Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 

Go Back   Montana Owners Club - Keystone Montana 5th Wheel Forum > GENERAL DISCUSSIONS > Tow Vehicles & Towing
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 10-21-2011, 06:47 PM   #1
blondeegal
New Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Arroyo Grande
Posts: 7
M.O.C. #11887
Montana Towing

We are considering the purchase of a new Montana 3100RL with a 12,000 lb shipping weight and a 2200 lb hitch weight. We currently own a 2011 Chevy Silverado 2500 HD Duramax. Would like some feedback from anyone who may have this same truck with same or close to same Montana.
(We are new to the forum...)

Thanks!

Art
 
blondeegal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2011, 07:55 PM   #2
DQDick
Site Team
 
DQDick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Wilsey
Posts: 18,799
M.O.C. #11455
I notice a number of people have looked and no one has responded yet so all I can say is what we have is close. We have a 2010 3665RE shipping weight of 12,500# etc. We tow it with a 2011 Dodge 2500 HD with a cummins diesel and exhaust brake. I like the way it tows and handles. Hopefully someone with the same or similar rig will be along for you soon.
__________________
Dick, Joyce, Diego, Picatso and Gustav
2017 3720 RL, and 2013 HC 343RL
Pullrite Hitch, IS, Disk Brakes, 3rd AC, Winegard Traveler, Bathroom door mod, Dometic 320, couch for desk swap, replaced chairs, sun screens, added awnings, etc.
DQDick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 02:18 AM   #3
tim43
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Fayetteville
Posts: 657
M.O.C. #9178
For peace of mind and rear axle weight purposes, I'd consider moving up to a one ton vehicle. Doesn't take long to go over the rated TV rear axle weight with a Montana. As someone on this forum said, it takes away the liability issue by moving up to a one ton vehicle.
tim43 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 03:55 AM   #4
CamillaMichael
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Land O Lakes
Posts: 2,783
M.O.C. #10246
Quote:
quote:Originally posted by tim43

For peace of mind and rear axle weight purposes, I'd consider moving up to a one ton vehicle. Doesn't take long to go over the rated TV rear axle weight with a Montana. As someone on this forum said, it takes away the liability issue by moving up to a one ton vehicle.
Agree...you might also want to keep in mind, as many on this site have noted, the hitch/pin weight shown from factory is almost always way light from what you will experience on the road.
CamillaMichael is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 04:37 AM   #5
kdeiss
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Englewood
Posts: 3,095
M.O.C. #164
2500HD 3/4 Heavy Duty Vs 3500HD 1 ton
1 ton has an additional leaf spring,higher weight cap tires and wheels brakes,axels frame etc are the same.
Remember you have a Heavy Duty 3/4 ton not a 3/4 ton
kdeiss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 05:47 AM   #6
mlh
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Salem
Posts: 7,528
M.O.C. #2283
52% of the people who have responded to our pole Which truck do you pull your Fiver with, pull with a 3/4 ton truck. 70% use a SRW truck.
Lynwood
__________________
www.harrellsprec.com
Lynwood Harrell
323 RL HC 2008 F250
mlh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 07:52 AM   #7
dpam
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Calgary
Posts: 351
M.O.C. #10119
You didn't indicate whether your truck is a 4X4 crew cab and whether you have a 6.5 ft box. A crew cab truck with a 6.5 ft box has a GVWR of 10,000 lbs. I had a 2008 GMC (GVWR 9200 lbs) crew cab 6.5 ft box with LT265 tires and I towed a 2010 3150RL. Your trucks GVWR might be 800lbs greater than my old 2008 truck, and the trailers are about the same shipping weight, although your pin weight is heavier. When I towed with the 2008 GMC I was approximately 900 lbs over the truck GVWR, so being that your 2011 has a GVWR of 10,000 lbs you might be okay. The 2008 GMC truck had the power to handle the 3150RL, and the truck seemed stable towing 900lbs over the GVWR, but I felt I had too much trailer for the 2500HD truck. From a safety and legality perspective I was uncomfortable being over the GVWR by 900 lbs, so I sold the 2008 GMC and bought a 2011 GMC Denali one ton.
__________________
DPAM
2017 GMC Denali diesel, crewcab, 4x4, regular box.
2010 Montana 3150RL- Moving to Montana Package , Hickory Edition Package, wet bolts
dpam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 09:51 AM   #8
Montana Sky
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Down the Road
Posts: 5,627
M.O.C. #889
I towed my 3400RL with my 2500HD from 2004 - 2009 without issue. The only thing you can do is look at the weight ratings and make a decision as to what you are comfortable with. The Duramax will handle any Montana you put behind it, the question really comes down to the kingpin weight on the truck. I've since traded the Chevy 2500HD in and have moved to the 1 ton for the simple reason of I know I am going to trade the 3400RL in for something newer and heavier.
Montana Sky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 09:57 AM   #9
blondeegal
New Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Arroyo Grande
Posts: 7
M.O.C. #11887
Thank you to all so far who have taken the time to reply. Just to clarify-ours is a 2 wheel drive with a 6.5 bed extended cab and the GVWR is 10,000#.
Thanks again.
blondeegal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 09:59 AM   #10
Weldon
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: San Angelo
Posts: 115
M.O.C. #11213
I pull with 05 D/A 2500. We have a 2010 347 THT Mountaineer. I have put a chip (Banks) & overloads on the PU. I run good tires & do not drive fast (55). It works for me but might not for someone else.
Weldon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 11:25 AM   #11
Art-n-Marge
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Murrieta
Posts: 5,816
M.O.C. #9257
Send a message via MSN to Art-n-Marge Send a message via Yahoo to Art-n-Marge
First problem is that anyone is looking at the shipping weight. After you tow that beast home it will NEVER weigh what it was when it is shipped to the dealer. Hopefully you never get the the GVWR or at least stay under it, but you should base the weight your truck is towing by the GVWR, NOT the shipping weight. You'll be putting gear, kitchen stuff, and all kinds of items you want to keep in the trailer - including tools, gadgets and all kinds of things that will ADD weight. This is why one never looks at the shipping weight. There will also be occasions that you tow with full tanks and that adds heavy weight real fast. The shipping weight is what sales people use to sell the rig to unsuspecting owners. Weight problems are not sales issues, they are owner issues.

Please post the GVWR and then we can respond with a better answer. We'll also need to know what your truck currently weighs, especially at the rear axle, but these days, a 3/4 ton will be overloaded. Then you get to decide if you want to be overloaded or not. Some people are, I know I'm not. It goes beyond liability. If you have a mishap you could be responsible for everything because of neglect. You are responsible for maintaining weights and since I know mishaps can occur under normal conditions why push it?

The best thing to do is look at the GVWR and calculate 15% to 25% of this weight will be on the rear axle. When you consider that the same engine and transmissions are used in many weight classes of trucks, why then don't all trucks have the same weight ratings? It's because there are many other factors besides a badass motor and proven transmission that tows the weight of a trailer or a load. There's wheels, tires, axles, brakes, u-joints, drive shaft, differential, etc., etc., etc. and just cuz one of these is a beast (like the engine and trans and maybe the tires and wheels) doesn't mean the all of them are strong enough.

Welcome to the forum, blondegirl named "Art", from a brunette and gray haired (or what's left of it) guy named "Art".

Art-n-Marge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 01:50 PM   #12
brenkco
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Lincoln
Posts: 856
M.O.C. #8154
Here is the exercise I just went through. On a recent trip to Oregon, I had a chance to weigh the truck & trailer. I weighed the total truck, then just the rear axels. Next I weighed the total trailer and last, just the rear axel. I was amazed how far over weight I was. More later. When I got home, I had pulled the hitch out for service (a pullrite super glide), filled the rig with fuel and headed down to the local scales.

The truck (2006 Dodge Larime 2500) with no hitch or passengers weighed 7200 lbs. The GVWR of the truck was 9000 lbs, leaving me just 1800 lbs for the hitch, driver, passenger, cargo and pin weight of the trailer. Not even close. The specs of the truck according to the book had 2000 lbs carrying (payload capacity). I also made the mistake of relying on the specs of the trailer, which showed a pin weight of 2200 lbs. I figured I might have been over between 200-300 lbs which i thought would be within tolerances.

As Art points out, my naiveté was relying on printed specs. The truck towed and handled just fine but in all reality I was 1600 lbs over. I was at the limit on the rear axel rating and 20 lbs over the front.

I really loved my old truck for a few reasons, the biggest one is that it was paid for. I was concerned about the safety factor as well as the potential damage I could be doing to the truck. I just took delivery of a 2012 Ford F350 SRW. It doesn't have the payload capacity of the DRW but I will be within specs, barely.

