Question but not looking to upset anybody? - Montana Owners Club

Montana_6085 · 11-05-2006, 05:23 AM

We fell in love with the Montana 3295RK, as it has all that we would need for full timing. And we will be ordering our new RV once our home has sold.

That said, I would like some honest feedback about how Montana and Cedar Creek compare for full timing, service from factory via warranty issues, etc., problems after sale and such as that. We just happened to see a Cedar Creek yesterday and it had some fine selling qualities, but of course we are looking for quality and a lasting relationship as opposed to just small things that look nice up front. One of the things I liked about the Cedar Creek is that the one we looked at had 1 15 cu ft Amana frig with a 2000W inverter. I really liked the thought of having a decent size frig. I realize that Montana offers a 10 cu ft as an option but how about a 12 cu ft one? Do they offer that size? I have also seen some others posts elsewhere where some people seemed to have had some problems with a water leakage problem with their Cedar Creeks (Forest River Products) and have had problems with the factory and such concerning said problems.

Anyway, I would just like to get the honest feedback from all of you here since I think you all seem to be pretty honest.

GQ

Mrs. CountryGuy · 11-05-2006, 05:50 AM

GQ

Have not owned a Forest River product, so am not qualified to comment, but, suggest, reading the other forum (aka, RV net). Me thinks you have already done so, or are doing so, and that is good.

Can comment on Keystone standing behind their units, cause we have been one of the "lucky" ones

, and have had most of the major things that can go wrong with a rig, go wrong with ours, that being the leaking A/C unit (before they changed the engineering and placement of the A/C unit in the rig, should NOT happen now). But, when we told them about it, NO questions, take it out, replace it. We were at the service center for other problems, and they took care of that A/C right NOW!

Also had the axle problems, AlKo Kobler before they switched to using Dexter. This one took a bit more discussion and fussing, but, in the end, Keystone and AlKo Kobler did right by us, in our own minds, and we are happy.

Also have had the bedroom retro fit, again, done very nicely and Keystone even put us up in a motel for the night, including the 4 barkers!

Also had the frame flex situation repaired recently at the new Service Center, and could not be happier.

Keystone has treated us well, yes, we are very relieved and happy bout that. After our first encounter with Keystone/Service Center, we feel we are more relaxed owners, because we truly feel that Keystone wants us to be happy with our unit and that they stand behind it.

Far as we know, they do not offer that 12 foot frig, but they specialize in running changes, so ya never know.

We are not full timers, but long timers, but there are what, 60 full timers here at MOC, and some of them have purchased 2 and even 3 Montanas, that has to say something.

Good luck on the sale of your home, and your future 3295 and your full timing experience.

richfaa · 11-05-2006, 06:02 AM

Just my opinion...Means nothing. We considered Forest River Cardinal and Cedar Creek.The Keystone plants and Forest River plants are a few miles from one another.They draw from the same old world craftsman workforce, use the same vendors and the same manufacturing techniques. The quality in both is typical of the quality and workmanship in the RV industry. IMO the Cedar Creek is no better no worse than the Montana.They will all share the same problems..Montana's leak...so do Cedar Creek's. Our deciding factor was the dealer and the price they could offer..Dealer over price. To be Honest If the right Dealer had been nearby we would be pulling a Forest River Cardinal..I have no advise..but we would and Did purchase the Camper that best served our needs ..in all respects, Dealer, Price, Options, Etc..no matter what the brand...and that is our honest opinion..Oh..Our dealer also sold the Jayco Designer which I liked far more than the Montana..but..the price was not right..Feel we got a better bang for the buck with the Montana 3400.. We are satisfied .

CampingCrazyShirley · 11-05-2006, 06:20 AM

This post may be long so bear with me...I believe 6 maybe 7 years ago...I lose track of time, we started looking at campers. We stumbled up the Montanas and at the time they had a really nice SkyDeck which was awesome as we are huge race fans. Alas, too much money for us, so we moved on. Over the years our financial situation changed and we kept coming back to the Montana and said, some day...we looked at Cedar Creeks about the middle of this past summer. Really liked them...looked at Cardinal too. Liked them ok, but the unit we looked at had quite a few fit and finish issues, so we steered away from it. Went back to the Cedar Creek...thought hard about purchasing, even down to the paperwork. Had real issues with the dealer. Very rude to us. We decided to just pass and keep what we had. Went to an RV show this past fall...right back to the Montanas again. This time, we purchased the 3500RL and are picking up this Thursday. Now, with all that being said, is the quality better in a Cedar Creek? I don't know...they will tell you their frames are screwed and not welded. Does that matter? I have no clue. I think sometimes manufacturers tell you things about their products to make you think theirs is heads above the rest, but when it comes down to it, exactly when does it matter that your frame is screwed and not welded? I'm not an engineer so I don't know. I know you will find issues with Forest River Customer Service if you search threads on RV.net, I'm sure you will find issues with Keystone Customer Serivce as well. The bottom line in my opinion is, the RV industry as a whole, gets away with a lot of things that as consumers we wouldn't put up with were it to be from any other industry. We are conditioned to put up with poor quality control. We say, ok, we'll take it back to the dealer and get it fixed. Some here have had to do that many, many times. Others, never. It doesn't matter which make, model, year, you purchase. You will have issues with them all. Over the years, different manufactuers, we have had issues with a/c, furnace, water leaks a plenty, tires, tanks, pumps, etc. The majority of the manufactuers use the same vendors...you either get Dometic or Norcold fridges. Suburban water heaters or Atwood...the list goes on. I think you should go into a lot of campers, hang out in each of them a fair amount of time and decide which one feels "like home". Hope this helps, sorry for the length. Good luck in whichever unit you choose.

Parrothead · 11-05-2006, 06:51 AM

We have had pretty much the same experience. We first saw the Montana in I think 2000. Loved the 3295. Couldn't make a deal. Looked again in 2002, couldn't make a deal and the unit had been used a lot for shows. When we started looking in 2004 we knew this would be the unit we took into retirement. We looked at every make there is. We almost bought a couple of times. I liked the one that has the big window in the bedroom like trailers. But the deal wasn't good. So back to the Montana. We still think it is the best and we like the envy look and comments we get at campgrounds which make us think Montana's have a good reputation. And of course the big plus is this forum and all the wonderful people we have met. This is our 3rd 5th wheel and we appreciate the quality of the Montana. While construction may be similiar I think the vented attic is a big plus with the Montana. And I agree you should buy the one that feels like home to you. The 3400 did that for us.
Happy trails...................

Countryfolks · 11-05-2006, 07:05 AM

No opinion on the Cedar Creek. The large refrigerator is probably nice but the 2000W inverter may need to be researched a bit, it may need a dual battery setup [if it's not already installed] because of power requirements/usage. It would be nice if you plan on doing alot of drycamping.

Skip

CampingCrazyShirley · 11-05-2006, 07:10 AM

I would like to add an opinion also in agreement with Skip about the fridge and the inverter on the fridge. This is a new thing for them, and I'm sure it's not new technology. I'm sure others can chime in on this as well, however, I would like to see some history on this type of unit and how reliable the set up is. Mabe do some research on this. We did see this option on the Cedar Creeks and the fridge was really nice.

Wrenchtraveller · 11-05-2006, 07:53 AM

You certainly have to do the research and buying a Montana means you can ask advice for problems right here on this excellent website. As mentioned before, every RV salesman will use the strong points on his unit. A Cardinal salesman will tell you that the plywood floors in the Forest River product are superior to the OSB ( oriented strand board ) that we find in Keystone products and I was told by a Keystone factory rep that Keystone likes the OSB because they can get in in longer sizes and avoid butt joints as you get with plywood .

I do know that OSB has come a long way and now rivals plywood as the panel of choice by many builders. You also can get poor quality plywood that delaminates and rots very easily.

We very nearly bought a Cardinal but the ones I went through were not as well finished as my Montana. It was comical to listen to the dealers that sold both Forest River and Keystone lines.
They will tell you a Cougar is better than a Wildcat but a Cardinal is better than a Montana if they sell Cougars and Cardinals. Then go and see a guy who sells Wildcats and Montanas.

His story is the opposite, Wildcats are great, Cougars are garbage, and Montanas are good because they are built back East.

I am a Canadian but I won't buy another Canadian built RV again. I have owned two of them and I was very dissapointed in both of them. The Montana is a great product for the money, and after owning one, I walk into big dollar Diesel Pusher Busses with their low ceilings and I really mean it when I say, " Even If I could afford this thing, I wouldn't want it!"

I am sticking with Montana Fifth Wheels.

Cat320 · 11-05-2006, 07:54 AM

The large RV manufacturers (Forest River/Keystone) are like the old Chevy/Dodge/Ford debate...any one will do the job with about the same results. Like Rich, the deciding factor for us in favor of the Montana was an excellent price and a close and good dealer.

indy roadrunner · 11-05-2006, 08:36 AM

Well we were luck in having a Cedar Creek and a Montana 3400 side by side in the dealer show room. We went back and forth, back and forth, I think they had to replace the carpet that we wore out between them, we settled the on the Montana 3400 and have had minimal issues. I have had it back to the dealer for 3 repairs two of them was my mistake but still Keystone stood behind the repairs.
When it is all said and done - which is the better deal dollar wise. Go for it.

BillyRay · 11-05-2006, 08:39 AM

They are both very nice units. I really like the cedar creek, they are very nice. I can't say anything bad about them, but I also haven't owned one either. I have owned two Montana's though, and even though our first one had problems, Keystone made good on it, and we traded it in on a newer one. I feel both are quality units, and both would equally serve you well. I think the only deciding factor between the two would be which has a better layout that serves your needs...and of course the price!!!

JimF · 11-05-2006, 09:24 AM

I guess our story is about the same as the rest of the good folks on here. I have had RV's since the 60's when they were all equally bad. I have had good and bad units. For the last unit we shopped for 2 years before buying the perfect unit
and still had issues. This time we looked at every 5th wheel brand out there from the bottom to the top line 120k $ plus rigs. We kept coming back to Montana for the value for the dollar. We looked a lot at the cedar creek and I had some floor plan and fit and finish issues with it, but the absolute bottom line decision was the floor plan for our needs and the value for the dollar. The general reputation of Keystone factory standing behind the product and perks such as this group of peers and their support is just icing.

3400RL

Montana_6085 · 11-05-2006, 10:03 AM

Well, hubby and I really did a lot of talking about the two units. It was funny really, to see and hear us naming the pros and cons for each unit, you know layout and everything else.

We have decided that the Montana 3295RK meets our needs much better and the fact that it would be cheaper in the long run makes it even better.

The kitchen area is a huge factor for us and we will probably get the 10 cu ft frig option.

Thank you all for the great replies and I am so glad that nobody got upset with my questions since it involved another manufacture and brand.

GQ

Tom Gina 06 · 11-05-2006, 10:06 AM

We have both Forest River and and Keystone keys in our possesion right now. Both 5vers are great in their own right. One thing not mentioned is Forest River has two plants one in Oregon the other in Indiana. The Wildcat we currently have 28RK was built in Oregon because we purchased it in Wyoming. The line for distribution is Wyoming/S.Dakota state line. With that said we looked at units from both plants and found some subtle differences in little extras that the Oregon plant used in building. Our Forest River warranty issues through the dealer went very good had to replace the stereo and some cosmetic plastic parts. I fixed the problems myself account couldn't justify the time and drive to have it done. Over all the Wildcat is still a nice unit and looks very good also. Everything works great just not big enough for our fulltiming needs now.

Which now brings the reason we went with the Montana. We searched many dealers, went to the Fort Worth RV show, also stopped at just about every RV dealer in the DFW area. When we walked into the 3400RL Gina and I looked at each other and at the same time said "this is it"! In an instant we both found what we felt was going to work the best for us. Then when it came down to price it was a done deal yet even after that spent the summer looking at even more 5vers at dealers from MN to SD just to be sure. We kept coming back to the Montana over and over. The dealer we ordered our 3400 from even shot us a fantastic deal on a Hitchiker Premier only to have us stay the coarse on the Montana. Reasons why: The floor plan! One that includes plenty of counter space and storage, plus all the creature comforts to boot. Now my feelings on the bigger fridge, we orderd ours with the 10ft fridge and are very happy we did. Much more space even if it is only 2ft more. We can get 2 twelve inch Pizzas in the freezer, not happening in the 8ft. The 12ft fridge seems to take away alot of storage space from what I have seen in other units. That can mean alot if you use it for an extended time.

