Help - Montana Owners Club

Chorleycakes · 03-12-2020, 06:37 PM

Hi folks. And I thank you for this terrific forum. My name is Bobby my wife is Jane. We live in Maine and started rv ing about two years ago, with a 28 ft mallard. So we found out real quick that this is way too small for us, so we dove into trading the mallard for a 3780rl Montana that we will be picking up March 18th with a five hundred $ deposit. Is there a check list on here I can use during the walk-through to HELP me on 3/18/2020 we did not sign any papers yet and thought you could help a couple of rookies out. Thanks again for any help with that model. Bobby.

mtlakejim · 03-12-2020, 07:33 PM

Well you did one thing right to start with. You did NOT sign any papers. Right now you still have all the power. You can walk away if you have too. Keep it that way. Once you sign then you are totally at the mercy of the dealership to repair any issues and trust me they won't be in any hurry once they have your name on the dotted line. Stand your ground and absolutely positively refuse to sign anything until you have done a very through walk thru with the power on and water hooked up. Completely fill all tanks and operate everything multiple times. Don't let them rush you. In fact if they don't start your walk thru till the afternoon then come back the next morning!! Only after you have inspected the rig very thoroughly and THEY HAVE FIXED EVERYTHING you identify during the walk thru then and only then sign. If they suggest you can take it to a campground and bring it back with any other issues and they will fix them promptly, have them put that in writing and make sure it has a deadline with some sort of penalty for them if they don't get an issue fixed. Right now is the time to get all the concessions and issues taken care of because once you have signed and driven it off the lot the difference in their attitude will be night and day.

I know a lot of folks on here would say I should not be so cynical and down on the dealers but you have to stand up for yourself and not believe anything the dealers don't put in writing. Trust me their only goal is to get you to sign and out the door, those smiles are only there to meet that objective they are NOT your friends. It doesn't mean you have to be ugly. Just treat it like the business deal it is!!

**DQDick** · 03-12-2020, 07:36 PM

Several PDI checklists are available on the first page of the forum. Video your PDI so you can refer back to it later. Also pay attention to things other than what they are showing you. We found a cracked landing gear on our first Monty.

**Carl n Susan** · 03-12-2020, 09:07 PM

One of the better PDI checklists can be found here: https://www.montanaowners.com/forums...ight=checklist

You can do a Search with "pdi checklist" as keywords and finf more information.

Jeff n Susan · 03-13-2020, 05:35 AM

Congratulations! The one thing I would recommend is the very extensive PDI described in the forum. ALSO... one of the biggest things, is to not let your emotions get in the way! I realize its an exciting time, as we personally are going thru that ourselves with our new unit, but you have to set the emotions aside and be thorough! Most of the dealers are pushy and only want the unit sold. Well, its not sold until you sign! YOU are in control, not them!
Once again! Congrats!

MidMOTraveler · 03-13-2020, 06:50 AM

Welcome! I might add that if something needs repaired or corrected you don’t sign the final contract.
At the very least get it in writing with a guaranteed completion date.
Once signed things seem to slow down.

We had a refrigerator door that had damage and it took 2 months after signing to finally get it replaced.

GILAELKHUNTER · 03-13-2020, 11:10 AM

everyone has given you very good info. I might add that be sure and run furnace and a/c no matter what. When we bought our HC it was a 95 degree day and didn't run the furnace, two days down the road it was a 30 degree morning and went to turn on furnace and nothing. Come to find out there were parts missing and it took 2 months to get them to send the parts. Also I hope you are buying close to home so you can go back to the selling dealer for warranty and repairs, we bought 700 miles from home and can't just run it back for this and that, and they knew that when we purchased. Luckily I have found a pretty good service dept. within 200 miles that has helped me tremendously.

mtlakejim · 03-13-2020, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GILAELKHUNTER

everyone has given you very good info. I might add that be sure and run furnace and a/c no matter what. When we bought our HC it was a 95 degree day and didn't run the furnace, two days down the road it was a 30 degree morning and went to turn on furnace and nothing. Come to find out there were parts missing and it took 2 months to get them to send the parts. Also I hope you are buying close to home so you can go back to the selling dealer for warranty and repairs, we bought 700 miles from home and can't just run it back for this and that, and they knew that when we purchased. Luckily I have found a pretty good service dept. within 200 miles that has helped me tremendously.

Very good points on the A/C and Furnace. Be sure to test EVERY appliance and system multiple times. Slides, cooktop, water system etc etc....there are some good checklists out there USE THEM!!

But respectfully, I am going to have to disagree with GILAELKHunter on his last point of buying from the nearest dealer. To get the very best price I strongly encourage you to make this a commodity deal and get QUOTES from at least 3 or more dealers!!! If you walk into the nearest dealer and throw yourself on their mercy your going to pay way to much (as in thousands if not 10s of thousands)!! Get the very best price and buy from that dealer even if they are across the country (within reason of course based on the savings). Make sure you do a very through walk thru with that dealer and have them fix all the original issues before you take ownership. BUT after that find a SERVICE ONLY business locally to do your work in the future. Trust me you will save thousands on the front end and get much better service over the life of your unit if you take this approach!

Just remember that the vast majority (not all but most) sales dealerships only have a service department to support sales. Once they have sold you a unit they could care less about you. DO NOT believe that "we will take better care of you or your a priority if you buy from us BS". Every single salesman is taught to give you that line of BS and some even believe it because they have ZERO idea what their service department does.

Repeating from above: I know some folks on here will hammer me for being so cynical about sales dealerships. Again, I am not suggesting being rude to anyone but you have to remember this is a business transaction. Those smiling salesmen are working on commission and are trying their best to get you to sign at as high a $$ as they can. Your job is to push the sale to a commodity bid at as low $$ out the door as you can. Your only real power is the ability to walk away.

GILAELKHUNTER · 03-13-2020, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mtlakejim

Very good points on the A/C and Furnace. Be sure to test EVERY appliance and system multiple times. Slides, cooktop, water system etc etc....there are some good checklists out there USE THEM!!

But respectfully, I am going to have to disagree with GILAELKHunter on his last point of buying from the nearest dealer. To get the very best price I strongly encourage you to make this a commodity deal and get QUOTES from at least 3 or more dealers!!! If you walk into the nearest dealer and throw yourself on their mercy your going to pay way to much (as in thousands if not 10s of thousands)!! Get the very best price and buy from that dealer even if they are across the country (within reason of course based on the savings). Make sure you do a very through walk thru with that dealer and have them fix all the original issues before you take ownership. BUT after that find a SERVICE ONLY business locally to do your work in the future. Trust me you will save thousands on the front end and get much better service over the life of your unit if you take this approach!

Just remember that the vast majority (not all but most) sales dealerships only have a service department to support sales. Once they have sold you a unit they could care less about you. DO NOT believe that "we will take better care of you or your a priority if you buy from us BS". Every single salesman is taught to give you that line of BS and some even believe it because they have ZERO idea what their service department does.

I agree, get the best deal, and by getting quotes gives you buying power to take to the dealership. This is what I did when we purchased, it was that the closest dealer that had the model we wanted was 700 miles away, and my point was that I can't just run it up there 700 miles when I need something fixed. After purchase find a reputable service dept.

jimandlaurie · 03-13-2020, 07:11 PM

Welcome to the MOC and your new rig... I ditto fully what mtlakejim posted ...

Chorleycakes · 03-14-2020, 07:20 AM

Hi folks. Well that was a wake up call wow. First I would like to thank you all for your comments very helpful comments. I feel like I’m buying a used car from a sneaky old car salesman. I now see it’s all on myself and my wife to do this inspection which seems to be a little too much for us at our age. Are there people out there that you can trust enough to do the inspection for you and pay them a fee for the inspection.
I keep thinking of getting my deposit back and calling it a day and maybe look for something used maybe five years old from somebody I can trust. ?

Highs and lows. Never felt like this when I bought my first house. Thanks again Bobby.

DutchmenSport · 03-14-2020, 08:19 AM

No matter how many lists or PDI's you may use or go through, you will NOT find everything. It takes time to flush things out. Your PDI and checklists may point out the obvious, which is good, but ... just don't be surprised or taken aback when, a month down the road (literally), screws come out, things break, or something fails.

In the walls of my bedroom, almost immediately 3 staples started wiggling out. They weren't wiggled out when I first purchased the camper. It took about 8 months for the aluminum that wraps from the outside wall to the under belly came loose. Every hole where a screw was screwed into the frame was broken out. We were several hundred miles from home when I saw that aluminum wrapping just hanging. Why it didn't rip off in the wind is anyone guess. I found a creative way to temporary fix it by putting gigantic metal washers over each screw hole and used about 6 tubs of liquid nails. My temporary fix has lasted a year now. I guess it's permanent now.

Not to mention, the first trip out, the bedroom closet shelf broke and fell completely. Here again, we were several hundred miles from home (first trip out). I found a temporary fix, and later installed wooden boards that ran from the floor to the bottom of the shelves on each side and used a 1x12 as a middle support from the floor the to the bottom of the shelf.

Why did the shelf fall? It had only 4 small screws screwed into a wall that had a styrofoam middle.

Would any of these types of things been detected at the original inspection? No, not at all. How about a few months after purchase, one brake fell apart and ended up having to get new brakes, hubs, and the entire wheel replaced on both sides of the axle?

Or how about a broken Rayzor antenna exactly 364 days after purchase, and warranty fixed it, by 1 day margin. The stem inside the antenna that allows you to turn it just deteriorated and crumbled.

Or how about a broken slide cable that happened 364 days after purchase too, and by the margin of one day, warranty fixed the cable. (talk about "the skin of your teeth").

Yep, you can inspect and evaluate, and attempt to find every single little thing when you do our original purchase. Just beware, things will still unearth themselves later down the road.

It's for these reasons, I have always suggested when making a new purchase, it takes a year at least to flush everything out, especially if you plan on using your camper full time.

I learned one thing about my Montana. It was advertised as being a "full timer" camper. I learned what that means.... Yes, they are designed to be lived in full time, but they are not designed to "travel" in full time. Big difference. It takes a year. Just be aware and don't kick yourself when "IT" happens or bad mouth the entire RV industry for faulty workmanship. Bottom line.... it's already faulty. Only YOU can improve the camper after you get it.

jeffba · 03-14-2020, 09:54 AM

https://nrvia.org/locate/

You might want to start there. Given the amount of money you are about to spend they may be a good choice.

mtlakejim · 03-14-2020, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chorleycakes

Hi folks. Well that was a wake up call wow. First I would like to thank you all for your comments very helpful comments. I feel like I’m buying a used car from a sneaky old car salesman. I now see it’s all on myself and my wife to do this inspection which seems to be a little too much for us at our age. Are there people out there that you can trust enough to do the inspection for you and pay them a fee for the inspection.
I keep thinking of getting my deposit back and calling it a day and maybe look for something used maybe five years old from somebody I can trust. ?

Highs and lows. Never felt like this when I bought my first house. Thanks again Bobby.

Sorry for scaring you but it is best you go into the negotiations well armed with knowledge! Don't let it keep you from joining in with us on all of the fun of RV life though. You can get a reasonable deal on a camper and while there will be things that need to be fixed from time to time it isn't the end of the world in most cases.

I have heard that there are professional inspectors out there and it might be worth the money for you to find one. Another alternative might be to find an experienced camper or maybe two or three to come help you inspect the unit. Nothing like an extra set of eyes, particularly if they are more objective since it isn't their camper!

You may also like: