Battery Draining - Montana Owners Club

BeckCass · 06-09-2020, 10:09 AM

We have a 2019 Montana High Country 321MK. I remove the battery and store it in the basement of our house, charging it periodically over the winter. When we took it in for service in December, I installed the battery and got a low battery warning the next day when I was unhitching at the dealer. It went from the charger to the coach. They looked at it and said it was a bad battery and needed replacing (after 2 years). Had seen no issues with the new battery at our seasonal site until this past weekend when the awning wouldn't retract when we were leaving. Troubleshooting it I started at the awning motor and got 4.0 VDC. Traced that all the way back to the battery (probably should have started there). I have the battery on a charger right now, but where should I look to see where the drain is or why it isn't charging? Electrolyte level is good. I am getting around 2.0 - 2.4 VDC across one set of the wires leading to the battery. Is this the charging current? I don't want to park it at the dealer for weeks to get it looked at, so can I externally charge it for the summer?
Sorry for rambling. Looking forward for insight on what and where to check.

**AZ Traveler** · 06-09-2020, 10:41 AM

Beck,

It sounds like you have a single battery.

Were you connected to shore power at your seasonal site? With shore power connected you can tell if the converter is charging your battery by checking the battery voltage with the shore power connected and with it disconnected. The voltage will be higher (13.5+) with it connected if it is charging.

If the battery switch in your convenience center is disconnected the battery will not charge. The switch is disconnected if you can pull the key out.

If you did not have shore power and were boondocking, you are going to need a bigger battery bank and solar or a genny to recharge.

We need a little more info to help you diagnose.

Another option is calling a mobile tech.

steiny93 · 06-09-2020, 01:33 PM

yes you can externally charge the battery, no worries with that

For measuring draw you should be measuring amps vs volts; sub 100 milliamps would be totally acceptable but if you have a few lp detectors it'll likely be higher. To kill a battery in a day I would guess your in the 10's of amps draw (typical deep cycle takes a fair amount of draw to kill it in a day).

To find the draw, measure amps with your multi-meter inline on the negative side of the battery. Start with the master switch off. You should see a small draw (say sub 1 amp). Then turn on the master and remeasure; now you should see a draw of a few to many amps. At that point you'll want to go to the 12 volt fuse panel and start pulling them until the draw goes away, that will be your issue.

For charging; measure the volts at the battery, then plug in the 5th wheel and measure the volts at the battery, you should see the volts go from sub 12 volt to greater then 12 volt as the 5th wheel charges the battery. (you can also see this via your Level-Up panel)

I'd do the following
1) verify the onboard inverter is working and it is charging the battery when the 5th wheel is plugged into shore power. You can use the volt reading on your Level Up panel to test this (it'll go up with you plug in the coach)
2) measure the draw on the battery when its in the 5th wheel and everything is off (should be under 1amp, preferably sub 200 milliamps)

rohrmann · 06-09-2020, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeckCass

We have a 2019 Montana High Country 321MK. I remove the battery and store it in the basement of our house, charging it periodically over the winter. When we took it in for service in December, I installed the battery and got a low battery warning the next day when I was unhitching at the dealer. It went from the charger to the coach. They looked at it and said it was a bad battery and needed replacing (after 2 years). Had seen no issues with the new battery at our seasonal site until this past weekend when the awning wouldn't retract when we were leaving. Troubleshooting it I started at the awning motor and got 4.0 VDC. Traced that all the way back to the battery (probably should have started there). I have the battery on a charger right now, but where should I look to see where the drain is or why it isn't charging? Electrolyte level is good. I am getting around 2.0 - 2.4 VDC across one set of the wires leading to the battery. Is this the charging current? I don't want to park it at the dealer for weeks to get it looked at, so can I externally charge it for the summer?
Sorry for rambling. Looking forward for insight on what and where to check.

When you put the battery back in, did you accidentally connect it backwards? If you did, even for a split second, you would have blown the reverse polarity fuses in the panel, and the CONVERTER will not charge the battery until those fuses are replaced.

BeckCass · 06-09-2020, 02:40 PM

Thanks for the quick replies. To give more info as requested:
We have a single battery. I hooked it up mid-April, fully charged, when we pulled it to our site, so this has been a slow drain versus the problem with the old battery.
We are on shore power at the seasonal site.
I will need to check the battery switch this weekend. If you hear a loud forehead slap from Ohio, that was the problem. If that's not it I'll look to see if I can isolate a larger draw.
Positive I hooked it up correctly.
I'll update this weekend.

beeje · 06-09-2020, 07:51 PM

If you have the means to supply shore power to your unit at home there is NO need to EVER remove the battery. Todays campers ( at least a decade back or more) have smart converter/chargers that will not over or under charge your battery. Your unit can stay plugged in 24/7 without issues.

