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08-05-2020, 09:46 AM
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#1
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Montana Fan
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Bedford
Posts: 307
M.O.C. #21728
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Installing new batteries
Hello all. I am planning to replace my 2 grp 24 batteries with 2 six volt 235AH batteries. I'm currently in NM and plan to travel to TX to see my daughter and purchase the batteries.
Here's my question. If I pull the 12V batteries will the 12V system still run off the 110VAC converted to 12VDC? Are there other potential problems that might happen if left for a week without batteries?
I'm still learning about these RV systems. It seems to me the converter would operate the 12VDC part of the system. Thanks
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Member #21728
2019 3931FB
2017 F350 6.7 Powerstroke SRW
B&W Companion Slider 20K
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08-05-2020, 09:53 AM
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#2
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Montana Master
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: 1000 oaks
Posts: 954
M.O.C. #19630
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You will need a 12V battery to operate your trailer brakes in the event of a disconnection.
The battery will also need to be there for you to operate the slides and jacks.
The battery is also needed when you buy the new ones as a core$
__________________
2011 2955RL Gen-Y Executive Kingpin
2022 GMC 2500HD Duramax/Alison
4X4 Crew Cab/Standard bed.
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08-05-2020, 09:57 AM
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#3
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Montana Master
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Sebring
Posts: 3,659
M.O.C. #9969
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As long as you're connected to shore power the converter will supply 12 V, but you won't be able to run jacks or slides.
If you're planning on pulling the batteries for a while, make sure you insulate the charge cable coming from the converter to the batteries, because if it touches the chassis for even a split second you'll blow it's fuses.
I did that last summer when I replaced my four batteries, wanted to take my old batteries so I wouldn't have to pay the core charge then return to get it back.
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Michelle & Ann
2018 Chevy 3500HD High Country DRW 4X4 Crew Cab w/Duramax/Allison, Formally 2010 Montana 2955RL, Now Loaded 2016 SOB, Mor/ryde IS, Disc Brakes & Pin Box, Comfort Ride Hitch, Sailun 17.5 Tires.
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08-05-2020, 10:33 AM
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#4
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Montana Master
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Mesa az
Posts: 2,953
M.O.C. #5651
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I thought that 2 6V batteries are better than a 12V battery. But 2 12's were better than 2 6's. Someone else should chime in here soon.
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Tom and Gail
2013 Mountaineer 362
2012 Silverado 2500
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08-06-2020, 04:32 AM
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#5
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Jacksonville
Posts: 2,143
M.O.C. #25165
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You can get more amp hours from 2 6 volt batteries in series than 2 12 volt batteries in parallel. 6 volt batteries wired in series double the voltage (which gives you 12 volts) but the amp hour rating remains the same. When you wire 2 12 volt batteries in parallel, the voltage remains 12 volts, but the amp hours will double. With that, most 12 volt batteries even doubled are slightly less amp hours than the 6 volts. Also, 6 volt batteries have heavier and thicker plates and are made to handle the charge/discharge cycle better, so they will typically give a longer service life assuming they are maintained well.
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Robert & Diana McNeal
2019 Montana Legacy 3791RD 20th Anniversary Edition
2014 F350 4x4 6.7L SRW
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08-06-2020, 08:58 AM
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#6
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 2,318
M.O.C. #17894
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When we bought our rig used in oct 15 the dealer installed 2- 12 volt battlers. We already had 2 -6 volts. I wired them all together and they are still going strong today. I just check the water level once a month or so and add distilled water when needed.
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2018 Chevy 3500 LTZ Dually Diesel 4x4 CCLB
2011 Montana 3455 SA. 6 point level up. Disc brakes. Curt Q24 Hitch. 5 step glow steps
Progressive EMS. Valterra tank valves. Sailun G637 tires. ARP fridge control. All led lighting. Mor Ryde IS
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08-06-2020, 12:47 PM
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#7
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Montana Master
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: lake stevens
Posts: 504
M.O.C. #24938
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beeje
When we bought our rig used in oct 15 the dealer installed 2- 12 volt battlers. We already had 2 -6 volts. I wired them all together and they are still going strong today. I just check the water level once a month or so and add distilled water when needed.
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Whoa that is not recommended to do a series parallel mix with different batteries, in fact you should always use like batteries.That is a potential recipe for disaster.
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08-06-2020, 12:49 PM
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#8
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Montana Master
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Grand Rapids
Posts: 1,896
M.O.C. #9561
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get 2 6 volt batteries.
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08-06-2020, 12:50 PM
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#9
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Montana Master
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: lake stevens
Posts: 504
M.O.C. #24938
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdarwin
Hello all. I am planning to replace my 2 grp 24 batteries with 2 six volt 235AH batteries. I'm currently in NM and plan to travel to TX to see my daughter and purchase the batteries.
Here's my question. If I pull the 12V batteries will the 12V system still run off the 110VAC converted to 12VDC? Are there other potential problems that might happen if left for a week without batteries?
I'm still learning about these RV systems. It seems to me the converter would operate the 12VDC part of the system. Thanks
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Frankly 2 6v or 12v will only get you by you chould consider if doing a battery upgrade to install 4 6v. That will also provide mild dry camp capability. Like overnite in a parking lot if needed. Also note there are alot of GARBAGE batteries out there like the Interstate 6v that Costco sells
Here was my upgrade
For the OP I installed my 4 Trojans today removing the two 12v. As you can see the battery box barely fits but is doable. Even if you only buy two 12V you should still buy the 4 battery box so you can easily upgrade. You can just build a filler to take up the extra space.
As mentioned above I purchased 4 Trojan T105 Plus 225 AH $125 Ea no tax and no core required ($500 total ) https://www.onlinebatterysale.com/store/
the Battery Box was purchased from All Battery Sales and Service $80 https://allbatterysalesandservice.co...atteries-gcq-g
I bought the 2" vent for the lid from Amazon $5
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...0?ie=UTF8&th=1
I Just ordered the Watering system for $79 so they will for the most part be Maintenance free as I will gravity feed the system.
https://www.rvupgradestore.com/Flow-...bg-u24v-4g.htm
Total Cost of new 4 new batteries and box $665
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08-06-2020, 01:16 PM
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#10
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 2,318
M.O.C. #17894
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightsout
Whoa that is not recommended to do a series parallel mix with different batteries, in fact you should always use like batteries.That is a potential recipe for disaster.
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The setup has been in the rig for 5 years not one single issue. They were all fairly new when I put them in. When they're done I will definitely go all 6 volt
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08-06-2020, 02:31 PM
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#11
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Montana Master
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: lake stevens
Posts: 504
M.O.C. #24938
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beeje
The setup has been in the rig for 5 years not one single issue. They were all fairly new when I put them in. When they're done I will definitely go all 6 volt
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and that suggest what you have been LUCKY??? (so far). Also those those batteries will not charge at the same rate which is highly problematic. People like this should not be giving advice about batteries
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08-06-2020, 02:42 PM
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#12
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Montana Master
Join Date: May 2017
Location: new caney
Posts: 1,050
M.O.C. #19873
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rmcneal
you can get more amp hours from 2 6 volt batteries in series than 2 12 volt batteries in parallel. 6 volt batteries wired in series double the voltage (which gives you 12 volts) but the amp hour rating remains the same. When you wire 2 12 volt batteries in parallel, the voltage remains 12 volts, but the amp hours will double. With that, most 12 volt batteries even doubled are slightly less amp hours than the 6 volts. Also, 6 volt batteries have heavier and thicker plates and are made to handle the charge/discharge cycle better, so they will typically give a longer service life assuming they are maintained well.
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'well said'
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08-06-2020, 03:13 PM
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#13
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 2,318
M.O.C. #17894
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightsout
and that suggest what you have been LUCKY??? (so far). Also those those batteries will not charge at the same rate which is highly problematic. People like this should not be giving advice about batteries
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I never gave any advice whatsoever. I merely stated my situation. Before I did so I did some research and the consensus was somewhat like you said but they wouldn't charge at the same rate but that doesn't matter to me. I was merely trying to make use of the new batteries that I had, 2 being 12 volt and 2 being 6 volt.
I just looked again and I can't find anything that says that what I've done is dangerous in any way. Definitely not an ideal situation and I know that
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08-07-2020, 05:23 PM
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#14
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Montana Master
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: lake stevens
Posts: 504
M.O.C. #24938
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beeje
I never gave any advice whatsoever. I merely stated my situation. Before I did so I did some research and the consensus was somewhat like you said but they wouldn't charge at the same rate but that doesn't matter to me. I was merely trying to make use of the new batteries that I had, 2 being 12 volt and 2 being 6 volt.
I just looked again and I can't find anything that says that what I've done is dangerous in any way. Definitely not an ideal situation and I know that
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Here is one example
While a few variables may be involved with overcharging a 12v battery, the results are simple to check. A battery can quite simply die from being overcharged. This is the safest side-effect, but not the only thing that can happen. An overcharged battery will boil the sulfuric acid and distilled water mix. The casing of the battery can become hot to the touch, and begin to melt or swell. Flammable hydrogen can build up inside the sealed cells of the battery, causing swelling of the casing under pressure and seepage through small vents. Once the hydrogen is introduced to oxygen, it becomes a sitting time bomb. A small electrical spark can ignite the gas and cause the battery to explode, sending plastic and lead shrapnel flying around, in addition to a caustic sulfuric acid spray. Obviously, this is the most dangerous side-effect of an overcharged battery.
it is important to have a balanced 12v electrical supply system
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08-07-2020, 05:37 PM
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#15
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 2,318
M.O.C. #17894
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightsout
Here is one example
While a few variables may be involved with overcharging a 12v battery, the results are simple to check. A battery can quite simply die from being overcharged. This is the safest side-effect, but not the only thing that can happen. An overcharged battery will boil the sulfuric acid and distilled water mix. The casing of the battery can become hot to the touch, and begin to melt or swell. Flammable hydrogen can build up inside the sealed cells of the battery, causing swelling of the casing under pressure and seepage through small vents. Once the hydrogen is introduced to oxygen, it becomes a sitting time bomb. A small electrical spark can ignite the gas and cause the battery to explode, sending plastic and lead shrapnel flying around, in addition to a caustic sulfuric acid spray. Obviously, this is the most dangerous side-effect of an overcharged battery.
it is important to have a balanced 12v electrical supply system
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I am well aware the batteries can and do explode on occasion for many different reasons. However there are many that are not caused by and improper installation.
For example I bought a brand new 2002 Chevy diesel truck and five or so years into owning it I got home one day and heard a noise under the hood. I proceeded to open the hood to find one of the batteries extremely hot and boiling. The two batteries were factory installed and were never changed within those five years. Luckily it did not explode and I replaced both the batteries.
So if you wish to think i have had good luck, then we all have that same luck since none of our batteries have exploded.
Trust me when I tell you I take extremely good care of everything I own be at the car truck van camper mower heavy equipment whatever it matters to be.
4 stage converter Chargers in these RV are pretty good with keeping the battery correctly and fully charged.
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08-08-2020, 11:06 AM
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#16
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Montana Master
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: lake stevens
Posts: 504
M.O.C. #24938
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beeje
I am well aware the batteries can and do explode on occasion for many different reasons. However there are many that are not caused by and improper installation.
For example I bought a brand new 2002 Chevy diesel truck and five or so years into owning it I got home one day and heard a noise under the hood. I proceeded to open the hood to find one of the batteries extremely hot and boiling. The two batteries were factory installed and were never changed within those five years. Luckily it did not explode and I replaced both the batteries.
So if you wish to think i have had good luck, then we all have that same luck since none of our batteries have exploded.
Trust me when I tell you I take extremely good care of everything I own be at the car truck van camper mower heavy equipment whatever it matters to be.
4 stage converter Chargers in these RV are pretty good with keeping the battery correctly and fully charged.
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Based on your response i have to ask then... If you are aware of this then why would you intentionally config your batteries knowing the safety ramifications of series/parallel complications and major potential safety compromises with mixed batteries in this fashion? It is like you are asking for for trouble...
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08-08-2020, 11:11 AM
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#17
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 2,318
M.O.C. #17894
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Certainly not asking for trouble just trying to utilize 4 nearly brand-new new batteries I had at the time.
Like I stated earlier when these are done I will definitely go to 4 -6 volt batteries
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08-09-2020, 01:51 PM
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#18
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Seasoned Camper
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Simi Valley
Posts: 71
M.O.C. #10801
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I run 2 6volt lifeline batteries , AGM 440 amp hrs. The last pair lasted 7 years ! 0 maintenance . A lot of dry camping The batteries always bounce back to full charge.
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08-09-2020, 02:00 PM
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#19
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 2,318
M.O.C. #17894
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chapman
I run 2 6volt lifeline batteries , AGM 440 amp hrs. The last pair lasted 7 years ! 0 maintenance . A lot of dry camping The batteries always bounce back to full charge.
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I'd love to have those but my pockets aren't deep enough.lol
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08-09-2020, 02:39 PM
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#20
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: Qualicum Beach
Posts: 665
M.O.C. #26399
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twindman
I thought that 2 6V batteries are better than a 12V battery. But 2 12's were better than 2 6's. Someone else should chime in here soon.
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6V golf cart batteries are just built tougher. Think about it, almost the same physical size but half the voltage.
When I took delivery of our new rig a few years ago it came with two 12 V batteries with a total of 150AH (75 usable) but I replaced them with 2 6V Trojan T105's, 225AH (112.5 usable) for a gain of 37.5AH usable power or 50% gain in usable power. Now I have gone Lithium.
__________________
2018 Keystone Montana 3811MS
2017 Ford F450 diesel dually
600AH Battle Born Lithium Batteries, 1,080 watts solar
3,000 watt hybrid inverter with 120A charger
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