I just had the hitch installed, filled the rig with fuel and headed back down to the scales. The truck weighed in at 8300 lbs, no passengers. With a GVWR of 11,500, that leaves me 3200 lbs for passengers and pin weight. Ford specs shows the carrying capacity of this truck to be 4000 lbs which according to their literature includes one 150 lb driver and a full tank of fuel, no options. Ford actually publishes the weight for each and every option so in reality had I taken the time to add all of them up, the difference might not have been as great.

Bottom line is that, as it has been stated so many times on this forum, the proof is in the actual numbers of the truck and trailer. Hope this might help.
brenkco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 02:19 PM   #13
blondeegal
New Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Arroyo Grande
Posts: 7
M.O.C. #11887
OK! I have been discovered!! I write these messages for my husband ART, and I am Blondeegal! Bet this keeps everyone wondering!
All kidding aside, we both have been really enjoying all of the comments provided by everyone, and can not tell you have helpful this forum has been.
We are starting to realize we are not ready to become Montana owners YET! We just bought our pick up last year, and do not want to get rid of it yet, so we are thinking we need to find a new RV more within our parameters of the truck we have. Next time around we will buy the truck with the Montana in mind.
Thank you to all-we appreciate the helpful info.
blondeegal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 02:28 PM   #14
pineranch
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Navarre
Posts: 1,527
M.O.C. #9765
Blondeegal,
Beware of anyone telling you a 3/4 ton will tow a Monty that comes off the line over 12K "just fine". They are ME and on a river in Egypt. I found myself well over GCVW limit without hardly any fluids in the RV. I blew well past the truck rear axle limit. I too towed my 14000 RV "just fine" through most eastern and western mountain passes. It came down to my "liability issue". If I so much as scratched another vehicle while overweight I knew something real bad could and probably would happen. I "finally" chose to get out from under my self imposed "dark cloud" and now have a F-350 DRW with a GCVW of 30k. Overkill, I guess but I sleep much better. I was one of the worst on this forum defending my 3/4 ton air bagged out overloaded F-250. It's GCVW limit was 23k and I suspect the 2500's are less. I feel better now.
Mike
pineranch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 02:49 PM   #15
Art-n-Marge
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Murrieta
Posts: 5,816
M.O.C. #9257
Send a message via MSN to Art-n-Marge Send a message via Yahoo to Art-n-Marge
Wow, Mike. I didn't know the other guy's name while I was floating down that river in Egypt. I was that other guy.

Fortunately, I was only over by a few hundred pounds in my older, lighter rig and was able to apply the hardware, wheels and tires to allow upgrading my SRW F-250 to a SRW F-350 since I quickly learned air bags were NOT the solution even though some other idiot sales guy told me that's all I needed. Upgrading the GVWR cannot always be done and since I did not complete the recertification to the new weight ratings I can only use my rig for personal use and that's just fine with me.

I didn't have the funds to buy a DRW but if I wasn't retired, then I would have. Oh well, I've used the extra money saved for golf lessons. I should have upgraded to a DRW because the golf lessons have only made me more dangerous to be around.

See Blondeegal? Some of us read all the details in a post. What mostly caught my attention is your husband's name is Art, just like mine. But I know he's not me because last I checked my wife is brunette. I think women who marry Arts are pretty smart.

I'm saddened you will not be a Monty owner, but there are other Montys that might fit the weight requirements, so don't give up on us too quick. There's High Country and Montaineer versions of Montanas, for example. We do appreciate you trying to be compliant. We gotta be careful and safe when driving our 11.5 tons or more of fun down (and up) the roads.
Art-n-Marge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2011, 03:20 PM   #16
Phil P
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Okeechobee
Posts: 2,150
M.O.C. #11206
Hi

When fully loaded we weight 23,000. We weight at the beginning of every long trip. We use the Montana at least once a month during the winter and do our long trips in the summer. We don’t weigh for the local trips.

23,000 lbs is the heaveyest weight we have ever weighed. At that weight we are under the 23,500 Gross Combination Weight Rating and within about 50 lbs of the front axel weight rating and several hundred under the rear axel weight rating.

As GM advised us when we purchased the TV using a fifth wheel hitch mounted at GM’s recommended location you will not over loaded the TV as long as you don’t exceed the GCW or any axel weights.

The Montana is probably one of the best RV type trailers I have ever weighed. They have the trailer axels located so the trailer load is distributed very close the optimum location.

Phil P
__________________
2009 Montana 3665RE
2009 Duramax 3500 DRW quad cab
personal web page https://www.sallyscoffees.com
If you get a page not available then remove the "s" after HTTP
Phil P is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2011, 05:08 AM   #17
RickW
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Wylie
Posts: 532
M.O.C. #9139
My advise is if you plan on keeping the truck for a long time, buy more truck than you need. In RVing most people upgrade when they buy a new RV, very few downgrade. Unless you want to have to worry about a new truck also if/when you upgrade just go ahead and do it.

Also my F250 would pull my 3400RL. Stopping/handling are two different issues. But I also found my maintenance costs also went up on the F250 when pulling the 3400RL vs my smaller SOB I previously had.
RickW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2011, 10:54 AM   #18
Sinterior
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Kamloops
Posts: 337
M.O.C. #9238
GM has increased the GVWR considerably for the 2011 and up 2500HD and 3500HD trucks, but, they also weigh 700lbs more than the pre 2011 trucks. The body is the same, but the new trucks have much heavier frames, as well as suspension and brake up grades.
The GVWR for a 2011 3500HD SRW Duramax is 11500lbs, but IIRC is 10800 for a gas truck.
I don't know if the 2500HD have different GVWR for diesel and gas engines.
Sinterior is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2011, 07:52 PM   #19
Art-n-Marge
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Murrieta
Posts: 5,816
M.O.C. #9257
Send a message via MSN to Art-n-Marge Send a message via Yahoo to Art-n-Marge
Yes I can confirm that for all the big three I have seen enough tables that show if you use a gas engine on the same truck the weight ratings will drop every time. This is one way to know that a diesel is just more of a workhorse than a gas engine. And here's the rub, because of his everything associated with diesel will be way more expensive that a gasser, even though it doesn't cost any more to build an engine and it's cheaper to process diesel fuel than unleaded (or it used to be, things are changing fast now that diesel fuel is getting cleaner).

For a diesel, the engine is pretty strong on the different models. The ratings are then impacted by the differential, number of tires/wheels, suspension, leaf springs and brackets, the frame and maybe some other components (bearings, brakes, shocks etc. might all be bigger and better on larger trucks). Just know there are differences which is why the ratings are not the same.

BTW - two different people at different Ford dealers said that adding air bags will solve the overweight issue when I first found out I was overweight. However, I was puzzled and contacted the Firestone airbag people who said, they are wrong and they wish there was some way to stop this incorrect information from being distributed. Air bags only improve the ride, raise the truck aspect, correct the headlight aim and things like that. They do NOT increase any ratings.
Art-n-Marge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2011, 03:39 PM   #20
mlh
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Salem
Posts: 7,528
M.O.C. #2283
Art did I understand you to say it cost the same to build a gas and a diesel engine? It actually cost much more to build a diesel engine. The parts are heavier and harder to machine. A diesel engine is built out of a much higher nickle content in the cast iron making it harder to machine. The new Ford 6.7 engine is built out of compacted graphite iron. This engine would have been impossible to build on a production basis 15 years ago. Now thanks to new cutting tools, new grades of carbide and coatings on them and multi million dollar machine tools it now can be done. Fifteen years ago only one cylinder could be machined with each tool, then you had to change tools reset that tool then manually check and re bore that cylinder. With the new machines the machine will bore all 8 cylinders check each one re bore when necessary. They will even change tools when necessary. In the machine shop industry its called lights out. You set the machine up push the cycle start button, cut the lights off and go home. If a tool breaks the machine will call you on the phone you get up go fix it cut the lights off and go home.
I don't have this type of machines but I know a little about what is going on in the industry. I have been in the machine shop industry for over 45 years and in business for my self for over 30 years.
Lynwood
__________________
www.harrellsprec.com
Lynwood Harrell
323 RL HC 2008 F250
mlh is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Towing A 2013 Montana With A Short Bed johncamtravel Tow Vehicles & Towing 32 01-16-2017 04:17 AM
Towing Montana 3150RL with GMC 2500 Duramax dpam Tow Vehicles & Towing 15 02-16-2010 06:47 AM
towing behind montana possible? russd Tow Vehicles & Towing 37 09-12-2006 06:27 PM
Soon to purchase Montana/towing question Montana_5541 General Discussions about our Montanas 17 03-28-2006 09:13 AM
towing montana Montana_4859 Tow Vehicles & Towing 11 10-30-2005 10:13 AM

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Montana RV, Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:33 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.