However, you MUST periodically check the battery electrolyte level and add ONLY distilled water when needed. (once a month or so )

Daryles · 06-09-2020, 08:50 PM

Here is a link to Progressive Dynamics converter troubleshooting
PD converter troubleshooting
https://www.progressivedyn.com/suppo...ooting-guides/

It has testing procedures to test your convert output. Also the blink codes for the charge wizard (which mode it is in). You can press the button to make it switch modes.

BeckCass · 06-12-2020, 02:25 PM

Update:
Reinstalled the battery today. Looked at the battery lockout in the convenience center. It was turned so the key would not come out, but only about 90 degrees. This may be the culprit. Turned it the rest of the way. Voltage ready 12.9 with the trailer unplugged and 13.4 once shore power was restored. Will monitor it over the next few weeks.
Thanks for all your input.

Jeff n Susan · 06-12-2020, 03:27 PM

Sounds like ya got it!

beeje · 06-12-2020, 04:04 PM

Sounds like you may have figured it out. In my humble opinion there was really no need to ever move that switch. Even with it disconnected the batteries will still be drained because of items like CO2 and propane detectors wired directly to the battery

CFDFireman90 · 06-12-2020, 07:56 PM

If you store your battery in the basement during the off season, I’ve heard that you should never leave it on a concrete floor. My understanding is it will kill a battery. Put it on a shelf or a piece of wood.

rohrmann · 06-12-2020, 10:00 PM

Battery cases are made of plastic now instead of a rubber compound, and most manufacturers now recommend storing batteries on a concrete floor to keep them cooler. https://northeastbattery.com/batteri...ors-need-know/

ejerni · 06-17-2020, 02:34 PM

If the basement has a concrete floor, that will ruin your battery. We always put a piece of cardboard under it.

steiny93 · 06-17-2020, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ejerni

If the basement has a concrete floor, that will ruin your battery. We always put a piece of cardboard under it.

Here is an article on concrete and batteries https://www.mcgill.ca/oss/article/ge...tored-concrete

Basically, not any more with modern batteries.

jtcurbo · 06-17-2020, 07:21 PM

Stieny93 are you storing the battery on a cement floor? That is not good for the battery. I was taught always put it on a board or card board. I don't know the physics behind this, but, mechanics have told me that. This may have nothing to do with your situation.

steiny93 · 06-18-2020, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jtcurbo

Stieny93 are you storing the battery on a cement floor? That is not good for the battery. I was taught always put it on a board or card board. I don't know the physics behind this, but, mechanics have told me that. This may have nothing to do with your situation.

I'm not the OP, I was just replying within the thread; I seen the notes about concrete and wanted to dispel a myth.

jtcurbo · 06-18-2020, 02:23 PM

Stieny93, thanks for the info on storing a battery on cement floor. I've been living with a myth for most of my life. LOL

Drdon1057 · 06-21-2020, 05:08 PM

One test I always do is with a volt meter pop the fill caps on battery and starting at one side put one lead on bat. Post and the other in the water in first cell. Write down what you get continuing to next cell etc. Till you touch opposite post. Then start at that post and go the other way. You should got a similar reading from cell to cell. If you were to get the same reading the next cell ie.2 4 4 6 8 10 you probably have a dead cell. Granted its going to be 1.8 1.6 etc. Not exactly the same bit close within .5 of a volt. Been working on automotive and heavy equipment for 40+ years and it's helped me. Good Luck

tedken · 02-27-2022, 05:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rohrmann

When you put the battery back in, did you accidentally connect it backwards? If you did, even for a split second, you would have blown the reverse polarity fuses in the panel, and the CONVERTER will not charge the battery until those fuses are replaced.

Are those fuses easily accessible?

RMcNeal · 02-27-2022, 06:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tedken

Are those fuses easily accessible?

On our converter, they are 3 of the round glass bus style fuses off to the side of the blade style fuses. They should be readily accessible with the door to the converter open. If memory serves, these are the only fuses of this type in the box. Everything else is an automotive blade type fuse.
Sorry, that was our old one, found a troubleshooting guide I downloaded from somewhere with pictures of the fuses. The new ones are also automotive blade style fuses.

You may also like: