Winter in Western Wyoming -30F

[CaptainRandy]

Howdy Folks

Jackie and I will be taking delivery of a new 3750FL on April 29th in Casper Wyoming.

My job will keep us in Western Wyoming (just south of Jackson Hole & Yellowstone) for two years.

Winter temperatures get to -30F yearly around here and have been known to go lower.

Any suggestions on how to cope with this challenge would be appreciated. So far we are gearing up to:

Install a custom vinyl skirt around the unit.
Add additional insulation under skirt
Make insulated cushions/plugs for ceiling vents and skylights
Place a 100 gallon propane tank at the RV park site
Install heat trace on incomming waterlines
Install PVC pipe on sewer drain - slick surface, drains fast
Plan on keeping gray water drain valve open but black water will
be dumped when full
Add a ABS fitting and cap to the holding tank duct to close off the duct when we are not camping in freezing weather.
Cover windows with foil/plastic type insulation
Install remote reading temperature guages under the unit
Have heat lamps available for any problem areas
Supplement RV propane heater with oil filled radiator electric heaters
Get really good at snuggling
If it gets to -50F have RV antifreeze ready to pump thru system
Have small Honda 2000EU ready in case of power outage to supply power for heater controls and fan.
Prepare a monthly checklist of items inside and outside of unit to keep an eye on during the ice age.(And use it !!!!)


One problem - I have not figured out yet - how do I walk my 3 mini dachshunds when there is 4 feet of snow out there?????

[Jolu]

It would be helpful if you had supplemental heat like ceramic heaters. The LPG heaters would probably put out more heat than the electric models. But they may also cause some condensation. Opening the windows slightly may not be an option in the temps you mention.
Like you state it is going to be a challenge for you with -30F.
You may also look into covering your windows with the foil type insulation to hold back some of the cold.
These thoughts are coming from a guy that heads to the desert southwest for the winter. So I am not sure what they are worth.
Joe

[CaptainRandy]

The window insulation is a good suggestion, have added it to my list.

Windows may be a major sourse of heat loss - there must be other methods of insulating without shutting out our view of the mountains.

The oil filled steam radiator style electric heaters I already have, have not used cermamic heaters B4 - what are the advantages??????

[Jolu]

One advantage with some the ceramic type heaters (electric models) they have fans to move the heat. I am not sure about the LPG models, if they have fans. Others have told me they like the oil type heaters because they are quieter.
I have used the small type ceramic models from ACE Hardware and they are about 5000BTU at 1500Watts. They were good for area heating.
This past winter I picked up a larger quartz reflector type heater from Home Depot for I think $59 and it really put the heat out. It would oscillate and cover a larger area. Walmart had the same heater made by Sunbeam. I wish I could give you the model number.
We all like those slides, but they also give us more area to heat and my slides sure gets colder than I like.

[CaptainRandy]

Good point on the fans to help circulate the heat,

I already have heaters (4) and fans (5) so I will just put one of my spare box fans behind the raditor type heater to move the heat around. Gotta keep moma & the cat warm !

[Jolu]

I am sure others will come along soon to give you more helpful tips gained from their experiences. Lots of helpful folks here.
Joe

[Art-n-Marge]

I thought I remember reading that other than a foil covering for the windows there was some kind of clear covering that was available that provides the same function but then doesn't block the view of the windows. It was posted by someone in the forum familiar with winter living. I hope they provide a post on this.

I also hope your campsite is 50 amp so you have more power available to use. With all this manufactured air and insulation, you may have to run a dehumidifier, too.

Regarding your dogs, the Jetsons come to mind. Maybe you can find a treadmill that fits in your rig for this purpose when the poor dogs might get submerged outside in too much snow.

I don't know how well this would work in too much snow or cold, but what plans to you have for the overhang? Besides the aftermarket fabric to line the front cap to the ground area which might not be substantial enough, I remember seeing that a forum member constructed a relatively light weight cover for this area for extra storage. Coupled with the skirting around the rig would this help keep the underside warmer from the elements?

I am only passing on some of what I've heard from others. Your list is pretty good so far and I hope the much more experienced add more.

[mlh]

Randy
I know this wont help but my favorite place to camp is on Union Pass at the historic marker or about a mile so to the west. I was up there in 09 on July 4 and there was still 20 feet of snow in places. Hope to make it this year in September or early October. If you see a Montana from Va stop and visit.
Lynwood

[2 for Him]

Captain Randy,
Never have camped in that cold, done quite a bit at 5-20 degrees though. I'm not sure there is any way to make it work that low.
In Kansas the rv park would let us put straw bales(inside large plastic bags) all around the bottom for skirting. It is much more insulating than plastic when kept dry and bug free, hence the plastic bags.
For a commercial product for the water hose some used Pirit Hoses http://www.pirithose.com/mm5/merchan...tegory_Code=HS, looks neater than my heat tape - foam - duct tape rigging, at almost the same cost.
We found a product at all the Wal Marts and hardware stores in KS, a tape on, clear, heat shrink plastic you put on the inside of the window frames to give an airspace and seal better. We used it on the outside of the screen door too, really lessened the draft from the door. Many here use plexiglass or lexan panels that snap in for the same purpose.
Try to get a space that is out of the prevailing winds in the winter, the KS winds would seem to blow right through the walls, especially around the slideouts.
I even tried putting the foil insulation material under the floor of the large slide out, but that has to be removed before bringing in the slides (ask me how I know)?
Hope this helps, stay warm!!
Tom

[CaptainRandy]

Thanks for the suggestions,

The RV Park rules forbid using hay, but that does not mean I cannot add something like foam insulating foam panels behind the skirt where it is out of sight.

I have used the heat shrink film in my Georgia cabin, good idea.

There is no place in Wyoming where you can hide from the wind, it will track you down and find you!

[8e3k0]

Make up special cushions to insert inside at every roof vent; lots of heat loss there. Also the sky light over the shower will be a place for heat loss. All the slide floors and seals are very poor for cold temperatures. Takes a lot of heat ( propane and electricity) to keep that unit warm when temps drop below consisting freezing weather. We were consuming 30 lbs of propane every 3 days when the weather was 34 to 38 so I would hate to thing what the cost would be at -30 or lower!! When the weather dropped to 26 the furance seemed to run continuous! Skirting that trailer with square hay bales would help a lot and then shroud them with the vinyl.

[jpkelpe]

We have a Hickory edition and they seem to have a lot more insulation. we had ours in 13 degree weather this winter and had no problems keeping warm and the furnace did not run all of the time. we also used a couple of quartz heaters. there have been some on this forum that have spent winters in the cold, i am sure they will be along. Contact Wayne and carolyn Mathews, they are in Montana and I am sure she has some good hints.

[boje]

Wind...what wind.

[Briarglenn]

We spent the summer of 2010 at Hoback Jct. The people that stayed in the park year round added 1" to 2" ridged foam insulation to their trailer bodies. Actually, they taped it to their rigs from the ground up. They scared me and we couldn't wait to come to AZ. I read you letter to my wife and her response was to find a new job. Seriously, talk to Rod and Candy at Circle J RV Corral in Hoback Jct for good information. Good luck.

[mlh]

A friend who lives in Laramie told me the wind was very predictable. He told me the very days the wind would blow. It starts on January 1 and ends December 31.
Lynwood

[CaptainRandy]

I have lived in Casper, WY for 5 years and believe the wind blows more there than in Western WY where we are now. We had a 1/4 inch of snow last night (April 16th), the Easter eggs are going to stand out really well at the hunts today.

Its colder here in that we are at 7,000 ft elevation here. Jackies still at our cabin in North Gorgia & reports a lot of wind & rain at the cabin last night with 16 dead across the storm path thru OK, MS, LA,AL & GA.

I figure we will have some nice memories to pass on to our grandkids on our adventures. I kinda like the challenge too.

[granet]

Captain Randy:-I'm living aprox. 1000 miles north of you and these are things that we are /have used to stay relatively warm thoughout the winter!
1) Windows- there is a indoor and an outdoor plastic window cover that can be attached in the fall-we just used the outside type this year but next winter we will use both!
2)Slides-we have stuffed all the slideouts with fibreglass insulation in strips both the rubber boots and the inside joints!
3)Skirting-we have 3" ridgid foam insulation boards completely around the inside of the skirt but have found that there is still heat loss so next year we will add 1" ridgid boards to the tops and bottoms of all slideouts as well-also we have covered the outside walls of the slideouts with the silver (so called) super insulation!
4)Make sure you stuff your pinbox,water station and under the pin box awning with insulation

We use no additional heaters outside of the fireplace and were nice and toasty during -40 temps. Under no circumstances leave any tanks open close them up and dump about every7-10 days or if you have temps close to 0 or you will freeze your sewer line!
I hope that these ideas will help -they work for us!
Regards
Granet
2008 -3400rl

[Icehouse]

Both ourselves and Carolyn and Wayne Matthews have lived in the Montana in some serious sub-freezing temps. If you'd like us to share what we did, you can send us a PM and we'll share our knowledge with you.

[CaptainRandy]

Howdy Again Folks,

Jackie & I are still here in western Wyoming & have received our first snowfall of the season , abt 4" Oct 6th. We have made most of the preparations for the upcomming winter to our 3750FL. We are snuggling in & will see what surprises this winter brings. We'll keep you posted of our experiences and pass on any new suggestins for cold weather camping.

[steves]

As you are in extreme cold and set up for long term....I have two additional thoughts 1- add Styrofoam sheeting to the top and bottom of the slides, and; 2- use insulating tape on the outside of your slides seals. The slides will be your coldest part of the rig.