HEY KEYSTONE! - Page 2 - Montana Owners Club

Hooker · 04-07-2011, 09:25 AM

This is a very interesting thread. I started a thread several months ago where I questioned why 5th wheels (Montanas in particular) had so much trouble with frames, axles, various support systems and associated parts On my motor home forum I've NEVER seen a post regarding that subject. My point then was and is, if an axle is rated for 6,000# or 7,000# it should be able to handle that weight. If the RV has a GVWR of 16,000#, it should be able to handle it. My MH's front axle has a GW rating of 14,600#...sure it's a heavy duty truck frame and that's a high weight...but it should be able to handle the weight for which it is rated, just like a 5th wheel's axle rated for 6,000# or 7,000# should be able to handle it's rated weight without a lot of after market add ons.

We certainly loved our 3400RL, but it sounds like Montana has some work to do.

Bottom line, what ever weight the item is rated for, is the weight it should be able to safely handle.

Lambchop · 04-07-2011, 09:47 AM

I guess we should just go to RV parks with Pull-Through's

Roy

pbahlin · 04-07-2011, 03:16 PM

I like Oz's idea of throwing sand under the tires. Of course you could just restrict yourself to those quaint parks that aren't paved. Maybe you could get some of those furniture mover pads they advertise on TV at 3 AM. Or yeah, how about recycling those little pin lube discs.

You just roll onto four discs, lock up your tires with a pair of those tire chocks cranked up to about 100 ft. lbs. and turn any way you want.

I've got a Big Foot so I could put casters on the bottom of my pistons.

richfaa · 04-07-2011, 03:43 PM

"if an axle is rated for 6,000# or 7,000# it should be able to handle that weight. If the RV has a GVWR of 16,000#, it should be able to handle it. My MH's front axle has a GW rating of 14,600#...sure it's a heavy duty truck frame and that's a high weight...but it should be able to handle the weight for which it is rated, just like a 5th wheel's axle rated for 6,000# or 7,000# should be able to handle it's rated weight without a lot of after market add ons.

"

Don't think there are many axle issues..if any..never had a axle problem. Spring hangers, etc..

BTW.. We always get a pull through. We do have to do a tight turn backing into our driveay at home off the city street and there are black tire marks all over the driveay where we dragged the 3400 around.. that can no be good.

GaryM · 05-04-2011, 09:30 AM

So I can assume that you are having all kinds of problems with your 2008 Ford F-350 SD?
Seeing how you are putting your rig through all the rough roads and hard use it must be costing you allot of money for upgrades on you truck?
OR is your TV a good reliable strong safe product that you paid good money for?
Just trying to clarify a point that's all.

Gary

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by richfaa

I hear you pbahlin..however our 06 3400 had at least 40K on it and it has seen some hard use and bad roads and sharp turns and bouncing for miles. Even with the Mor Ryde pin box we have been on roads that near Jarred our filling out and had to make some turns that should never have been attempted. I will not, If I can help it, allow a dealer to pick up our unit with a fork lift. I note that at Mor Ryde we were asked to back our 3400 into the bay.

GaryM · 05-04-2011, 09:38 AM

I did not do any research on this but like all products on the market there should be a built in safety factor lets say 10% or 20%.
A rim that can hold 100 psi, is or should be able to hold allot more than that. Something like 120 psi before it fails.
A propane bottle is tested at one and a half times its working pressure (that I know) before it passes and can be sold to the customer.

Gary

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by Hooker

This is a very interesting thread. I started a thread several months ago where I questioned why 5th wheels (Montanas in particular) had so much trouble with frames, axles, various support systems and associated parts On my motor home forum I've NEVER seen a post regarding that subject. My point then was and is, if an axle is rated for 6,000# or 7,000# it should be able to handle that weight. If the RV has a GVWR of 16,000#, it should be able to handle it. My MH's front axle has a GW rating of 14,600#...sure it's a heavy duty truck frame and that's a high weight...but it should be able to handle the weight for which it is rated, just like a 5th wheel's axle rated for 6,000# or 7,000# should be able to handle it's rated weight without a lot of after market add ons.

We certainly loved our 3400RL, but it sounds like Montana has some work to do.

Bottom line, what ever weight the item is rated for, is the weight it should be able to safely handle.

richfaa · 05-04-2011, 02:38 PM

Never had a problem with the frame with the hard use we give this 3w400.Susoension is a different story..

The truckhas front wheels that turn. We do not drag it around corners.

Desert RVer · 05-28-2011, 01:26 PM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by richfaa

Never had a problem with the frame with the hard use we give this 3w400.Susoension is a different story..

The truckhas front wheels that turn. We do not drag it around corners.

We just need the RV manufacturers to fess up and put in their generic manuals that they aren't designed to be turned around corners.

indy roadrunner · 05-29-2011, 01:34 AM

While backing at sharp angles and I see side pressure starting to load up on the tires, I stop and pull forward one or two feet to unload the pressure before continuing to back. I may have to do that two or three times but I feel I am not putting the pressure on my suspension or sidewalls of the tires.

Ozz · 05-29-2011, 02:46 AM

Good idea Phil

DonandJudy_12 · 05-29-2011, 03:33 AM

The "manual" that came with our 2000 3555RL states that the unit was not meant for fulltime use- We are fulltimers- As we became aware of deficiencies, we did upgrades on our dime- Keystone did do their repair thing in Goshen at no cost to us other than the expense to get there- We appreciate their efforts- However, we feel the basic frame is not strong enough PERIOD! The basic stress points are not built to last- We need the rv industry to be under the same rules as the auto industry-JMHO- Still, we love our Monty and would buy another IF we could get the same floor plan we have- Don

BigAl52 · 06-03-2011, 07:07 PM

Thats exactly why Keystone will not do anything about the suspensions,cause people keep buying them. If you were number 1 in sales would you? I have been thru all the hurddles just like alot of the rest of you, from junk chinnese tires to now a landing gear motor. My 3485sa doesnt even have 10000 miles on the road. I just replaced all 4 tires. Landing gear motor has never been abused, by that I mean legs have never been run to the top. Motor gearbox went out. 400.00 for a new one from Lippert. I now have the heavy duty model. Made in China by the way. Montana assembled in America but made in China just like alot of the rest of our things. I dont know about the rest of you but Im a little sick of Made in China and spending 400.00 for it makes me wonder. Al

Bill-N-Donna · 06-04-2011, 02:09 AM

I expect there to be some flexing with the frame and suspension. If there weren’t any flexing at all I believe it would be a disaster. These units have to give a little. I have to make a really sharp turn to get in our driveway. I’ve seen many different times where the wheels were under so much stress that they actually pointed out during a turn while backing. This is on concrete and some gravel. After I started reading these threads on the suspension and problems with the frames I expected to find all kinds of problems. I looked it over really good and had someone else look it over too. I’ve never had any problems with the suspension or anything major with the frame. Perhaps I’m just one of the lucky ones. Normally we only hear about the bad things on here. In reality I imagine there are many units that never have any trouble.

Are there certain model years where these units were more prone to trouble?

Lambchop · 06-04-2011, 03:23 AM

BigAl52,

I don't know who gave you a price of $400 for a landing gear motor, but there are 3 for sale on Ebay..brand new(probably China) for about $85 each!!
Just thought you would be interested........

Roy

Phil P · 06-04-2011, 06:27 AM

Hello Ozz

My father was in the house moving business for many years. When he would pull a house out of the lot it was on one of the hardest things on the TV was coming up on the hard road. He always shoveled sand on the road so the front wheels of the all wheel drive TV would slip. This prevented the front axle from being overloaded and braking one of the front wheel drive axels.

Phil P

Ozz · 06-04-2011, 06:32 AM

Yes Phil, any of us that have ridden motorcycles understand the sand and gravel ball-bearing principles... some of us learned the hard way

BigAl52 · 06-04-2011, 07:19 PM

Roy
I got the landing gear motor from Lippert. That was motor and gearbox together. I looked at the ebay site but none of what I see there is the right one for my unit. By the way thanks for your service. Al

richfaa · 06-05-2011, 04:31 AM

I am of a little different opinion. These guys are recreational vehicles and designed as such.

"An RV is a vehicle designed as temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, travel or season use. RVs may be motorized (motorhomes) or towable (travel trailers, folding camping trailers and truck campers)." (Per RVIA ) Read somewhere that the average use of a RV is 60 to 100 days a year.

We do lot more than recreate in ours, I have mentioned before this is our 5th Rv. The previous four were used as recreational vehicles. Weekends and vacations. We had few problems with any of them and in some cases none at all. We were on the road and lived in this one more in the first year of use than the other 4 in nearly 20 years.

When we purchased our several trucks we special ordered them with heavy duty options needed to tow that particular camper. I will bet all of us did that.

The RV industry offers no such options. One camper fits all conditions of use. What if our trucks were built the same.

Most of the campers in our local camping group have had few if any problems with their units..any brand. They just do not use the hard enough or often enough.

Desert RVer · 06-13-2011, 05:09 PM

With this definition of RV use:
"An RV is a vehicle designed as temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, travel or season use. RVs may be motorized (motorhomes) or towable (travel trailers, folding camping trailers and truck campers)."

Then wouldn't winter season usage qualify? Winter seasonal use could be 5, 6 or 7 months.

richfaa · 06-13-2011, 06:12 PM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by Desert RVer

With this definition of RV use:
"An RV is a vehicle designed as temporary living quarters for recreational, camping, travel or season use. RVs may be motorized (motorhomes) or towable (travel trailers, folding camping trailers and truck campers)."

Then wouldn't winter season usage qualify? Winter seasonal use could be 5, 6 or 7 months.

It does. These guys are "all season units" which means you can use them in all seasons. You may roast in some and freeze in others but you can use them in all seasons. Marketing is wonderful.

We use ours in all seasons.Spring and summer in Ohio, Fall and winter in Florida.. Works out great...

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