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Old 08-12-2008, 02:54 PM   #1
Waynem
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Braking (as in Brakes) Safety

I found the following article posted in the i2RV forum. With all the discussions about towing, breaking, 3/4 ton vs. 1 ton, I think the principles involved in this article can be applied to some logic. So, with permission of the writer, here it is: (It's quite lengthy)
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At request of DriVer, this is an elaboration of a portion of the seminar I presented at the 2007 iRV2 National Rally in Branson, MO. This is technical information and I've tried to present as simply as I can, but what makes sense to me may not make sense to you. So, feel free to ask for any clarification.

I will start out with one of the illustrations used to introduce the topic. A man and his wife were traveling though Texas in a Diesel pusher pulling a Jeep Grand Cherokee. He was traveling at the speed limit and was maintaining a safe distance when traffic suddenly shut down. He immediately jumped on the brakes at full bore. As he began to rapidly decelerate, he could feel the Jeep begin to push harder and harder on the back of the coach. At the last second before impact, he swerved to the left to avoid a collision with the tractor trail stopped in front of him; but only half of the motorhome cleared the trailer. The trailer cut through the passenger side of the coach like butter, taking his wife’s life on impact. Since there had been numerous accidents of this type in a relatively short period of time, Michigan State University’s accident reconstruction team was dispatched to see the cause of the accident, as well as to see if there were any measures that could have been taken to prevent this tragedy. The head of the project (who was in contact with SMI) concluded that if the towed vehicle had been using a supplemental braking system, the coach would have stopped at least one foot before impact rather than four feet after impact.

I am sure that the first question that comes to mind is “Why couldn’t a forty-footer with air brakes and an exhaust brake handle the weight of a 4000 lb. towed? It is still well under my GCWR.” I believe the definitions of the weight ratings will help clear up some of the confusion.


Dry Weight- The basic weight of the coach. No fuel, water, passengers, cargo, etc.– just the “nuts and bolts”

Curb Weight- The “ready-to-roll” weight of the coach. Includes all fluids and a full tank of fuel. Does not take into account passengers or cargo.

Gross-Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR)- The maximum amount of weight the coach’s chassis can handle (air bags/springs, shocks, brakes, etc.). This weight includes fuel, water, passengers, cargo, trailer tongue weight, food, and everything else. Most of the time your engine can comfortably pull more than you GVWR.

Gross Trailer Weight Rating (GTWR)- The total loaded-down weight of a trailer. The GTWR includes the weight of the trailer as well as all cargo and fluids on board. The static tongue load must be 10-15% of the total GTWR. This is the number used to determine which class of hitch and tow bar (Class III, Class IV, etc.) is necessary.

Gross-Combined Weight Rating (GCWR)- The combination of the GVWR and the GTWR.

*To find the maximum towable weight rating subtract the GVWR from the GCWR.


Here are some common misconceptions:

1) While it is true GCWR minus the GVWR is the maximum amount of weight a vehicle can pull, it is not the amount of weight the vehicle's chassis can stop. A SAE Class IV hitch has a weight rating of 10,000 lbs., but most chassis manufactures specify that any trailer over 1,000-1,500 lbs. (depending on the manufacturer) must be equipped with a braking system.

2) Supplemental brakes are necessary even if the total combined weight does not exceed the GVWR.

Common logic would say that 3500 lb. towed vehicle would put 3500 lbs. of force back of the coach. Remember, the 3,500 lbs. is measured vertically, not horizontally. At rest on flat ground, the 3,500 lb. vehicle is putting 0 lbs. of net force on the coach. So what is all the fuss about? A 3500 lbs. vehicle does not always put 3500 lb. of net force on the back of the coach. The amount of direct force is directly proportional to the rate of motion.

Newton’s laws of motion explain this phenomenon. Here is how the laws are normally summed up:

1) The Law of Inertia – An object in motion will stay in motion until it is acted upon by a net force.
Application- The towed vehicle will stay in motion until something stops it (e.g. friction, gravity, brakes, brick wall, etc.)

2) The Law of Acceleration – The force of an object is equal to the mass times the acceleration
Application- The force of the towed vehicle on the back of the coach is the weight times the rate of deceleration.

3) The Law of Reciprocal Forces – For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction
Application- The inertial mass generated by the towed vehicle will equally increase the braking effort of the coach.


Law number two is the key to understanding what happens to the coach in a panic stop. Newton stated it like this (translated from Latin): “The rate of change of momentum of a body is proportional to the resultant force acting on the body and is in the same direction.” Think of it like this, would you rather get hit in the face by a baseball that I tossed at you, or a MLB fastball? According to the “I don’t need a brake" mentality, they should feel the same. It is, after all, the same ball, isn't it? What changed? The rate of motion.

This law states that the force of an object is equal to its mass times its acceleration (F=ma). Another common misconception is the definition of acceleration. If a object is traveling at 60 mph at point A and 60 mph one second later at point B, its acceleration is not 60 mph, it is 0 mph per second. If an object is traveling at 60 mph at point A and 40 mph one second later at point C, its acceleration is 20 mph per second. Acceleration is defined as “the rate of change of velocity per unit of time.” The faster you try to stop, the higher the value “a” (acceleration) is multiplied by the static mass “m,” making the force “F” much higher. The ability to decelerate depends on the coach, the towed vehicle, and the weather conditions, but an average value would be 2.7 times the static weight of towed vehicle in a panic stop starting at 60 mph. This means the afore mentioned 3,500 lbs. towed in a panic stop towed has the same amount of force as a 9,470 lbs. towed in a medium stop.

Simply stated, it comes down to this: When you are trying to stop in a panic, you are not only trying to stop faster, but you are also trying to stop more weight.

Brent Schuck
Research and Development
Graphic Design

This message has been edited. Last edited by: SMI Manufacturing, Inc., September 20, 2007 06:08 PM


SMI Manufacturing, Inc.
P.O. Box 14040
Evansville, IN 47728
800-893-3763
info@smibrake.com
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Old 08-12-2008, 03:51 PM   #2
bsmeaton
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Braking (as in Brakes) Safety. "Break" and "Safety" just don't sound good together
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Old 08-12-2008, 04:45 PM   #3
Waynem
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semantics, Shemantics!!!! Phoo on me!

Edited: It may take me four more times to get it right!
Hey! I'm tired! I've been up 8 hours!!!!

p.s., now you'll have to explain what you are talking about.

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Old 08-12-2008, 05:50 PM   #4
JimF
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Wayne, get brakes on your toad tomorrow.. you are picking up the new unit aren't you?
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Old 08-13-2008, 03:42 AM   #5
Waynem
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This is tomorrow and I am waiting for the call to see if it is ready. If they don't call by 9:00 a.m. (15 minutes more) I'll call them for the status.

I don't have a TOAD yet. I want to get the MH before purchasing a TOAD. I would like ot measure the distance from the receiver on the MH to the ground and get a TOAD that will be as level as possible without a drop down connector. MH's have that 14 feet of overhang past the rear wheels and already will scrape bottom if not careful going into parking lots. Just something I want to think about, but I'm close.

I reall like the HHR. I already passed up a good deal, but it still may be there. 2008 HHR, Silver, 24K miles for $14.3K and then the dealer said, make an offer. Makes me think something is wrong with it. Most other TOADS in my price range are 2006 or earlier. Trying to stick with an SUV or along those lines (Like CR-V, VUE, Liberty, etc.)
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Old 08-13-2008, 04:05 AM   #6
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Wayne, That is a very interesting study done above. Just using the 2.7X figure he stated, that would mean I would be trying to stop a 40,500 lb trailer in a panic stop. Of course, the trailer has its own brakes, but in the event the trailer loses those brakes, one could say they are scr______ during a panic stop. I wonder if there are any stats on just how well the trailer brakes function. As I am having my suspension changed out and one of the questions I am trying to answer is IF I want to add disc brakes to our unit to replace the drums. At this point I am inclined to say YES, however, it is a fairly costly mod.
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Old 08-13-2008, 04:52 AM   #7
Waynem
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Phil,
I have always been very mindful of trailer brakes, our just about any breaking system. My Father-in-law, rest his soul, had a runaway MH going down the western side of the Rockies and had to use one of the pull off ramps. I was not with him, but his story was very interesting. He had a gasser class A with manual brakes. I'm not sure if the procedure for the newer models are the same, but he did not know that to engage the parking break, you had to throw the gear lever into park. This would send a clamp around the drive shaft and bring the MH to a screeching halt. (I'm not sure if 15 years ago I'd throw an MH into park at 40 or 50 mph.

I'm not sure, but I think disc brakes work more effectively on heavier loads over 3000# so your way to go may be good. I'd have to ask the experts.
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Old 08-13-2008, 07:09 AM   #8
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Phil: I upgraded from electric drums to hydraulic disc last September when I had my axles changed out from 6K to 7K. I wouldn't do it again!!! There is a definite lag between when you start to brake and the brakes coming on -- may be a second or less but it sure seems like forever sometimes. Also, when starting from a stop, there is a lag from releasing the brake petal and the brakes actually releasing as well. I've spoken with several other people who have them and they say mine are 'normal'. Now, once they engage, whoa nelly -- they do work and work nice. Haven't towed in the mountains as yet with them so I don't know how they will be vs. the electric drums I had last but the flat land aggrevation is such that I wouldn't do it again. As with a lot of things, this is just my opinion; others I'm sure will differ. If you get a chance -- try to tow one that has disc brakes...
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Old 08-13-2008, 08:40 AM   #9
richfaa
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There you go with logic.Folks will find 20 was to justify whatever it is that they do.Who needs logic for that..
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Old 08-13-2008, 08:43 AM   #10
bsmeaton
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Note that the Ford integrated brake controller will not work on electro/hydraulic systems, so if you install disk brakes you have to go to another controller. I have no idea why, just read it in the manual.
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Old 08-13-2008, 08:49 AM   #11
Delaine and Lindy
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Phil, while doing your suspension go with the Disk brakes you want believe the difference. Its like night and day. When we had the Cambridge I had Disk brakes installed by Mor/Ryde in Elkhart. My mistake when I changed to Disk brakes, I should have went with the independent suspension. I have Disk brakes on the (SOB) I now have, Disk brakes are standard on it. Good Luck with your choice. GBY...
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Old 08-13-2008, 02:35 PM   #12
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Thanks all, I have an appointment at MorRyde the week before the rally to have the IS installed and now, the disc brakes.....
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Old 08-14-2008, 03:06 AM   #13
Delaine and Lindy
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Phil thats a great upgrade. I just got a (SOB) and the GM brake controler didn't work. I had them put a Prodigy on, I wanted the Tenkonsha P-3 but they did't have one. But the P-3 has the same wiring and will plug and play. I can assure Gary and those techs will have the answer and you might get lucky and the GM IBC might work? In any case you will like the Disk brakes and the ID suspension. Good Luck. GBY....
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