3455SA SUSPENSION QUESTIONS

[jackel1959]

I’m not sure how serious a problem this is but the distance between the axles on the passenger side of our rig is ½ inch greater than on the driver’s side. I first noticed this when putting in the chocks when we park (I use the scissor type) and only close them enough to remove them when we are ready to leave. On more than one occasion I noticed when putting them back in after parking that about 50% of the time the chock either wouldn’t go back in between the tires or would be extremely loose. I surmised what was happening was the one that came off the right was going to the left and vice versa.

This got me to thinking that things weren’t the same on both sides. So today I got out the tape measure and yard stick and did some measuring. The first thing I did before I started measuring was hook up and make sure the wheels of the trailer were straight fore and aft with no axle and tire “twist”. Then I measured the distance between the tires on each side and discovered the passenger side measurement to be 4 7/8” and the driver side 4 1/8”. I then measured from the center to the center of the wheels on each side again the passenger side measured 35 5/8” and the driver side 35 1/8”. I then crawled under the rig and measured the distance between the axles under the blocks the leaf springs rest on with the same ½ inch difference. Last I measured each leaf spring from eye-bolt to eye bolt. This was interesting, three of the springs, passenger front & rear and driver’s front measured 26”. The driver’s side rear measured 26 ½” which ends up being the ½ inch difference. The driver side is probably the heavier side with the kitchen and pantry spaces over those axles on our rig. I wouldn’t think it should do this though.

Although the rig has just over 4800 miles on it, I removed the nuts on the shackle bolts to inspect for wear on the bushings and brackets for the suspension and all looked good. The tires are not showing any signs of unusual wear at this time. I am wondering how serious this is or if anyone else has experienced this? Any input is appreciated.

I also took some pictures of the rubber spring on the driver’s side which appears to have several cracks in it. I did not notice this on the passenger side. Is this normal wear or indications of something more serious? Thanks in advance,
Jack

[Art-n-Marge]

I can't help you on the axle alignment being off but it looks like you have the MorRyde equalizer so here's a link about the cracks:

http://www.morryde.com/pdfs/Rubber%2...20Criteria.pdf

I hope this helps.

[bncinwv]

One thing to be sure of is that before measuring the distance, make sure there is no binding effect on the tires. If you have to turn into your parking spot, there will be binding. Just to be safe, I think I would make sure the truck and rig were aligned and then move back and forth a few times to make sure that there is no undue lateral pressure on one side of the rig as compared to the other. I have used the same chocks for over two years with no adverse effects. Hope this helps, and keep us informed with what you discover.
Bingo

[dsprik]

It looks on the one pic that your Mor/ryde hanger and your outside spring hangers are not lined up. I would check to make sure that your frame lip above your Mor/ryde is not slightly twisted or bent. I bent mine sideways when I applied some undue stress to the opposite side of the 3400 - not going into that now...

[blarkman]

What year is your rig, and is it still under warranty. Are the axles bent, if you look at the axles there should be an arch or bowed up in the center of axles. If the axles are not paralel(spelling) you see some tire wear. I would certainly have a qualified alignment shop check it.
bob

[jackel1959]

Thank you all for the replies.
Art & Marge: Thanks for the link. I will check the springs today against the criteria in the document.
Bingo: Before I started measuring I hooked up the rig to the truck and made sure the tires were straight fore and aft with no binding. I am fortunate in that I can pull out into the street and then back straight into where the rig gets parked.
dsprik: I will check the frame lip today while checking the rubber spring.
blarkman: The rig is still under warranty so I am not worried about coverage. I did not notice any unusual tire wear when I checked everything yesterday. The axles do have the bow up wards in the middle and don't appear to be bent.
Does anyone have a Point of Contact or phone number for "Team Montana"? I assume it is Keystone's Customer Service line and would like to contact them first to discuss this issue before I take the rig to the dealer just so they (the dealer) doesn't try to give me the runaround about this.
Jack

[skypilot]

Had a similar issue on my SOB -- was the extra weight on the one side versus weight on the opposing side of the coach. Weight causes the springs to load up (flatten) more on the heavier side and the result is that the wheels come closer together. Took it to an alignment shop in Salina and they installed some spacing blocks that my dealer provided that allows them to move the axles front and back to make them even given the load.

This is a common problem according to the axle/spring shop I went to with the heavier units we are now getting with multiple slides -- in my case I have washer/Dryers/ stove, refer and entertainment center all on the one side of the coach -- when I weighed it it was almost 1000 lbs heavier on the street side than on the curb side. No towing problems either.

Don't know that this helps you any but at least lets you know what they are saying.

[Jolu]

Jack,

Those cracked rubber springs should be covered under warranty. Mine were replaced by MorRyde after the warranty period. Labor supplied by me. I also found that the Z brackets attached to the rubber springs had elongated holes also. I ordered new Z brackets with the bronze bushings attached.
For anyone needing those new Z brackets from MorRyde they are called Wet Bolt Shackle Assembly part #LRE43-001. $21.99 each. You will need four.

[HamRad]

Jack,
Since there are no signs of any problems I'd guess you are looking at a normal situation. The exception perhaps being the MorRyde rubber situation. Once you have that squared away I wouldn't worry about it.

Just bring it on down to Q and if you have any problems you'll have a whole crew to help you fix it!

See you later.

Dennis

[sreigle]

Jack, we also use those BAL scissor chocks on both sides and have seen the same width differences you see. Several times. But it's not every time and not always on the same side. I chalk it up to the bind effect of turning into our site, either a backin or pullthru, as Bingo mentioned. I don't think we moved far enough in a straight line to straighten everything out. Sometimes I'm turning the rig a little after getting partway into the site, in order to straighten our alignment with the site.

As for those cracks, I don't see any cracks in ours. The link Art provided has some good info. If it were me I think I'd be measuring the cracks and sending the pictures to Mor-Ryde.

[jackel1959]

skypilot: This is the heavy side of the rig....3 slides, entertainment center, refrigerator, stove/oven, micro, water heater and 2 pantries.

I have an e-mail into Montana regarding the issue and asking what the tolerances are for the axles. I also noticed today that the rear tire on the driver's side has actually come in contact with the front of the fender skirt leaving black marks and taking a couple of chips out of the skirt.



I will be contacting Mor/Ryde next week regarding the rubber springs. I didn't measure the cracks today, but I don't feel they should look like they do after only 5 months and 4844 miles. I will keep you all posted on the outcome.
Jack

[gregh9999]

Did you ever get a reply as to the acceptable spacing difference? I have a late 2009 3455SA that is showing the same situation. My difference in the spacing is 4 7/8 (Pass side) and 4 1/4 (driver side). I checked the distances for the welded hangers, and they are identical. The total spacing between the front and read hangers is also identical. I always have a 5/8" difference, with the passenger side spacing being the largest.

I did find over 1/2 of the U bolts far from proper torque, as well as 3 out of 8 of the bolts going through the spring eyes far from tight.

[jackel1959]

Greg,
When I talked to Keystone originally they told me "their" tolerance was 1/2". The only thing I can figure is that because the driver's side is the heavy side, the springs have flattened out more bringing the tires closer together. Did you measure your 4 springs eye-bolt to eye-bolt on each spring? If so, I would be interested in the measurements you came up with.

[8e3k0]

With leaf springs there will always be movement in either direction pending load. Taking the front axle as an example the front of the spring pac is secure as the shackle is wellded to the frame and the top leaf with the shackle bolt is controlled by this stationary shackle on the frame. The rear of the spring pac is different, as it has a shackle hanger with two sets of bolts about 2 inches apart to allow for forward movement with no load and backward movement as the load increases ( the spring arc changes, therefore the overall length of the spring pac increases as the load increases with the rear shackle moving in the rearward direction and the axle will tend to move slightly to the rear as the load increases). The rear axle will work in the opposite direction or in reverse because the stationary shackle is at the rear and the moveable shackle is at the front. To conclude: Heavier load axles will move together, no load axles will move farther apart. If your RV is loaded heavier on one side there will be a tendancy for the axles to be closer together on the heaviest side; this may only be a difference of a 1/4 to 3/8 of an inch when suspension system is in new ondition with no wear on any components. Hope this all makes sense; if not PM me. Thanks

[gregh9999]

I understand the principles in effect here. My original concern was that I may betraveling in an out-of-alignment condition. I had checked everything on the suspension while I tightened everything to specs, and noticed that the driver's side rubber block is more loaded. This I had assumed was due to more weight on that side. Now between jackel1959's and my 3455SA, we have the same situation. I'm sure that it's due to more weight on the one side that the other. Over course, two is not a good sample size..

My only concern is my original one. I don't want to accelerate the wear on the tires because the trailer was built too heavy on one side, with the factory suspension possibly moving the out of an aligned condition. If the difference in the spacing is causing more tire wear, then the situation might require more thought.

I'll check the spring measurements soon. I'm pretty sure that they'll be close to jackel1959's measurements.

[jackel1959]

8e3ko,
Thanks for the reply....it all makes sense. Now I am wondering what can be done to rectify the problem. Skypilot had mentioned something about a spacer block which I may have to look into. Like I said earlier, this is the heavy side of the rig with 3 slides, entertainment center, refrigerator, stove/oven, micro, water heater and 2 pantries.
Jack

[gregh9999]

My first thought is that it came from the factory like this. It would be important to know what Montana and/or Mor/ryde think about this situation. Options could be a slightly stronger Mor/ryde "rubber spring". I know that they come in four or five strengths.

We really need another 3455SA owner to jump in, and let us know what their wheel spacings are. That would tell us if it is really a design issue.

[jackel1959]

UPDATE:I talked to Mor-Ryde yesterday and ordered the "Wet Bolt" kit for our rig and talked with them regarding the difference in axle spacing. I wanted to know if changing to a heavier duty shear spring on that side would fix the problem. One of their engineers said that changing to the heavier duty shear spring may help fix the problem but it may create another one. The engineer also said that maybe one of the springs may have lost its arch.

So I called Dexter Axle today to talk with them about this. The gentleman I spoke with stated that this is not that uncommon of a problem because of the trailers being heavier on one side than the other, He also said that he had never heard of the tires contacting the fender skirt as mine have. He did say that they could provide me with a heavier duty leaf spring for that side and that it should not create any adverse affects. I am going to call them back tomorrow with my axle information and then have them ship the spring. I don't know if they are going to charge me for it or not and I will have it installed when I have the wet bolt kit installed. I also let the guy at Dexter know that I was not the only person having this issue and that there was another owner of a 3455SA that was experiencing the same problem.

I am gone for a while and won't be able to get to taking care of the trailer for a month or so but will let you know how things work out.

Jack

[jackel1959]

UPDATE TO UPDATE: Two new 4000 LB. rated springs are on the way to replace the stock 3500 LB. springs on that side. I will have them installed at the end of this month when I have the rig in for some warranty work. I will send the old ones back to Dexter so they can inspect them for any defects but I suspect it is because of the weight on that side. I will post again when I have more info on this problem. I suspect I am not going to be the only one experiencing this problem and others will be talking about similar issues soon.
Jack

[dwstockman]

Jackel,
We also own a 2010 3455SA but haven't noticed the suspension problems that you've described. I've measured the "center to center" wheel hub distance on each side and they are within 1/8" of each other.
Like you mentioned, the left side of the rig has 3 slides, entertainment center, refrigerator, stove/oven, micro, water heater and 2 pantries and stands to reason that it would be heavier. While at the MOC rally in Goshen we had our unit weighted and I was surprised that it was only 525 lbs heavier on the left side than on the right but was still well within the axle/spring ratings.
Right front-2725 & Right rear-2650 = 5375 lbs right side total
Left Front -2900 & Left rear -3000 = 5900 lbs left side total
Pin weight = 2675, Total weight = 13,950