Tapping into a Wireless Internet-Legal? or Not? - Montana Owners Club

Rudi and Ellen · 10-02-2005, 03:23 PM

I've heard it said both ways....Tapping into someone elses wireless internet connection is illegal. Others tell me that if it's not password protected, it's free game. Does anyone know for sure?

Countryfolks · 10-02-2005, 04:59 PM

It's illegal. Ask the guy in Florida who was arrested for it and convicted I believe. Arrests, and convictions, have been made in other places also. You will see comments about it being ok, but state and federal laws exist that say you cannot use [access] another persons computer without their specific permission. An Access Point, AP or router, is a small computer. It is loaded with management programs and is the device that sends and recieves [connects] the signal from your computer to the internet. Many folks do not protect their AP through ignorance or laziness. Even so, they ARE NOT giving tacit approval for unauthorized use. There was another thread a few months ago where this same question was discussed.

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padredw · 10-02-2005, 05:28 PM

And I suggest you search and read that earlier thread in its entirety. There is much to be said on the other side of this issue, in spite of the good faith of my friend and neighbor.

Bob Pasternak · 10-02-2005, 06:09 PM

There are numerous towns now that have free WiFi. South Bend, IN just set things up so you can use WiFi anywhere in the downtown area. I am sure there are others, it's just that I lived in SB and am familiar with the workings of the town. Also a lot of libraries have it.

Montana Sky · 10-02-2005, 09:28 PM

I have my wireless network protected at home. The neighbors next door to me do not have theirs protected and every now and again my laptop will connect to their network instead of mine. Do not have this problem with my desktop, but will also mention that we have many places throughout town that offer free wireless including most coffee shops. Sounds to me that would be a tough case to prove.

Sunshine · 10-03-2005, 04:56 AM

I'm looking forward to the WiFi "seminar" at the rally - I'm not good at reading and absorbing things - much better if I can see demonstrations, etc. Off subject, but Bob, I grew up in South Bend. Was back that way in August, but stayed in Elkhart - we were attending a class reunion that was on the border of SB/Mishawaka. SB has changed so much I hardly recognize it.

Rudi and Ellen · 10-03-2005, 08:22 AM

Thanks so much for your input everyone. You gave me some good options to take advantage of.
Happy Trails...

sreigle · 10-03-2005, 09:10 AM

MontanaSky, you should be able to set the switch to not auto connect to non-preferred networks, then delete your neighbor's network from your preferred list.

Montana Sky · 10-03-2005, 08:28 PM

Steve,
Thank you for that advice. I am not totally computer savy, and have tried everything I could think of to stop connecting to his network. I can now say I am on my OWN network for my laptop. Thanks again, hope you are having fun at the rally.

Parrothead · 10-08-2005, 05:16 PM

I did some more research on this recently. I believe the Florida case was unusual. There has not been another actual incident like this. A lot of "old wife's tales" about people getting in trouble. I have asked a couple of my technology "experts" friends that worked with me when I was working. All of them said if you can log in do it but be aware so can anyone else. Don't email your confidential info to anyone as others can see it. There are a lot of free sites now but even if they are free, you need a password. This is the best type. They are secure.
Happy trails...............................

315RLS · 10-09-2005, 02:18 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by Rudi and Ellen

I've heard it said both ways....Tapping into someone elses wireless internet connection is illegal. Others tell me that if it's not password protected, it's free game. Does anyone know for sure?

Its illegal and unethical.

richfaa · 10-09-2005, 05:14 AM

The FCC is the regulatory agency for telecommunications..Check out the web site WWW.fcc.gov You will note there is no law that states it is illegal to use a open wifi connection..in fact the FCC headquarters in D.C provides free wifi service. Now if you tap into your neighbors open wifi and rip off their credit card account..you are under arrest.

uhftx · 10-10-2005, 01:17 AM

First the Florida Case. The man is charged with hacking into the wireless network.
"Police say Benjamin Smith III, 41, used his Acer brand laptop to hack into Dinon's wireless Internet network."

This is where the law applies. (Hacking is illegal) Open Wireless access points are different

If the Wifi connection is password protected. You try and enter passwords for that connection. The wireless access point is protected and you are breaking the law.

FAQ: Wi-Fi mooching and the law
By Declan McCullagh
Staff Writer, CNET News.com
Published: July 8, 2005, 4:00 AM PDT
http://news.com.com/FAQ+Wi-Fi+moochi...3-5778822.html

You can read it for yourself, but the important part (check out paragraph (a)(2)) covers anyone who "intentionally accesses a computer without authorization or exceeds authorized access." Nobody knows exactly what that means in terms of wireless connections. The law was written in 1986 to punish computer hacking--and nobody contemplated 802.1x wireless links back then.

http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/h...0----000-.html

For your own computer security always password protect your wireless access. Give explicit permission to your devices only.
Wireless Lan Security FAQ
http://www.iss.net/wireless/WLAN_FAQ.php

315RLS · 10-10-2005, 01:44 AM

Quote:

quote: Unauthorized Network access becomes a felony
Oracle Tips by Burleson Consulting

Unauthorized access to a computer network becomes a felony – Even casual access to an unsecured wireless network in a hotel can destroy your career. You can be arrested on-the-spot, even if you have no criminal intent (other than stealing their bandwidth, of course). In Canada, it’s called Theft of Telecommunications.
http://www.dba-oracle.com/t_unauthor...work_crime.htm

Jeff Heiser · 10-10-2005, 04:46 AM

Excuse me but http://www.sptimes.com/2005/07/04/St...a_new_br.shtml and http://www.wthr.com/Global/story.asp...1&nav=9TahKyMs just for starters. Accessing someone's computer system without their permission, under Indiana law, is trespassing whether wirelessly or physically. In Florida and many other states "unauthorized access to a computer network" is a third-degree felony. I can site the statues if you would like. In the legal world hijacking is considered the same as unauthorized access whether by mistake or intentional. If you get caught you will be prosecuted. One of the primary laws is the federal Computer Fraud and Abuse Act. You can read it for yourself, but the important part (check out paragraph (a)(2)) which covers anyone who "intentionally accesses a computer without authorization or exceeds authorized access." I also suggest one reading “UNITED STATES CODE ANNOTATED TITLE 18. CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE PART I—CRIMES CHAPTER 119--WIRE AND ELECTRONIC COMMUNICATIONS INTERCEPTION AND INTERCEPTION OF ORAL COMMUNICATIONS” as another good starting point of reference. UNITED STATES CODE ANNOTATED TITLE 18. CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I--CRIMES CHAPTER 47--FRAUD AND FALSE STATEMENTS,1029. Fraud and related activity in connection with access devices, Subsection (e), Sub para's(1, 8, 10) speak specifically to this topic. The various laws do not make reference as to whether the access point or network you access (wirelessly or not) is secure or not but rather do you have permission to access either. Not being secure or being open does not imply explicit permission to access.

Whether it is legal or not will only be decided in lengthy court cases where in the end the Supreme Court has the final say and will set everyone straight. However, it pays to be aware of some of the laws that could be pressed into service against you in this cyberspace gray area. Even if they don’t hold water, it could be very expensive to prove you had no intent or the law is flawed.

Ethically I have very little problem with it. If I put a telephone out on the sidewalk in front of my house, passers-by may infer that I intend for it to be a public phone. I might just be crazy but, it creates an "easement" or in other words not only does the public enjoy freedom from prosecution, in extreme cases you can be prevented from removing the public convenience that you have created.

Suppose I put a telephone on the sidewalk in front of my house, with a long wire into my home. Is that a public convenience? It is impossible for passers-by to know your intentions; therefore they use the "reasonable man" theory to infer whether it is a public convenience. Since nobody puts personal phones out on the sidewalk where any passer-by can use it, we infer that any such instance must be for the public convenience.

Whether you SHOULD use a "found" wireless hot spot is up to you but, if you do you better be using encryption/protecting your computer, in your hunt for free service you may stumble onto a "honey pot" whose sole purpose in life is to sniff YOUR communications and gather personal information found on your computer. Remember an access point goes both ways. If you connect to a non-secure (“Public”) access point what’s to say someone isn’t there just waiting for the unsuspecting.

God Bless America
Jeff Heiser
Merritt Island Florida

dsprik · 10-10-2005, 05:27 AM

Has anyone been procesuted, except for this hacker who was intentionally engaged in an illegal action of breaking through a protected access point? I'd be curious if any casual use of unprotected hotspots has been prosecuted. There seems to be a gazillion people doing this, and some quite openly. We should be hearing tons of news accounts of jail and fines. Sounds like there are some very clear statutes. What gives???

padredw · 10-10-2005, 06:31 AM

John C. Dvorak is a computer professional writing for one of the best computer magazines, "PC Magazine". I quoted extensively from a column of his some time back when this same [never ending?] discussion came up. I dare to repeat that quotation:

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,1842378,00.asp

I refrained from comment earlier, but just today I received in email a column from John C. Dvorak that expresses what I believe to be the moral/legal situation. I will quote some of the most relavent portions of his article (which is also probably not exactly legal, anyway I will risk that also:

The problem I have with this activity is with the way it is described—as signal theft. I prefer to call it poaching. There is really nothing being stolen. The other user is paying a flat fee, and the worst that can happen is that his or her bandwidth takes a small hit for an inconsequential moment.
"It's like leaving the house unlocked," I'm told. "Just because there is no lock on the door doesn't mean you can walk in and take things." This is one of the dopey analogies you have to listen to. The analogy is bad. Walking into an unlocked home is not the same as hooking onto someone's Wi-Fi signal that is being broadcast all over the neighborhood. For one thing, no trespassing is being committed. The signal is being given to you. It's more like the unlocked house having a sign on the door saying "Welcome! Please enter!"
Let's drop the house analogy and find something better and more accurate. Here is what Wi-Fi spillage is like. Someone has a house and a big lawn and a sprinkler system that is watering the lawn and spraying the water into the street. You drive into the water spraying into the street and use it to wash your car. Are you stealing the water? It's not your water. Someone else paid for it and you are using it. Just like the Wi-Fi signal.

The way I see it, if someone is shoving a signal down my throat like that, I have every right to use it any way I want to as long, as I'm not doing anything illegal. It's crazy to think that my using that intrusive signal is illegal.

The quotation above is from the PC Magazine Web Page to which I am a subscriber, as well as a paid subscriber to the Mazazine itself. Here is the URL:

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,1842378,00.asp

Jeff Heiser · 10-10-2005, 07:05 AM

padredw,
Good stuff. I personally dont use found hot spots. As I stated above:
"Whether you SHOULD use a "found" wireless hot spot is up to you but, if you do you better be using encryption/protecting your computer, in your hunt for free service you may stumble onto a "honey pot" whose sole purpose in life is to sniff YOUR communications and gather personal information found on your computer. Remember an access point goes both ways. If you connect to a non-secure (“Public”) access point what’s to say someone isn’t there just waiting for the unsuspecting."

I know a lot of people who do use hotspots but I personally value the information on my laptop far greater than to risk it to an unknown hot spot, regardless of the safe guards I employee to prevent data theft. That's the reason I use a Sprint Data Card and if I cannot connect using it, then I cannot connect.

Good debate but now you have my last two cents on it.

God Bless America
Jeff Heiser
Merritt Island Florida

padredw · 10-10-2005, 08:46 AM

Point well taken, Jeff. But, remember, that was not the issue being raised. The issue was not the safety or protection of the "receiving" computer, but the illegality or ethical questionability of picking up the open signal.

I have no disagreement with your reluctance to access an open WIFI signal -- though I do not share the degree of concern which you feel about it. I just wanted to share one professional's view of the issue which was raised.

Countryfolks · 10-10-2005, 12:54 PM

Note; The guy in Florida was accessing an unprotected access point.
If you don't agree with the legal/ethical aspects of taking/using what isn't yours without permission, I want to enphasize a point made earlier, YOUR computer is unprotected also when you connect to an unlocked AP, like the poster said, it's a two way street. Anybody, criminal or otherwise, could be operating that AP for whatever purpose, You can be redirected to a site that is loaded with porn, virii/worms/trojans, or is a fake designed to steal personal info, etc. As long as you're connected to that AP, you're giving that owner time to access your computer. Most password protection can be broken in 5-10 minutes or so, maybe less, unless you have a VERY good setup. WEP pass words/phrases can be broken in less than 3 minutes.

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