Again these opinions are just that, Opinions, you have to go with your heart. After looking at what might seem to be thousands of 5vers, to the point another set of steps makes you miserable. The time will come which you will be knocked off your feet and know in your heart "this is it!!". Just know that it is OK to go with what you feel will work for you because everyone has unique needs.

Remember the.......

Montana Sky · 11-05-2006, 11:55 AM

At my seasonal sight I have a really great neighbor that happens to own a Cedar Creek Daydreamer. (It is one really nice coach!) While talking about his new Daydreamer I asked him how he liked it? He loves it, but funny thing, he was set on buying a new Big Sky by Montana. Since they had been discontinued (in 05) he decided he did not want a coach that might have a problem getting parts for down the road. He went back out to the RV show and started his looking process all over again. He found the Daydreamer, his current coach, which had many "upgraded" features like he wanted in his Big Sky. In his opinion, the Daydreamer offers more in terms of features and grade of materials and appliances used. The rest is built just like a Keystone product. He has had a few minor problems with his coach, as have I. I asked him awhile back, after owning your Daydreamer for the past 2 years, do you wish you would have bought the Big Sky? His answer; "no, the Daydreamer has been an outstanding coach for me (him). When the time comes for me(him) to buy a new coach, if Keystone has something out there that is in the same class as the Daydreamer, I would sure look at buying that as well. Keystone makes a great product."

I can attest to Keystone standing behind their products. I had a great experience while in Goshen back in Sept. My bedroom slide was having issues, and Keystone stepped up and took care of this issue. The service department and all the folks at Keystone are top rate!! I know I would sure buy another Keystone product when the time comes.

My suggestion is to follow you feelings and buy the coach that best suits your needs and wants. Which ever one feels like home is the one I would go with.

kdeiss · 11-05-2006, 01:37 PM

If we ever think about full timing we would look at the Carrage Products.We love our Montana but for fill timing I think their are other choices.

Sweetfire · 11-05-2006, 01:48 PM

GQ, here is an option for you over the high priced 10 cu. ft. fridge. If you will not be installing a washer/dryer in your 5er think about keeping the standard fridge and adding a 5 cu. ft freezer in the washer/dryer cabinet. It worked so well for us I'm going to stack a small dormroom size fridge on top of it. That gives you the OEM fridge/freezer and an additional 5 cu. ft. fridge and a 5 cu. ft. freezer. The Sears freezer we bought was around $150.00 and the fridge I'm looking at is about $130.00 a lot more space for a lot less money. We'll use the extra fridge space for soft drinks and beer. The small freezer keeps thinks like ice cream a lot colder than the dometic one that comes with the rig.

Montana Rog · 11-05-2006, 03:06 PM

You can only toss the salad so many ways. You gotta get what trips your trigger. You will drive yourself nuts trying to get everything. and the latest and greatest gadgets. As soon as you pull it off the lot, you will think you got the shaft as far as the price you paid...then when you get to your first campground, someone will have something bigger and better than yours. It's like a dog chasing his tail. It never ends..just do your research, get one, and be happy with it. You're agonizing too much over a material thing. One could be happy in a tent if that's all you could afford. I did just that when I had nothing and was happy with it.

stiles watson · 11-05-2006, 03:50 PM

400 Square is all you get. So the only options are how you are going to slice the pie. Everything is a trade off for the use of that space. The different floor plans are the different ways to slice the pie. When you figure what slices are of the greatest importance to you, then you will have your decision made. Congratulations on your excellent choice. Welcome to the Montana family.

CampingCrazyShirley · 11-06-2006, 04:40 AM

Stiles-What a perfect response. Couldn't have said it any better myself!

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