Another truck question..

[ctwebb]

Hi All , We are looking to upgrade the 5ver, I have a 08 f-250 6.4 diesel. GVWR is 10,000 pounds. We ran the truck across a CAT scale , total weight with me a the DW , full tank of gas weighed in at 8800 pounds, Am I right with max allowed for pin weight of 1200 pounds?
Thanks for any comments.
Chris.

[mhs4771]

You are 100% correct, now you see the 250/2500 trap, power to pull, but no capacity for pin weight.

[PackerFan]

That exactly why I got rid of my 2500 and switched to a 3500. Seen a lot of folks towing these bigger rigs with 2500's and they are mostly overloaded.

[JABURKHOLDER]

There is a lot that goes into figuring out capacities, but the simple math works best. You are absolutely correct in your calculation.
Just to help bring it home for you...
I have a 2016 3791RD whose shipping weight is 13,200lbs. The minimum pin weight would be 1,980lbs. That means that towing my empty, no water, no propane RV, with your truck, you would already be overloaded by 780lbs.


This thread might get out of control with a lot of varied opinions. Hang on for that potential.

[mtlakejim]

Originally Posted by JABURKHOLDER

There is a lot that goes into figuring out capacities, but the simple math works best. You are absolutely correct in your calculation.
Just to help bring it home for you...
I have a 2016 3791RD whose shipping weight is 13,200lbs. The minimum pin weight would be 1,980lbs. That means that towing my empty, no water, no propane RV, with your truck, you would already be overloaded by 780lbs.


This thread might get out of control with a lot of varied opinions. Hang on for that potential.

Pass the popcorn.....

[ctwebb]

lol , with this calculation , I would assume the 350/3500s would also be overloaded at the pin. Doesn't the 1-ton gain approx another 12 to 1400 lbs? that ould put their max pin at around 25 or 2600 lb max ? Most of these fiver after all the gear loaded will easily be close to 3000lbs or more.

[JABURKHOLDER]

Originally Posted by ctwebb

lol , with this calculation , I would assume the 350/3500s would also be overloaded at the pin. Doesn't the 1-ton gain approx another 12 to 1400 lbs? that ould put their max pin at around 25 or 2600 lb max ? Most of these fiver after all the gear loaded will easily be close to 3000lbs or more.

Ok, simple math. My F350 dually has a GVWR of 14,000lbs.
Loaded with fuel, passengers, hitch, tool box, etc, the truck weighs 9,400lbs.
That leaves 4,600lbs available for cargo (or pin weight).
My 3791RD has a GVWR of 16,900lbs.
Recommended pin weight is 15 - 25% of the weight of the RV.
Assuming the 25% weight, that would be 4,225lbs.
I still have 375lbs available for cargo.

THIS IN NO WAY IS AN ENDORSEMENT FOR A DUALLY.
I'm just doing the math with what I have.
Please don't shoot the messenger.

[twindman]

Wow, you have a heavy truck! My 2012 Silverado 2500 weighs around 7900 with DW and almost full tank.

[mtlakejim]

Originally Posted by ctwebb

Hi All , We are looking to upgrade the 5ver, I have a 08 f-250 6.4 diesel. GVWR is 10,000 pounds. We ran the truck across a CAT scale , total weight with me a the DW , full tank of gas weighed in at 8800 pounds, Am I right with max allowed for pin weight of 1200 pounds?
Thanks for any comments.
Chris.

Short answer:
Your math looks right. If your asking me, you need a bigger truck.

Long answer:

And this will spark a lot of heated debate but I don't care they can shoot at this messenger all they want, they know I shoot back!

Do some research and buy a truck that YOU feel SAFE in while towing!!! That typically means at a minimum make sure your within tow and payload specs. I would recommend that you give yourself a little extra safety cushion on top of that. Remember it isn't just how much you can pull up the hill it is how easy is it to stop going down the hill!!!

Everyone get your popcorn for the following:

I am not shy about my thoughts on the following but will state here for the record that they are aimed at inexperienced tow drivers that are asking what I think is the safest way to go if THE PRIMARY USE OF THEIR TRUCK IS TO TOW. Only YOU can determine if there is a need to deviate from this to match your own needs:

Long beds ride a little better than short beds and don't require special slider hitches. Short beds are slightly easier to park in an uptown parking garage.

Four Wheel Drive is not essential but sure is nice if you find yourself in an UNEXPECTED situation. Modern 4x4 trucks do not sit any higher or ride any rougher than 2x4. Likewise, modern 4x4 trucks do not incur any significant additional maintaince costs compared to their 2x4 counterparts. The additional cost of 4x4 is insignificant on your monthly payment and is more than offset by the much better resale value on the back end (not to mention a potential tow truck bill if you get stuck where the 4x4 would have saved you). You wear seatbelts to be prepared for the unexpected, get 4x4 for the same reason! In Arkansas you have to special order 2x4 on trucks.....

