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Old 09-20-2011, 02:12 PM   #1
drsmart
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Bounce between front cap and pin box while towing

Thought I'd use another term for what I believe is commonly referred to as flex. While towing, the gap between the pin box and the front cap appears to float up and down about one and a half inches. This has been happening from the time we picked up the unit new a year ago and have traveled thousands of miles without any other visible issues inside or out. I'm wondering if other members on the forum have some movement or none at all? Is it common to see some flex and if so about how much? We're scheduled to have the dealer inspect it on Friday. We'd like to get it looked at, evaluated and make one more trip next week before they do any serious work if needed. The service manager at the dealership is implying we might be grounded if they decide to open up the front but they won't be able to work on it for a few weeks.

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Old 09-20-2011, 04:45 PM   #2
dieselguy
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The gap (flex) between pinbox and front cap on my fiver averages less than 1/2" driving down the highway. 1.5" sounds a little much to me.
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Old 09-21-2011, 05:17 AM   #3
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We had a "frame flex" problem with our 2006 2955 last year and had it repaired at a local dealer, all of which was picked up by Keystone. I could look at the pin box while going down the road and it wouldn't move but the front cap would go up and down a couple of inches. The first thing that Keystone wanted from the dealer was for them to check and see how much flex there was, ours had 2 1/2". Keystone has a procedure for them to follow and each step involves photos. Our rig was in the shop for about three weeks in all while the dealer and Keystone were going back and forth. After the repairs were made the front cap would only move up and down about a 1/2" which was normal. Several on this forum have had an issue with frame flex.
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Old 09-21-2011, 10:50 AM   #4
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Thanks dieselguy and PapaBeav. I received several replies on another RV forum as well regarding this. Amazing that I've traveled for a year assuming this to be normal in a new trailer. I'm a little disappointed that more MOC'ers haven't responded regarding how much flex they have or don't have. It may be one of those subjects that most don't want to talk about or get tired of reading about and I can understand that.
Aside from this concern, the Montana has taken very good care of us. Any issues so far have been small and few.

Dave
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Old 09-22-2011, 05:17 AM   #5
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We have a 2011 3750FL which we purchased last December. Ours routinely flexes up to 1/2 inch, but even on the worst roads it has not flexed any further.
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Old 09-22-2011, 06:56 AM   #6
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by drsmart

Thanks dieselguy and PapaBeav. I received several replies on another RV forum as well regarding this. Amazing that I've traveled for a year assuming this to be normal in a new trailer. I'm a little disappointed that more MOC'ers haven't responded regarding how much flex they have or don't have. It may be one of those subjects that most don't want to talk about or get tired of reading about and I can understand that.
Aside from this concern, the Montana has taken very good care of us. Any issues so far have been small and few.

Dave
I have posted over and over about the flex in our 2000 Montana. Ours had about 1 3/4 inches of flex and there were no broken welds! I had it repaired by Truck Builders in Marion, Iowa for a little less than $3500.00. It now has about 1/4 inch flex which is considered normal. The rig was six years old when they worked on it. Two years before that (2004) Keystone made their standard repair but it was mostly cosmetic (replaced cracked fiberglass). Truck Builders welded in gussets to hold the two sides of the frame together such that they couldn't move sideways from one another. Plus, they welded a four inch steel plate across the front of the frame for strength. In addition, they did some aluminum welding on the side in front of the bedroom slide to prevent any shifting of the structural aluminum.

I hope this helps some.

Orv
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Old 09-22-2011, 07:04 AM   #7
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What drew attention to our flex problem was when I discovered the wall in the bedroom closet was buckled out and splintered. Our dealer along with Keystones guidance removed the front cap and reinforced the frame. Since the repair we towed the trailer about 2000 miles and it appears that all is well.
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Old 09-22-2011, 08:09 AM   #8
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Thanks Orv. I know you always help with detailed information and I try to read all your posts. Maybe it's time you start charging a consultation fee There are many regular MOC posters that quickly offer information, ideas and solutions. To them I tip my hat. Thanks kylec2 and Johnnyg. It's looking like 1/2 inch is about normal for vertical movement. I'll try to post a follow up after tomorrows visit to the dealer.

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Old 09-22-2011, 10:01 AM   #9
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by drsmart

Thanks dieselguy and PapaBeav. I received several replies on another RV forum as well regarding this. Amazing that I've traveled for a year assuming this to be normal in a new trailer. I'm a little disappointed that more MOC'ers haven't responded regarding how much flex they have or don't have. It may be one of those subjects that most don't want to talk about or get tired of reading about and I can understand that.
Aside from this concern, the Montana has taken very good care of us. Any issues so far have been small and few.

Dave



I was concerned about the possibility of flex in our previous Montana. We had a crack beside the B/R which was there when we purchased the camper. I pulled the bottom pan cover off of the camper and inspected the welds and looked for problems which would indicate a flex issue. Even with the crack I didn’t find anything alarming at all. I believe that do to the model and the design that there are some areas which will remain flexible to some extent. I’ve since noticed that the later models have shortened the overhang which to me would take away from having a tendency for flexing as much.

With all of that said, it’s my opinion that we shouldn’t see any movement up or down while traveling other than the movement of the front where it may pivot on the hitch. In other words I don’t think the front cap should move in relationship with the hitch pin itself. I hope this makes sense.

On Edit: This is based on the fact that I have a solid hitch pin; some of the newer type hitches may have some movement this way if they are designed to. I’m not familiar with those types of hitch pins.

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Old 09-22-2011, 10:47 AM   #10
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I think Bill may have a valid point. I wonder if the Mor-Ryde pin box gives the impression that the front of the rig is moving with respect to the pin-box or the hitch?? I know they are designed to minimize front and aft movement, but nonetheless, they do have rubber bushings which I would assume could experience some flexing from compression and tension in all directions?? As far as the noticeable movement, everytime I am pulling the rig, I always think back to the frame-flex postings, end up hazardously staring in the rearview to investigate, and have never yet (to my amazement) been able to see any kind of vertical movement, other than what is expected on not-too-smooth roads. Maybe I don't know what to look for??
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Old 09-22-2011, 11:09 AM   #11
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We notice the underside of the front cap covering was not as smooth and straight as before while on a 3 week trip. So, we took our Mountaineer 324RLQ to a Montana Dealer, a Camping World store in Akron, OH about 2 weeks ago. While I observed they looked, then talked with each other, and then got their hydraulic lifter truck to lift and lower the pin box several times from zero load to fully raised for hookup. Then agreed that there was no frame flex. They pointed to what they call normal flexing while raising the trailer. I guess it is only about 1/2 inch. They believe the cap under cover had just moved a bit due to weather change or moisture. Since the under cap covering looked a little different I just needed reasurance that we were ok.
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Old 09-26-2011, 11:44 AM   #12
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Well today DW and I took our time and photographed the pin box before hitching and after connecting trying to see if there was any difference in the gap between the front cap and the pin box. She also took videos out the back window of the TV while going down various roadways and then out onto the highway. Some expansion joints along the way giving the Montana a good jostling. The top of the level to the bottom rim of the fiberglass cap provided an accurate reference. I must confess now that we’ve put our full attention into this, I don’t know how I imagined even one inch of bounce. There was in fact about 1/4” at most times and worse case maybe 1/2”. Now DW knows I’m losing it
Thank you all members who responded. We can honestly say that after our first year in the Montana and several thousand miles traveled, there have been no issues. Although we did replace the Marathons when we first took possession of the Monty to avoid a possible problem, it would be nice if Keystone started to offer an upgrade tire.
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Old 09-26-2011, 02:29 PM   #13
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I'am with Bingo. I didn't post because I haven't found any flex, but am not sure I would recognize it if I saw it.
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Old 09-26-2011, 03:09 PM   #14
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Dick-- You would know it if it was! You can see by spacing on the outside and movement within the closet and front. It is also evident when you hook up- with a drop or slope in the front on the hitch!
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Old 09-27-2011, 02:08 AM   #15
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quote:Originally posted by DQDick

I'am with Bingo. I didn't post because I haven't found any flex, but am not sure I would recognize it if I saw it.
If your unit develops too much flex, you'll know it. It isn't hard to recognize. You won't need to go around inspecting because the caulk will pull away and it's likely you'll develop some fiberglass cracks. At least that's what happened with ours.

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Old 09-27-2011, 02:48 AM   #16
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We had a fiberglass crack under the bedroom slide on our previous SOB. When we traded, the dealer said they'd have to open it up around the pin box and see what caused the crack. I think that's why I was imagining more going on up front on the Montana than there was. We hadn't towed since the spring and having read posts regarding flex, my imagination went into overtime during the summer. We did examine all the seams and caulking on the Monty. It all looks good so far. The closet and cabinetry inside the bedroom doesn't appear to be shifting.
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