Leveling jacks - Montana Owners Club

Phil P · 03-10-2011, 11:39 PM

Hello

I see in some of the post here that some have installed after market leveling jacks.

The first month we had our 2009, 38 ft Montana we went to Branson and was put on a site that wasn’t level. The blocks we had weren’t high enough.

I contacted the dealer when I got back and he advised against installing leveling jacks and recommended I call Keystone about it.

Keystone gave me the phone number for the frame manufacturer. The frame company told me they didn’t offer or recommend leveling jacks for this frame. They would not give any more information.

I have since had a staff steel structures engineer look at the trailer and he refused to make any recommendation with out further inspection.

Now my question is, I see a reference to “Big Foot” leveling jacks.

Can any one give me a recommendation about this company’s expertise and their system?

Thanks

7.3Ford · 03-11-2011, 02:38 AM

Phil,

The two most common you will here about at MOC are Lippert Level-Up System and BigFoot. Both are recommended by everyone that has them. Lippert system is cheaper, and as I understand it, you have to go to Goshen area to get it installed. If that is true, by the time you drive up there from FL, cost will be a push.

I have appointment on 3/17/2011 for BigFoot Install at Lakeland, FL. If you are thinking about BigFoot, I recommend you buy it thru Plug-it-Right. Installation is still done by Quadra the Manufacture, but will save you $800.

http://www.plugitright.com/BigFootLevelers.html

pbahlin · 03-11-2011, 03:37 AM

I can't figure out why your dealer is confused about this. What kind of Montana do you have?

Even the engineer seems confused to me. If you think about your rig it is supported by the axles and pin when you're towing (with bumps) and when you're sitting in a park the loads on the frame are far less.

I've got the Big Foot system and it provides two hydraulic jacks just aft of the rear wheels and two that replace your landing gear. The support it provides to the frame is virtually identical to that provided by your trailer's suspension. In fact mine can be used to completely lift the rig off the tires and I do just that to service the axles.

Your frame is most likely made by Lippert and they offer a system of their own that provides six hydraulic units.

I believe the Lippert system is driven by a single pump. The big foot cylinders each have their own pump.

Whichever one you get, you'll love.

Hooker · 03-11-2011, 03:55 AM

Notice all the frame questions that ever come up...leveling jacks, carrying things on the back, etc...all result in Keystone saying don't do it. Seems to me they need to make a tougher frame, it appears to be the weak link.

helmick · 03-11-2011, 03:55 AM

Having a hard time with someone at the frame company telling you they do not recommened them. They make the Level-Up System, I purchased mine from them and they had them instaled. We love our Six Point Lippert Level-Up System. Some of the new Montanas are coming with it. I think some one gave you some bad information. By the way, the Keystone Sevrice Center In Goshen saw our system on our Montana and liked it.

Art-n-Marge · 03-11-2011, 05:48 AM

I agree with most posters that if the axle locations and the landing gear are what holds up the trailer in the first place, then why wouldn't automatic and powerful leveling jacks at those locations NOT be recommended. These jacks are holding up the same weight as the passive axles and landing jacks would be. And they are stronger than landing gear and axle/wheels because they can also LIFT the rig.

I can see a hitch at the rear of a trailer that may not be designed to carry much weight at that one area, but leveling jacks? Come on, that doesn't make ANY sense.

I would prefer the Bigfoot 4 jack levelers over the Lippert 6 jack levelers because the two extra jacks just might cause more flex stress than the 4 jacks. But it allows for quicker setup to stabilize the rear end. But that's only my opinion.

I would be interested to hear if there have been any problems (not jacking evenly or what happens in the system fails, or other stuff). I've heard of the air suspension systems failing but not the hydraulic ones.

Phil P · 03-11-2011, 01:09 PM

Hi

Thanks all for the information.

When I called Keystone they told me to call the frame company.

When I called Lippert they told me that they did offer leveling jacks for some of their frames but they didn’t offer leveling jacks for the frame under my unit. They also didn’t recommend putting them on the frame I had. They also made a point to tell me the stabilizers were not intended to level the trailer.

My unit is advertised as a 38 ft unit when I put a tape on it it is 39 ft. when the unit is connected to the TV the bedroom and bathroom doors don’t work correctly. When I park it and remove the TV the bedroom door works correctly. When I put the stabilizers down as far as they will go the all doors work correctly. The frame obviously bows over the axels.

Phil P

exav8tr · 03-11-2011, 01:31 PM

Phil, Might I recommend that you put your year and model number AND year and tow vehicle information under your name so others will have some idea of the equipment you have to bett offer advice.....

bill maietta · 03-11-2011, 02:38 PM

I have a system called ground control remote wireless leveling system and I love it. it uses 4 independent jacks capable of lifting i believe 4000 lbs each. I have lifted the Montana off the ground. Mine has been in service for about a year now with no problems and that includes many campouts and a 13000 mile cross country trip. Probably hundreds of lifts.

helmick · 03-11-2011, 03:23 PM

Phil P
Do you have a 347 Mountaineer with the garage, if so I can understand their comments.

