & Ann
2018 Chevy 3500HD High Country DRW 4X4 Crew Cab w/Duramax/Allison, Formally 2010 Montana 2955RL, Now Loaded 2016 SOB, Mor/ryde IS, Disc Brakes & Pin Box, Comfort Ride Hitch, Sailun 17.5 Tires.
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12-03-2020, 07:41 AM
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#6
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Montana Master
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Hixson
Posts: 3,436
M.O.C. #11397
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daryles
You buy a Valterra twist on waste valve.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Valterra-...Valve/55356052
Dump your black tank. Close the Valterra gate valve. Open your grey tank 1 valve. Count to 30. Close the grey tank valve. Let it sit for a few minutes. Open the gate valve.
You can repeat this 2 times with each grey tank. Save enough in your grey tank 1 to flush the pipe.
Now use your black tank flush system to finish it off.
I keep my Valterra gate valve on permanently. Its great to prevent surprises when take your cap off.
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This is spot on and I have done it this way MANY times with success. The Valterra twist on will eliminate surprises any time whether you do this or not.
__________________
2018.5 Montana 3791RD
Full Timers 9/1/2010 through 1/16/2020.
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12-03-2020, 07:44 AM
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#7
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Hagerstown
Posts: 866
M.O.C. #16013
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mUSt bE spECial
all you need is the valve below everyone should have this on their camper any way it prevents those little surprises when you take the cover cap off your 3" drain pipe. All gate vales will leak at some point and leave a mess for the next camper, sometimes right at the fresh water valve....YUK
What I do, a day before we leave I close the gray tank valve and let the gray tank fill up on moving day last thing I do is dump the black tank until empty, then close your new external vale and open the the gray tank valve this back flushes the black tank with about 30 gallons of gray water then open your new external valve to complete. You would be surprised how much "stuff" is left in the black tank after you do a normal dump routine.
The flusher for the black tank that came with the unit never really did anything worth messing with. I also found if you raise the front of the camper to max height while doing this a lot more comes out as the tank exists are in the back of the tanks. YMMV
https://tweetys.com/camco-39050-read...r-adapter.aspx
__________________
2018.5 3791 Rear Den Montana, on the lake no 3rd A/C, Mini Split, just do it
Electric Brakes ..... Disk Brakes, it`s the only way
F350 Ford Dually 4:10`s w/bags (payload 5595 lbs) Sumo Springs 63 gal aux tank
Reese Goosebox Mor/Ryde SRE 4000 X Factors Monroe shocks.... real smooth ride
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12-03-2020, 08:16 AM
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#8
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: McKinney
Posts: 7,171
M.O.C. #6433
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As far as the back flushing, there was a video posted here some time ago of someone doing a test of how well back flushing compared to using the black tank flush sprayer. In the test he built a clear tank and used one of the external shutoff valves with a hose connection to push water back into the tank. The back flush valve helped clean the tank, but left a lot of stuff. Just wasn't enough agitation to stir up the solids in the tank. The standard flush sprayer head did a much better job.
__________________
Bill & Patricia
Riley, our Golden
2007 3075RL (recently sold, currently without)
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12-03-2020, 09:58 AM
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#9
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 2,318
M.O.C. #17894
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If when using the tank flush, you close the valve and let it fill up for a few minutes or so then open the valve and do it several times, it gets it pretty cleaned out. It is after all a waste tank, there is no need to get it sparkling clean.
__________________
2018 Chevy 3500 LTZ Dually Diesel 4x4 CCLB
2011 Montana 3455 SA. 6 point level up. Disc brakes. Curt Q24 Hitch. 5 step glow steps
Progressive EMS. Valterra tank valves. Sailun G637 tires. ARP fridge control. All led lighting. Mor Ryde IS
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12-03-2020, 12:28 PM
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#10
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Anderson
Posts: 2,596
M.O.C. #22835
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beeje
...It is after all a waste tank, there is no need to get it sparkling clean.
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I've been using one of these Flush King style valves on 3 different trailers now. How many "back flushes" does it take to get the black tank "sparkling clean?" Answer ..... 15.
Every year, this is part of my winterizing process, to clean the holding tanks as much as possible. I can do this at home, with the ability to dump and to add water is no problem.
One year, I decided to REALLY clean out the black tank. So I kept adding water to the shower drain, filling up the grey tank. I can back flush 3, sometimes 4 times with a full shower water grey tank. And that year I took photos of every flush so I could actually see the water get clearer and clearer. It was 15 back flushes before clear water came out of the black tank.
