Thor purchases Tiffin = Sad

[Jamesb]

Has nothing to do with Montana’s, but breaking news in the RV Industry. This is another sad day for the word “Quality”. Newmar was previously sold. It was our retirement “most-timers” dream to purchase a quality RV that we could travel Gods country without worrying “too much” about things falling apart. Most high end RVs are out of our league, but there were a few left, and Tiffin was one. Montana’s are on the list of course. But Thor? Come on now! I would never want to own a Thor product. Is it gonna come down to one manufacturer making all RV’s? I just don’t understand why they sell out when their market is back logged. Maybe greed? My stomach sank when I heard the news. The bigger they get, quality just trickles away. We just want a quality built FW or hopefully a gasser class A that is actually affordable. And they took another one away. Just don’t understand. I’ll quit ranting. Just thought I’d post it for the folks that keep up with the Industry.

[mlh]

I think I’ll just keep my old Fleetwood Jamboree. She is garage kept and only has 7000 miles on her and is built like a tank.
Lynwood

[66 Galaxie]

Originally Posted by Jamesb

Has nothing to do with Montana’s, but breaking news in the RV Industry. This is another sad day for the word “Quality”. Newmar was previously sold. It was our retirement “most-timers” dream to purchase a quality RV that we could travel Gods country without worrying “too much” about things falling apart. Most high end RVs are out of our league, but there were a few left, and Tiffin was one. Montana’s are on the list of course. But Thor? Come on now! I would never want to own a Thor product. Is it gonna come down to one manufacturer making all RV’s? I just don’t understand why they sell out when their market is back logged. Maybe greed? My stomach sank when I heard the news. The bigger they get, quality just trickles away. We just want a quality built FW or hopefully a gasser class A that is actually affordable. And they took another one away. Just don’t understand. I’ll quit ranting. Just thought I’d post it for the folks that keep up with the Industry.

Nothing to do with greed. The Tiffin's built that company and they deserve every penny. Bob Tiffin is at least 10yrs past retirement age and none of his boys want to work until they're dead. This has been in the works for quite a while and the Tiffin's are staying on for a bit to help the transition just like the Bontrager's did at Jayco.

[DadsHemi]

We seen this on our local news being the tiffins are built in Alabama, Red bay.

[BeagleMan]

Originally Posted by 66 Galaxie

Nothing to do with greed. The Tiffin's built that company and they deserve every penny. Bob Tiffin is at least 10yrs past retirement age and none of his boys want to work until they're dead. This has been in the works for quite a while and the Tiffin's are staying on for a bit to help the transition just like the Bontrager's did at Jayco.

Agreed. Same thing happened when I was at Cabela's. We got bought out by Bass Pro. EVERYBODY chalked it to greed. Truth is, One brother had died and the sister and other brother were getting up in years, when they had kids, most were daughters, and daughters do not grow up to run companies. They want to marry away and do their own thing. Same thing with Tiffin.

[mlh]

Originally Posted by BeagleMan

Agreed. Same thing happened when I was at Cabela's. We got bought out by Bass Pro. EVERYBODY chalked it to greed. Truth is, One brother had died and the sister and other brother were getting up in years, when they had kids, most were daughters, and daughters do not grow up to run companies. They want to marry away and do their own thing. Same thing with Tiffin.

We sold Gander Mountain muzzle breaks by the thousands until Cabelas bought them out. Cabelas shut all of that down. So no more muzzle breaks for them.
Lynwood

[BeagleMan]

Originally Posted by mlh

We sold Gander Mountain muzzle breaks by the thousands until Cabelas bought them out. Cabelas shut all of that down. So no more muzzle breaks for them.
Lynwood

Yeah, I still do not know why they did that.

[432bartman]

I didn't know Thor was a bad company. Our first 5th wheel was a Thor Jazz, which lasted many many years with no major issues. Well I hope the Tiffin coaches will still be made with quality.

[kowbra]

Originally Posted by Jamesb

Has nothing to do with Montana’s, but breaking news in the RV Industry. This is another sad day for the word “Quality”. Newmar was previously sold. It was our retirement “most-timers” dream to purchase a quality RV that we could travel Gods country without worrying “too much” about things falling apart. Most high end RVs are out of our league, but there were a few left, and Tiffin was one. Montana’s are on the list of course. But Thor? Come on now! I would never want to own a Thor product. Is it gonna come down to one manufacturer making all RV’s? I just don’t understand why they sell out when their market is back logged. Maybe greed? My stomach sank when I heard the news. The bigger they get, quality just trickles away. We just want a quality built FW or hopefully a gasser class A that is actually affordable. And they took another one away. Just don’t understand. I’ll quit ranting. Just thought I’d post it for the folks that keep up with the Industry.

Friends of ours bought a Tiffin MH a few years ago and had a number of issues. The fit and finish is amazing and it should be for the price. But, the same things that sideline many a 5th wheel sidelined them - a water pump, furnace issues, leveler problems and a few odds and ends that could have been caught before delivery. Some of those issues caused them to delay trips for weeks while waiting for parts and repair. We had no issues that delayed any trips with our new 5th wheel we bought at the same time.

So, not discounting what you say about the sale to Thor, but I also think that all companies can have some issues, and often those issues are due to the same parts that are from the same suppliers as many of the other RVs.

As to whether it's sad or not; I agree with those who say the Tiffin's deserve to be rewarded for decades of hard work, and it will take time to know how the Thor buyout will impact the quality. Not automatically sad, but I guess we'll see.

Brad

[Theunz]

Quote... Most high end RVs are out of our league, but there were a few left, and Tiffin was one. Montana’s are on the list of course. But Thor? Come on now! I would never want to own a Thor product.

Ahh....who do you think owns Keystone, who builds the Montana you own?

[WeBeFulltime]

I was under the impression that Keystones was a Thor company.

[Dave W]

Money talks and Tiffen sold at a price that made the owners (or banks) happy. Thor and Forest River own most of the RV industry with LCI or Dometic most of the support products. The big get bigger and the small disappear. That's life in the corporate world. Unfortunately and part of Economics 101.

[lewy64]

thor rv companies

[richfaa]

Thor purchased Keystone RV many years ago. Thor owns like 18 Rv companies.

[1retired06]

And Camping World is gobbling up independant RV dealerships.

[jcurtis934]

Actually, Bob Tiffin started the talks with Thor and wanted to be a part of the Thor group. Time will show what changes occur within Tiffin that are dictated by Thor. The cash investment could be a good thing for Tiffin.

[mtlakejim]

I worked in the corporate world for decades. It never fails that a large company buys a small company because they are doing well and ends up destroying the very culture that made the small company successful.


It may take a while but eventually Thor will ruin Tiffin.


I will also say that there are people out there that start companies with the express idea of building a brand with good reputation that they can sell off to the large umbrella corporations. Grand Design is a recent example of this. It was started by former corporate executives with the full intent of selling off down the road.

[kowbra]

Originally Posted by mtlakejim

I worked in the corporate world for decades. It never fails that a large company buys a small company because they are doing well and ends up destroying the very culture that made the small company successful.


It may take a while but eventually Thor will ruin Tiffin.


I will also say that there are people out there that start companies with the express idea of building a brand with good reputation that they can sell off to the large umbrella corporations. Grand Design is a recent example of this. It was started by former corporate executives with the full intent of selling off down the road.

Agree to disagree on the "never fails... ands ends up destroying the very culture..."
M&A is tricky for sure, there are many challenges. And, often deals do not work out as planned. But, done right it can work, and work well.

Let's not pretend we have a crystal ball here.

Brad

[mtlakejim]

Originally Posted by kowbra

Agree to disagree on the "never fails... ands ends up destroying the very culture..."
M&A is tricky for sure, there are many challenges. And, often deals do not work out as planned. But, done right it can work, and work well.

Let's not pretend we have a crystal ball here.

Brad

You don't need a crystal ball, just common sense and a view into history. Let me put it this way, name ONE company that was bought out and their product got better.

I have lived first hand several mergers and they ALWAYS end up badly!

[kowbra]

Originally Posted by mtlakejim

You don't need a crystal ball, just common sense and a view into history. Let me put it this way, name ONE company that was bought out and their product got better.

I have lived first hand several mergers and they ALWAYS end up badly!

See my post #24. I disagree, and Montana is proof that not all do end badly.

And, BTW, a data set of "several" is not proof of "ALWAYS" ;-)

Brad