Phil P · 03-12-2011, 12:47 AM

Hi

Sorry about that I thought I put the trailer model in the first post.

2009 Montana 38 ft with side bath and 4 slides

2009 Chevy crew cab, long bed 3500 Duramax.

The Montana weighs 15,180 when loaded for travel. The total weight of the rig with full fuel and full water tank with my wife, the dog and myself is 23, 100. I spent about an hour on the scale to get all of these figures. The axel weights change dramatically between sitting on the landing gear and hooked to the fifth-wheel. We keep the water tank full because we have a hobby that gets us dirty and oily and often spend 3 to 4 days “off grid”. The water last only 3 to 4 days.

Purchased both new for the purpose of traveling the US. We have now 51,000 miles on the TV and 23,000 on the Montana. My wife picked out both vehicles all I got to do was pay for them. My wife drives the TV as her personal car.

We were going to be full timers. I gave the homestead fully paid for to my son and after we were gone for a year he gave it back “to much work to maintain”. So we are here in south central Florida until I sell the homestead.

Phil P

indy roadrunner · 03-12-2011, 01:40 AM

Phil, we still don't have enough info on your unit. There are several models of Montana that fit your description, there are Big Skys, Mountaineer, High Country that come to my mind even in the Montana line there are several models with 4 slides.
I don't see hyd jacks as a big deal for me. I see them as a convenience item and for those that can afford them - nice to have. Instead I carry plenty of 2x8 and 2x10 for leveling purposes. I stay at state parks alot and have been in some pretty unlevel sites but always managed to level up using boards under the wheels. I used to have a Class A that had hyd jacks and I still found myself having to place boards under them in order to level up as the jacks did not have enough range of movement.

ols1932 · 03-12-2011, 02:43 AM

I guess I don't understand Lippert saying your frame should not be setting on hydraulic jacks. What's the difference between sitting on electric jacks (OEM) or hydraulic jacks? It seems to me that a jack is a jack no matter where it's located. The BigFoot jacks behind the wheels seem to take a lot of the "frame stress" out of the rig. I have an older rig and the BigFoot leverlers work just fine. Pricey though.

Orv

Phil P · 03-12-2011, 06:01 AM

Hi

Well how about giving me some information.

Where do I find the 4 digit model number that I see a lot of you using?

The only name I find on my unit anywhere is Montana.

Phil P

Phil P · 03-12-2011, 07:21 AM

OK

I found a Gold Medallion sticker on the side of the trailer that reads: 10th Anniversary Limited Edition 3665RE.

Phil P

helmick · 03-12-2011, 08:11 AM

Phil P
We have a 3400, if you do a unit comparison on the Montana home page with your unit everything look the same.
I know a lot of 3400 have leveling system, I just don`t understand what you are being told. We used our Lippert
Leveling System about 40 times now with no problems. I would call Lippert and ask for Jarod Lippert and find out
what is different about the 3665 frame.

Phil P · 03-12-2011, 09:08 AM

Hello Mr. Helmick

Thanks for your interest.

There is a lot of difference between the two.

I am told this is the first year they used the under slung frame that allowed the large cargo compartment under the bedroom / bathroom. I was also told the frame is all aluminum although I haven’t checked it with a magnet to see if that is true. I do know for the sizes of the trailer it is quite light in weight.

The large cargo compartment is why my wife changed her mind from a class A to the Fifth-Wheel trailer. She likes it from her view point and I have always preferred a trailer over a class A and on top of that the trailer was about $400,000 less in cost. LOL
Phil P

Clemson1881 · 03-12-2011, 09:43 AM

The framework in the walls, floors, and ceiling is all aluminum. The frame is not aluminum.

Phil P · 03-12-2011, 09:53 AM

Hello Clemson1881

Thanks for the information.

Like I said I haven’t checked the frame with a magnet to see. It doesn’t surprise me that it isn’t seeing as how most of the information given to me by the selling dealer and his maintenance personnel has been incorrect.

That large cargo compartment is real nice but I haven’t been able to get a weight limit from Lippert or Keystone for it they just tell me not to exceed the trailer weight. So I weigh it often.

Phil P

mhs4771 · 03-12-2011, 03:21 PM

Phil, I have a 2010 2955 that has the front drop frame and had the Lippert Level-Up system installed last fall. The install was done in Goshen at TrailerAir who had an exclusive contract with Lippert for the installation of the system. As mentioned, any system has limits and if the site is extremely rough you may still need to place blocks under the jack pads to increase the lift.

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