This year, I back flushed 3 times. I then used a toilet wand. And I also used the black tank flusher system. I used approximately 150 gallons of water to flush out the tank till water ran clear.
How do I know how much water I ran? I dump into my 32 gallon Barker Blue Tote and dump it in my septic tank. It took 5 trips to the septic tank and the tote was full each time.
For those who say all you need to do is fill your tank and dump and you are good, you really should try back flushing with the 3rd attached valve. The first time you do, and you see how much MORE "stuff" comes out of your black tank, you WILL be a believer and never feel comfortable again, just dumping once and running!
__________________
Who you are right now is a sum total off all you use to be.
2019 Montana High Country 375FL
2014 Chevy Silverado Duramax, 6.6L Dually
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12-03-2020, 03:40 PM
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#11
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 2,318
M.O.C. #17894
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I stand my statement that it is NOT necessary to get the tanks sparking clean. I suppose if the OCD in you wants that to happen, knock yourself out. While your at it, you better stock up on grease so you can repack the bearings before each trip. LOL
__________________
2018 Chevy 3500 LTZ Dually Diesel 4x4 CCLB
2011 Montana 3455 SA. 6 point level up. Disc brakes. Curt Q24 Hitch. 5 step glow steps
Progressive EMS. Valterra tank valves. Sailun G637 tires. ARP fridge control. All led lighting. Mor Ryde IS
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12-03-2020, 04:41 PM
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#12
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: McKinney
Posts: 7,171
M.O.C. #6433
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Using the flush connection I partially fill and drain my black tank 3-4 times. I don’t care about completely clean water. With the clear extension I just watch for most of the solid materials to stop coming out, or at least down to very few.
__________________
Bill & Patricia
Riley, our Golden
2007 3075RL (recently sold, currently without)
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12-04-2020, 04:52 AM
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#13
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Jacksonville
Posts: 2,141
M.O.C. #25165
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The main reason for back flushing for me is a failed attempt to get the tank sensors working again. The very next time the tank is used, it reads full again with even a small piece of tissue touching a sensor. The best solution is to flush until solids are removed and use an enzyme or happy camper solution to keep down on the sludge that clogs the system and creates a smell.
I still back flush religiously every few months just because we are part time and some trips the tank gets full, other trips only half way. Flushing with a full tank of water several times ensures that any tissue or other matter is removed from the tank.
Also, it's easier to get the stuff out BEFORE it dries and sticks than after. YMMV.
__________________
Robert & Diana McNeal
2019 Montana Legacy 3791RD 20th Anniversary Edition
2014 F350 4x4 6.7L SRW
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12-04-2020, 06:43 AM
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#14
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Anderson
Posts: 2,596
M.O.C. #22835
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Just for a bit of clarity, I do not flush my tanks till they run perfectly clear every time. When normal camping, I attempt to do 3 back-flushes. When sitting at a dump station the last thing you want to do is spend more time than necessary there, holding others up.
Back flushing doesn't take any more time to do than dumping both the grey and black alone, except maybe a minute or two at the most. It does take about 10-15 seconds for the grey tank to flush backwards into the black tank. But then the actual dumping is the same length of time. If you do this 3 times, the extra time it takes is, probably 45 seconds to a minute longer than dumping both separately.
The only time I'm anal about flushing the tanks clear is when I winterize. Why? because my tanks are empty over the winter months and anything left in the tanks will dry hard. So, any residue left on the walls, or even the top of the tank from sloshing when driving will dry hard over the winter months. Once things start drying hard, it doesn't take much for more and more to cling to it.
During Summer usage, the tanks are used every day. They are always wet. Things in, things out. There's no opportunity for any residue to dry hard on the sides. But when the trailer is not in use, and a constant stuff-in, stuff-out, any residue is a future problem waiting to happen.
About the above comment. I was just responding about how much it does take to get the tank "sparkling clean". I think I've tried just about everything imaginable with all my campers, looking for the best and easiest way to do things. But that also means, I don't do it that way every time.
__________________
Who you are right now is a sum total off all you use to be.
2019 Montana High Country 375FL
2014 Chevy Silverado Duramax, 6.6L Dually
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12-09-2020, 02:25 PM
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#15
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Seasoned Camper
Join Date: Dec 2019
Location: Dryden
Posts: 93
M.O.C. #25471
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GreG L.
I saw the below statement about this in another thread and thought it would be useful to see what others think and how you go about it.
"I backflush the shower grey water into the black tank and it flushes everything out".
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We did this on our old camper. Open the main valve and then the black valve. Let drain as much as possible. Close the main valve and open the grey valve for a minute or so. Close the grey valve and open the main letting it drain well. Do that a couple times then close the black and open the grey. We used to have a separate galley tank so I would then close the bath grey tank and open the galley tank valve.
Of course we had a single main drain and a valve (that I installed) at the end of the main drain.
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12-09-2020, 03:00 PM
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#16
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Montana Master
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Winchester
Posts: 900
M.O.C. #19514
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A number of years ago, we had a plug in our black tank. Nothing was draining. This was on a previous (SOB) trailer. Another camper in our park suggested we get grey water in the stinky slinky, then raise it up and back it up into the black tank. It dislodged the plug.
After that we never flushed toilet paper again, and we’ve never had another plug. I don’t think it’s something you want to do on a regular basis, but in this particular case, it fixed our problem.
__________________
2017 High Country 305RL
2015 Ford F-250 Super Duty
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12-09-2020, 03:09 PM
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#17
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Established Member
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: O'Fallon
Posts: 38
M.O.C. #23886
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I raised mine at the full hook up before heading home and couldn't believe what was left after cleaning the black tank. I saw the idea in a post and it is great prior to winterizing, for sure.
__________________
Stu and Deb
O'Fallon, IL
2020 Montana HC 331RLS
2017 Ram 3500
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12-09-2020, 03:32 PM
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#18
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Seasoned Camper
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: northern new england
Posts: 98
M.O.C. #22358
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DutchmenSport
I've been using one of these Flush King style valves on 3 different trailers now. How many "back flushes" does it take to get the black tank "sparkling clean?" Answer ..... 15.
Every year, this is part of my winterizing process, to clean the holding tanks as much as possible. I can do this at home, with the ability to dump and to add water is no problem.
One year, I decided to REALLY clean out the black tank. So I kept adding water to the shower drain, filling up the grey tank. I can back flush 3, sometimes 4 times with a full shower water grey tank. And that year I took photos of every flush so I could actually see the water get clearer and clearer. It was 15 back flushes before clear water came out of the black tank.
This year, I back flushed 3 times. I then used a toilet wand. And I also used the black tank flusher system. I used approximately 150 gallons of water to flush out the tank till water ran clear.
How do I know how much water I ran? I dump into my 32 gallon Barker Blue Tote and dump it in my septic tank. It took 5 trips to the septic tank and the tote was full each time.
For those who say all you need to do is fill your tank and dump and you are good, you really should try back flushing with the 3rd attached valve. The first time you do, and you see how much MORE "stuff" comes out of your black tank, you WILL be a believer and never feel comfortable again, just dumping once and running!
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Sounds like you have way to much free time
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12-09-2020, 04:18 PM
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#19
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 2,318
M.O.C. #17894
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Another thing I have never seen mentioned in any of these tank cleaning threads is the fact that every camper is plumbed differently.
What I mean by that is the bottoms of the tanks are sloped towards the drain. They are something like 10 in deep at the drain 5 in at the other end.
The drain pipe from the toilet enters these tanks at different locations. If the drain pipe enters towards the drain Port of the tank the waste is falling into fluid that is already there. If the toilet drain pipe enters the tank towards the shallow end there may be no fluid where it dumps in for days, possibly creating a pyramid.
I hope that make sense
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12-09-2020, 06:28 PM
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#20
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Fargo
Posts: 214
M.O.C. #19032
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beeje
If the toilet drain pipe enters the tank towards the shallow end there may be no fluid where it dumps in for days, possibly creating a pyramid.
I hope that make sense
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One of my 5'ers, an 88 Starcraft Wanderstar (Nice rig by the way) had a toilet that dumped into the shallow end of the black tank. You really had to be careful of the dreaded pyramid! After I finally realized what was going on, I would add about 15 gallons of water to the tank after it was dumped to keep the floaters floating! That was the only one of the 5 I've owned that was set up that way.
A good clue to if you have that issue, though not always... is your toilet on the right (curb) or left side of the coach? Right side... there is a good chance your dumping into the shallow side of the tank. There are probably exceptions.
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2004 Montana 3295RK 2019 Ram / Cummins 2500 Summer season weekend warrior
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