Prodigy - Montana Owners Club

RMccord · 07-17-2005, 07:57 AM

I have a 05 335rlbs. It has been towed about 350 miles so far. My friend and I adjusted the brakes today and decided that the best jacking point was on the bracket/point where the two springs and shackles are connected as this is a cast piece and goes directly to the chassis frame. We only raised the coach enough to get the tires free to rotate.

One tire seemed to need a good bit of adjustment to get it where it would only rotate about 1 turn when spun. THe other were very close to that already.
When I reconnected I went to adjust my prodigy to a point just before lock up. A point I have never been able to reach in the past no matter what setting or numerical number I set it to. Today was not different except that now if I set it too high or try it manually it will start braking and then the trailer brakes release and I get a LO reading or a SH. THis makes no sense as we did not touch any wiring. Further I have never seen those before. Also I cannot set my Prodigy level above about 6.8 or 6.9 with out getting that code. Whether manually or with truck brakes as well.
Many of you use prodigy and have a lot more experience that I do so I need some help as to how to interpret these codes and the actions to take or what. I cannot beleive the jack point nor the adjustment would cause these.
Thanks

FredG · 07-17-2005, 02:54 PM

According to the prodigy manual, the SH means the Prodigy "detects brake wire short during idle condition". The LO is not listed on the tow card.

Here's the link:
http://www.tekonsha.com/instructions...87_G%20web.pdf
Here's the FAQ link for the Prodigy that describes the conditions in more detail:
http://www.tekonsha.com/faqprodigy.html

I wonder if you may have pinched a wire when you had the trailer jacked up.

Fred

RMccord · 07-17-2005, 03:09 PM

Fred I thought of that but I looked under unit and see no wayn that could happen as I jacked it on the center spring braket in between the axles and there is no wiring anwhere near there. Actually I think the LO was OL which states Over load in my manual. I don't understand why or how this could occur.
Has anyone else had a similar problems and if so what did you have to do?
I cannot imagine that adjusting the brakes could affect the electronics. Nothing to do with them in my mind.
Would you take it to Camping World or the dealer for a check out?

jackw87 · 07-17-2005, 04:23 PM

I had ol on my prodigy and a brake disconect and trailer fault on my O5 ford brake controller and I pulled all of the hubs and found a wire clip broken and a wire rubbing the spindle til it shorted out

FredG · 07-17-2005, 05:32 PM

Bob and Carol,

I took a look at the Dexter service manual online (http://i.b5z.net/i/u/1080235/f/6-8K%...rakes_3-04.pdf) and they have some tips on troubleshooting. One thing that is interesting is that the magnet is a wear item. One point they make is that if the magenetic coil is visible through the friction material, it must be replaced. I wonder if your adjustment just brought the magnetic coils close enough to contact the drum during braking, thereby showing an overload and short.

I personally would rather bring it into a qualified service center. The brakes are a critical safety component of the trailer and I wouldn't mess with them beyond basic adjustments.

Fred

Bill and Ann · 07-18-2005, 01:31 AM

Bob and Carol. I would do both if I were you. Take it to Camping World if you bought the controller from them and have them make sure it isn't a faulty controller. If everything checks out with the controller then go to the dealer. You have a new model so it should be a warranty item.

Illini Trekker · 07-18-2005, 03:14 AM

Hi Bob I had the OL SH code on my set up also. With just raising the axle should not have brought on the codes but when setting the brake controller may have. The magnets in the wheel have been a weak point in past post! I have seen the passenger rear wheel has brought about the most problems in other post. With mine the dealer found a bad magnet, other post was pinched wire in that wheel. Was that the wheel you made the adjustment in (rear passenger side)? I bet it's not the controller it's the trailer!

mazeeff · 07-18-2005, 03:35 AM

The fact that you had to make such a large adjustment on one wheel, makes me beleive that the brake magnet on that wheel was already wore down. Perhaps it was adjusted too tight at the factory and simply ground down, and loosened up. Once a magnet has wore down, the resistance decreases, and a SH/OL on the prodigy is the result. When you adjusted the brake, you simply decreased the resistance enough to cause the failure. You can test this by measuring the resistance at the trailer between the brake line and ground. It should be about 2 ohms or so. I would measure it before and after making brake adjustments. I would loosen up that brake, and measure the resistance before and after. If there is a change, you found the problem.

RMccord · 07-18-2005, 04:02 AM

This is starting to be a pain in the ass!!!!!!!!
We leave on a long trip 8/5/05. I don't have any time off other than weekends between then and now. THe purchasing dealer is 100 miles away. Can only get there on a weekend. They do work weekends but I don't know if I can get in at this late date. I agree it would be underwarranty.
I can't beleive that they had it too tight to start I should have heard some rubbing when just barely moving you would think.
How hard is it to pull the hub off and look myself.
Would you trust Camping World to make the repairs. If only a $100-150 probably not much more expensive than dragging00 miles each way with cost of fuel and time.

drhowell · 07-18-2005, 04:18 AM

I would start by checking the wireing around each wheel and follow it back to where it disappears into the underside of the trailer. Especially anywhere the wire comes in contact with metal. If there is bare wire anywhere that can come in contact with metal you can get a similar condition. Move the wires around where they go through the backing plate on each wheel and pull (not too hard) just enough to move the wire where you can inspect it. If you don't find anything there you might have to pull some wheels and inspect the magnets. It isn't hard to pull the wheel and reset the bearings but if you don't know what you are looking for you may not be able to find the problem.

As new as your unit is I would not expect to find anything unusual in the wheels unless a wire has been pinched or a bad connection. Magnets do not fail very often especially with so few miles.

I would also look at the pig tail where it plugs into the truck. Did you hook or unhook the plug after you adjusted the brakes? Unlikely the problem is going to be easy to see but if you wiggle wires and have someone watch the controller it should give different readings when you get close to the problem area.

Thunderman · 07-18-2005, 05:20 AM

Bob,
If I read your first post correctly, that one tire had to be adjusted more than the others to get it to make one turn. That being the case I would think the magnet on that wheel was not engaging in the same manner as the others. If so, it should not be worn out. Suggest you double check wiring. On my 5er the wires are connected with the plastic connectors just before the wire enters the brake housing. This might be a problem area. As mentioned earlier do check your trailer connector on the tow vehicle as well as the trailer. Spray a lubricant in to the connectors. Pulling the brake drum off to look inside should not be difficult. You will need to back off your brakes adjustment (reverse of the adjustment you have done). The manual which came with my 5er has instructions on doing this. Basically the same as if you were going to pack the wheel bearings.
I mention the above due to your possible time restraint prior to the upcoming trip. You might consider a brake shop such as Brake Chek...might have to make a few calls to see if they do this work. Assuming this would be closer than your dealer. Good luck!

snowbunny · 07-18-2005, 05:34 AM

I had a similar problem after getting my Montana safety inspected last summer. I remember that one of the tests was to pull the emergency brake tether cable while the wheels were off the ground. I think that in the Prodigy manual it says not to do this while the trailer umbilical is connected to the truck. In any case, our Prodigy would read high or low almost all the time and needed to be replaced. Hopefully, this isn't your problem but it might give you insight into it.

Good luck.

mazeeff · 07-18-2005, 06:37 AM

An important question needs to be answered here.

1. When you saw the SH/LO error, was the truck/trailer stationary or moving with the brakes applied?

If the error came up when stationiary, then I would look for a shorted wire. If the error comes up when moving and brakes are applied, then I would look for a bad magnet. In my opinion all problems have a cause and effect. Either the jacking shorted a wire, or the adjustment decreased the magnet resistance. One easy test to isolate the wheel, would be to clip the wire going to the wheel that needed adjustment. If the problem goes away, you have isolated to the wheel. The blue wire connectors are crap anyways, so simply replace the splice with a good crimp and weatherproofing after the test.

mazeeff · 07-18-2005, 07:10 AM

I'm not sure if your unit has the Dexter axles, but if it does, here is a link to their service manual.

http://i.b5z.net/i/u/1080235/f/6-8K%...talog_3-04.pdf

The manual shows a table of expected resistance measured at the single brake, two brakes, and trailer connector. A good ohm meter should allow you to find the problem quickly. Pulling the brake drum can be a challange somwtimes, and may even require a puller. Since yours is new, it may come right off. Still a bit of work though. The reason I mention the magnet is that once they wear down, the fiction material of the magnet will wear away exposing the coil wiring inside the magnet. This will result in a short when the brakes are applied, when the coil wire touches the actuating arm. You never know what may have happened here. Perhaps a bad magnet during the build process, resulted in the builder simply backing off the adjuster to cure the problem! I have seen numerous examples of poor workmanship on these units, and anything is possible.

RMccord · 07-18-2005, 08:14 AM

The dealer has arranged for me to take it to their Ventura, CA point which sells keystone products but not Montana's. They are going to get it in tomorrow and get it resolved. It may take them a couple of days but that will get it resolved with a 10-15 mile tow vs. a 100 mile tow up the grapevine.
Easier on me and less mileage before resolved. It is warranty work. They want the TV also for a day to insure the short ins't there.
I will keep all posted

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