Dually vs single rear wheel. Load spread out over two more tires, yep. Dually more stable under load, yes. Dually will stop under better control while LOADED, yes (at least I think so). SRW easier to park at the beauty shop, yes. SRW less likely to get a ding in the rear fender, yes. Another analogy, stand with your feet together and have someone push your shoulder, when you stand back up spread your feet and have them shove you. That is why I own a dually for towing!

Ford vs Ram vs Chevy etc.....That's up to you brother they are all good trucks. I have been fairly loyal to Ford but when I made the jump to diesel I went Ram to get the tried and true Cummins and the factory 25K 4 point hitch. I don't hold anything against the other brands and will most likely buy a Ford next time I need a 1/2 ton daily driver.

One last thought: Safety isn't limited to just the tow truck. You might want to look into disc brakes and better quality "G" rated tires for the trailer! I wish I had looked at this Forum BEFORE I bought my 2018 camper. There is about 5K in SAFETY related mods. that I wish I could have rolled into the note!!! Do a lot of reading on here BEFORE you buy anything!

[ctwebb]

I just done a quick search for F-350 GVWR. it says 11,400. That is only 1,400 more than a F-250. That tells me a F-350 SWR will max out pin weight at 2,600 lbs. So am I right that most F-350 / 3500 are also over their pin weight.

[Phil P]

Hi

before you get to far into this remember the F250 and the SRW F350 use the same Sterling 10.5 rear axle. This axle is much lighter than the Dana 80 used in the F350 DRW.

Also I am managing a fleet of 4X4 F150 to F550 and the 4X4 does incur more maintenance expense than the 4X2. I just picked up new “U” joints for the drive shaft to the front axle on a F150 4X4.

I haven’t had to change the “U” joints in the front drive line on my 4X2 in 200,000 miles. LOL

Phil P

[mtlakejim]

Originally Posted by Phil P

Hi

before you get to far into this remember the F250 and the SRW F350 use the same Sterling 10.5 rear axle. This axle is much lighter than the Dana 80 used in the F350 DRW.

Also I am managing a fleet of 4X4 F150 to F550 and the 4X4 does incur more maintenance expense than the 4X2. I just picked up new “U” joints for the drive shaft to the front axle on a F150 4X4.

I haven’t had to change the “U” joints in the front drive line on my 4X2 in 200,000 miles. LOL

Phil P

I wouldn’t qualify a u joint as SIGNIFICANT.....

[mtlakejim]

So how much more capacity does a dually have compared to an SRW?

[RoadRunnerTR21]

Originally Posted by mtlakejim

So how much more capacity does a dually have compared to an SRW?

That's the question the OP needs to answer. SRW vs DRW makes a difference in capacity.

[mhs4771]

Dually GVWR: Newer Fords and Rams are 14000, while GM is 13025 for '17 & '18, 13000 '11 to '16. Giving them capacity of 4000 to 5000 typical depending on trim levels and options.

[RoadRunnerTR21]

That is correct. My truck is 14,000 GVWR.

[mtlakejim]

Originally Posted by mhs4771

Dually GVWR: Newer Fords and Rams are 14000, while GM is 13025 for '17 & '18, 13000 '11 to '16. Giving them capacity of 4000 to 5000 typical depending on trim levels and options.

How does that compare to SRW

[richfaa]

Originally Posted by JABURKHOLDER

Ok, simple math. My F350 dually has a GVWR of 14,000lbs.
Loaded with fuel, passengers, hitch, tool box, etc, the truck weighs 9,400lbs.
That leaves 4,600lbs available for cargo (or pin weight).
My 3791RD has a GVWR of 16,900lbs.
Recommended pin weight is 15 - 25% of the weight of the RV.
Assuming the 25% weight, that would be 4,225lbs.
I still have 375lbs available for cargo.

THIS IN NO WAY IS AN ENDORSEMENT FOR A DUALLY.
I'm just doing the math with what I have.
Please don't shoot the messenger.

We are the same as you but our truck fully loaded is 200lbs less plenty of room for pin weight.Numbers do not lie but one has to know the numbers and how to calculate them.

[JABURKHOLDER]

Originally Posted by mtlakejim

How does that compare to SRW

Depending on the trucks GVWR there can be as much as 3,000lbs greater cargo weight capacity for DRW vs SRW.
(this is comparing 2016 F350's)

[Phil P]

Originally Posted by mtlakejim

I wouldn’t qualify a u joint as SIGNIFICANT.....

I would suggest you call Ford ask for a quote the change the "U" joint in the drive shaft to the front wheels on your 2017 F350.

You may find out how significant it can be the last quote I got was just under $350.

So I did the job myself the $10.89 part is not the cost factor they have put shielding around that shaft to prevent stuff from wrapping up on the shaft. Too bad they didn’t consider putting the fasteners where it was convenient to get a wrench on them.


Phil P