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Old 12-14-2008, 09:51 AM   #1
blamb
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Leaving water hose connected in cold weather

We are getting down to below freezing, and the weather will not be above freezing again until about Thursday or Friday. That's a whole week, and I know for sure that my fresh water tank will NOT last that long. So leaving the water hose disconnected that entire time is not feasible.

The lowest it is supposed to get at all is 16 degrees Fahrenheit: My weather for the week.

My water hose is insulated... I put a foam tube on it from where it exits the ground to where it enters the RV convenience center. Then on top of the foam tube, which is enclosed, I wrapped it tightly in foam tape. It's pretty squishy with insulation. I plan to stuff the convenience center with towels, as many as I can find that will fit in there. My fresh water will NOT last more than maybe a day and a half max (I know because I have tried it. That is conserving it, too. (I have thirsty dogs). I plan to fill up the fresh water tank anyway just to make sure I have some if I need it, though.

So can I leave my water hose connected? Any tips?
 
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Old 12-14-2008, 10:05 AM   #2
HamRad
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Blamb,

If your water tank will not last longer than a day and a half then you have a major problem with your tank and or supply system. Or you have a major problem in using water. When boon docking we can stretch our water to last a week to 10 days! And that is two of us using it.

Yes. You do have to learn to conserve. But that is not hard to do.

I would think that with your description of how you have your hose insulated that your hose might be fine. I do not have a lot of experience with cold weather camping so you'll do better listening to some of those folks that do.

The only other thing that I can think of that might help is a heat strip that you apply to your hose. It is like a skinny electric blanket for your hose.

Good luck and stay warm.

HamRad
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Old 12-14-2008, 10:31 AM   #3
stimpy123
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blamb,
I might be a little late for you, but if you are in a standard park with full hookup, you could leave a trickle of water run through the night, as long as you also leave the grey water tank valve open, this allows the water to continue to run through the hose, even slightly to keep it from freezing in the hose. I concur with Hamrad, that if you wish to have more protection, use a heat tape. This tape should be under the insulating foam tubing and that will keep the "heat" onto the hose. These tapes are thermostatically controlled, so they will only be "on" when the temperature gets below the freezing point. I don't know exactly the temperature setting, but they are factory set and not adjustable. I've lived in my RV during early cold spells in Reno, NV and cold weather in St. George, Ut. by doing this and had no problems, and am still using the fresh water hose from three years ago.
Best wishes and just think, the 21st of Dec is the shortest day of the year, and spring is on the way. I like to think possively.
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Old 12-14-2008, 10:32 AM   #4
blamb
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Thanks. I use so much water because I drink quite a bit and so do my dogs, and it is probably the laundry that does it in. But I can't get to the laundry center in bad weather. And I haven't done laundry all week, stupid me, so I am out of clothes to wear, doh.

My future ex-husband came by today to drop off some food for me. He said there's a sign up at the entrance to the park telling everyone to open their cabinets, heat their RV's to 65, leave grey/galley tanks open and leave the water running all night. I may do this.
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Old 12-14-2008, 10:48 AM   #5
rogue
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Blamb, We had our hose freeze solid. Had to use a hair dryer to remove it from the spigot and also from the RV convenience hookup. Fortunately we had a spare hose, so once the frozen one was removed and had running water at the spigot, we added water to the tank, then disconnected the hose and put in in the basement. So maybe thats an option for you, have a spare and only use it to fill the tank when needed.
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Old 12-14-2008, 12:09 PM   #6
Larry
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Fill your water tank, disconnect and drain your hose. When your tank runs dry, haul out the hose and re-fill.

I could sleep well knowing I had running water in my unit all night.
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Old 12-14-2008, 12:40 PM   #7
ols1932
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Blamb:
We can go for 8 - 10 days on one tank of fresh water. That's with both of us taking showers. We conserve water by wetting down, soaping up, and rinsing off. We save our dish water in a 5-gallon pail along with wash basin water, then use it to flush the toilet. That way we get dual use out of a lot of the water. I know, I know, it may be a little inconvenient but it works for us when we are dry camping or camping in freezing weather.

As for leaving the water running a little in freezing water, I wouldn't do it because you may freeze your sewer hose solid. Then you've got a real problem. When that happens, your running water will back up in the grey water tank and could conceivably back up into the shower and eventually run over. Wow! Then the mess begins. Take if from someone who has had some experience in this area, don't do it. It's not necessary.

Orv
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Old 12-14-2008, 01:40 PM   #8
Mrs. CountryGuy
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Gonna jump in here with the water useage. Al and I go out for 15 days with that 60 gallons of water, now, that said, we can use the toilets and shower houses, but, still 15 days of dishes and late night flushing and sometimes 13 others that I have to do dishes for.

You can learn to conserve, this is one time that very little water down the toilet is a good idea. When the freezing conditions are past, clean out the systems good and you are back in business. Remember, NO PAPER!! unless absolutely necessary.

Let the dishes stand, wipe em off with baby wipes, and let em wait.

Heavens, even skip a shower once a day, your dry skin will thank you.

Get some bottled water in for you and the furr kids for emergencies like this.

You should be able to fill that thing, even once a day, drain the hose, and turn off the water.

You have a new unit, you are gonna be good in the belly of the monster to about 0 degrees, but, ya gotta let that furnace run!

16 is low, but, I have a friend, who is looking at 25 below for tonight. In their unit! Just think you could be with them, eh??
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Old 12-14-2008, 03:27 PM   #9
Driftwoodgal
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Blamb,

If you disconnect the water hose from the spigot be sure to walk the water out of the hose. By doing this your water will not freeze in the hose. Start by raising up one end of the hose and slowly walk the length of the hose. If you run out of water in your tank, hook up the water hose and fill it up again. You can still leave your hose outside the basement if you walk all of the water out of it.

We drink bottled water and use it for our cat too. You might think about getting some bottles that you can fill and store on your kitchen floor.

Try to stay warm, and keep the heat going in the belly.

Colleen

On Edit....you need to disconnect the hose from the trailer and the spigot to get the water out. We owned a boarding kennel. I had to walk water out of our hoses on a regular basis in the winter.
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Old 12-15-2008, 03:17 AM   #10
Parrothead
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I agree with Orv on not letting water run all night. Your sewer hose will freeze up. Voice of experience here. Taking the hose off at night and putting it in the basement works well. But the heat tape on the hose is the best solution.
Happy trails...................
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Old 12-15-2008, 03:27 AM   #11
deepskyridge
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I have our Montana setup in New Mexico (Silver City). I have a heat tape on the water hose and there is no problem with it freezing. I also put foam insulation over the hose and heat tape. It has a thermostat so it does not operate when the temps are above approx. 45 degrees. I got it at ACE hardware.

If your hose freezes and re-thaws enough you run the risk of getting a leak.

Gary
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Old 12-15-2008, 05:25 AM   #12
Bill and Lisa
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Blamb,
For what you asked, I think Driftwoodgal has the best recommendation without having to go out and buy extra equipment (heat tape) or change the way YOU camp (water usage). Yes, others go longer but their solution is for you to be more like them instead of providing a meaningful solution. If you have the funds, get the heat tape. I have been out into the single digits and not had a problem with the incoming water using the heat strip. I did have trouble dumping as the discharge valve froze shut. A hair dryer works well for those problems.

Because the floor itself is insulated and the Monty's have tanks and piping below the floor make sure that you keep those from freezing by insuring that the furnace runs occasionally. While electric heaters are great and don't use your propane up they don't protect the components below the floor level. A drop light with a 40 watt incondesent light (not florescent) will help provide some heat in the basement area as well. Good luck.
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Old 12-15-2008, 08:26 AM   #13
Mrs. CountryGuy
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Blamb,

After reading Bill's reply, I got to worrying that maybe we were giving you our solutions, and trying to get you to conform to our life styles.

Speaking just for myself here, it is never my intention by my comments/suggestions/posts, etc. to get others to live my lifestyle. Goodness, the fact that we are all different is what makes life so interesting.

I believe in my heart that all the posts/replies to this thread were suggestions, and ideas to help.

We all know your saga, and from where I am sitting you are doing a pretty darn good job of this transition. I can see that you ask, listen, contemplate the responses and then apply the suggestions as they seem to apply to your life. You have come a LONG WAY BABY!! and, in just a short time period.

Our comments, that we can go 15 days, or 5 days or however long, with 60 gallons of fresh water, we are only trying to show that it is possible, and to encourage you. If I know something is possible, even if a bit on the tough side, that is encouragement enough to get me all fired up and ready to conquer and divide.

You keep asking questions and you keep learning, you are doing great!
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Old 12-15-2008, 10:27 AM   #14
ols1932
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I agree with Mrs. CountryGuy. Most of us post our experiences, not to get anyone else to comply, but rather just to give others ideas. Often someone's post will trigger something in my mind and get me to thinking "Why didn't I think of that." Thank you Mrs. CountryGuy for expressing something that I was unable to express.

Orv
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Old 12-15-2008, 04:24 PM   #15
blamb
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Thanks everyone, especially for the last few replies.

Regarding the water usage, I did not realize how much I was actually using. I sat down and tried to figure out where it was all going. I really do drink a lot of water. It's an old habit ingrained in me from healthier days years passed. Just my lab by herself drinks about 3 to 4 gallons a day. She drinks so much I had her tested for diabetes. Free and clear, just thirsty. My terrier drinks about one gallon. I drink about 10 gallons. (I only sleep 4 hours a day on a good day, so that's about half a gallon per hour). No, no kidney problems, that's just how my body works, when I was younger I was a ballet dancer for 9 years and I think since I started dancing so young, and danced so hard I was constantly thirsty, it conditioned my body to expect and tolerate large volumes of water that would give other people kidney issues. Anyway, that's about 15 gallons of water being consumed. One shower a day is required for medical reasons, I usually deplete the hot water even if I turn the shower head off to conserve - My hair is very very thick and comes down to my butt when it is not braided, so that alone takes nearly the entire hot water tank to rinse out. I don't wash my hair every day, but still. Cold showers not an option due to medical issues. But, that is .. lets' see... I'm going to guess since I have equal parts hot and cold water during a shower, and deplete the hot water usaully, that sums up to about 24 gallons per shower. So far that totals 39 gallons of water usage a day. That is NOT counting water used to wash dishes, water plants, clean, or the water the splendide w/d combo uses, which by itself can take my fresh water down 1/4 a tank per load. So, as you can see, it isn't hard for me to blow through 60 gallons of water in 2 days at all. I have always been a "hippie type" and conserved water where I can, so I never let water run idly - turn it off while brushing my teeth and such. Unfortunately, I am a water hog, and there's nothing I can do to fix that without all of us going thirsty and rashy, lol.

I think it's safe to say I'll never be able to boondock, eh?

Anyway, as usual, the medical issues prevent me from being able to turn the water on and off outside so easily. I don't know if it's like this in all places or not, but the water spigot outside is in a very deep pit that you almost have to lay on the ground to reach, I DO have to lay on the ground because crouching is very difficult, and it is really hard for me to get back up by myself. I am punished for it later too. Going out there to do that every other day during freezing weather (which assaults the medical issues all by itself) is just not feasible for me.

So, with that in mind, I decided to give the park manager's directions a try. I wasn't feeling easy about it, but I do have to try to avoid aggravating medical issues as much as I can, and find some kind of compromise between that and caring for the RV. I don't really sleep much, and I can see the kitchen sink from bed, so it was easy to keep an eye out for overflowing. No problems all night, but it only got to 15 or 16 degrees and it was the first freezing weather after a warmer day. I hope tonight, after it's been freezing all day too, will go as well. Tonight, I am going to place a large empty plastic container that is lightweight in the sink, rigged in such a way that water does not go inside it and so I cannot see it from bed, but if the sink starts overflowing because of a frozen sewer hose, I will see the top of the container almost as soon as it does and I can even use it to see how much it is overflowing, by how much of the container I can see. So, if I see the container, I can fly out of bed to turn the water off. Especially if I see a good portion of it. Good thing I don't sleep much.

Sorry for the long reply, I am without TV or books or company and am extremely bored.
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Old 12-15-2008, 05:32 PM   #16
HamRad
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Blamb,

Wow! That is a lot of water. Your lab is drinking about 30 pounds of water and you are drinking about 80 pounds! I'm no expert but drinking that much water sounds dangerous. I've heard about people actually dieing from drinking too much water. I assume your doctor knows about this. If I drank that much I'd just sit in the bathroom. I wouldn't have any time to do anything else! Of course I'm much older than you are.

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Old 12-15-2008, 05:57 PM   #17
blamb
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heh, I've been told I drink way more than the average person. I've asked doctors about it over the years, they were the ones that told me that the reason I'm ok is because my body adapted to the habit from my dancing days, and that's why no kidney issues or water poisoning for me.
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Old 12-17-2008, 06:56 AM   #18
Bill and Lisa
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Wow Blamb.
I wasn't aware of all of the challenges you are facing and agree that your choice of solution is probably the best. The heat strip would "probably" work out just as well too but what you are doing sounds a tad more reliable. Wish there was a way to automate your dump valves so you don't have to go out and dump before turning in to make sure there is sufficent room in your tank. Well, there is a way to add a gate valve at the outside connection. You could add an electric, remotely operated valve there an leave the Grey tank valve open but then you face having the water in the exposed pipe freeze so that will not help in the cold. Might be an idea for the summer time though!
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Old 12-17-2008, 10:41 AM   #19
Waynem
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For informational purposes:

How To Cold Weather Camp In An RV

Not a final authority, but it does have some good information.

Edited: More Cold Weather Camping Info

I was curious so - The above was found doing a search on the words:

insulating sewer hose

The internet is a wonderful place, eh?

Just remember that everything you read on the Internet may not be, shall we say, the total truth.



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Old 12-29-2008, 05:17 AM   #20
sreigle
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Maybe someone said this and I missed it... You don't have to go that long on a single fill of the tank. When it gets low, just connect the hose and fill the tank. Then disconnect the hose again. It's not going to freeze in that 20 minutes or so. I see people do this all the time. Or, I did when we spent Decembers in the Kansas City area.

My winter water hose is heat taped plus the foam and it has worked fine. We've only been down to 5 below zero F a couple of times, though. Not here but back in our December in KC days.

Blamb, if it doesn't get too cold your hose setup might work. I'd guess down to maybe 22 or 23 or so. But don't forget the park's pipe, the part above ground, probably isn't insulated.

Good luck.
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