Disappointing day with Keystone

[RMccord]

Orv:

Robbie is absolutely correct I was referring to the moderator not you. I am very aware of the concern and kind words and support that everyone is giving and offering and it is appreciated.
Thanks and I apologize for any confussion I may have created.

[DHenry]

"I would appreciate and will be expecting a call at 805-???-???? on 12/26 from some one in the Keystone Montana Big Sky Management other than Charles Wade who can or would like to discuss our recent experience at Mike Thompson's RV in Colton, CA today Saturday 12/22/07."

I am curious, did anyone call you yesterday?

[RMccord]

No

[Mrs. CountryGuy]

In years past, it seems to me that they have had a plant shutdown over the holiday season. I have no idea if that is so this year, and that sure does not help Bob in his time frame and his situation. Just throwing out there for a "what if".

[Ramblin Roadrunners]

Most manufactures of products will put their product out there knowing that it is not perfect. It is more efficient for them to move the product down the assembly line and do the corrections at PDI. The American auto manufactures did this for years and only more recently after loosing market share have the produced a more trouble free product. Gm shipped me an all wheel drive Astro van with the wrong fluid in the transfer case knowing it would fail under warrenty and need to be replaced. It is more cost effective to move the product to sales and have the dealer clean up loose ends. Many products are rushed to market by the manufactures using us as the test market. Microsoft comes to mind. They have fixes to their product before we get home with it the first day after it is released to the public. We have become the test market for many products. It shouldn't be this way but that is the way it is. My opinion is that the dealer is Crap.
Jay D.

[RMccord]

Actually the offices were back and open yesterday per their voice mail and their telephones. Probably however with reduced staff. I would imagine the plant works the Old World Craftsman are off.

[Ramblin Roadrunners]

Bob, by the looks of the fine craftsmanship you do on model railroading; you should PDI your own RV. LOL
Jay D.

[RMccord]

Thanks for the kind words. I am afraid if I took this one I would be.

[racerjoe]

I also feel the same as you when it comes to Keystones response to it's customer base. it is not very good. As I have said in another post, you pay a lot of your hard earned money to buy you think one of the best units out there,only to be disappointed by keystones non actions. My feeling is that we are the consumer in this transaction,and without our checkbooks,there would be no Keystone or other sub-par manufacturer. We deserve a quality product at a fair price. Lets see how the manufacturers act next year as gas hits $4.00 a gallon and they start begging for your business.

[dieselguy]

I've owned a couple of Keystone products since 2000. I've had need to contact Keystone directly 3 times during that period ... entry door replacement, full set of decals replacement, stress crack fix by bedroom slide. Each time I had a response within 24 hours either by email or phone call. Each time I was treated fairly and was taken care of exceeding my expectations. Perhaps I was just fortunate by who responded to my calls ... perhaps it was how each side handled the situation. Bob has a definite position to gripe from, but several of us have had excellent service from Keystone when it came time to stand behind their product. Had the dealer employed a dependable prep person(s), a major portion of the issues would have been non-existant.

[richfaa]

We take our fustrations out on Keystone, Myself included, because that is where we spent our hard earned cash. However, the evidence is overwelming, The problem is industry wide and we, as consumers, who do not make ourselves heard loud enough, are a large part of the problem.
Montana is but 10 years old and is still establishing a track record. That record should be one of excellence, better than the rest. If the consumer realizes that the "marketing" does not meet the expectations of their purchase,they may not survive.Customer service is one of the reasons many of us chose the Montana over other brands. Should that degrade then why purchase the Montana when there are other brands out there no better no worse than the Montana. Having said that we have had more than our share of Montana problems but have never had a problem communicating with Keystone and have always been treated fairly and to our complete satisfaction.. We are now out of Keystone Warranty and we do not speak to them much anymore as we do not expect them to do anything outside of the 1 year warranty. They have done that in the past and we will talk to them IF we feel they might respond. We do have the Service Contract (so called extended Warranty) and vendor Warranties are still outstanding.. As for Ole Rich.. In terms of workmanship and quality the Montana is no better no worse than several other brands in that price range. Keystone Customer service and quality of dealer made the difference to us and so far we have been completely satisfied. I probably fall into the "it's that guy again" catagory with Customer service but am always satisfied. Bob is correct in Holding both Keystone and the dealers feet to the fire... We should all do the same.

[bsmeaton]

I may be standing here by myself, but I think Keystone has been overwhelmingly responsive to it's customer base, more so than the typical industry. Not just in "out-of-warranty" work, but in general addition of features based on customer feedback.

Remember the food chain here folks! Keystone is not a "Consumer Direct Factory" like some of the others (New Horizon). We are the Dealership's customer base, and the Dealerships are the Factorie's customer base. Until the transaction transpires between the Dealership and Bob, Keystone has no obligation for open diologue with Bob any more than Thor does. In fact, direct discussion and commitment with Bob behind the Dealership's back would only serve to alienate the trust between the Dealerships and the Factory. From Bob's perspective, this is a Dealership problem, not Keystones. He still has all of the choices including finding another Dealer or even another brand.

I personally found my trailer to be in a deliverable condition when I picked it up. However, I have no idea how it got delivered to the Dealer but I suspect it had many of the same issues as this Big Sky.

[Crossthread]

Brad, May I respectively disagree that keystone should not have any conversations with Bob. He did place a deposit down to secure the contract for his intent to buy.(I had to when I ordered mine at the same show the previous year).I belive that would involve keystone in the conversation. I can accept the fact that it's the Christmas Season, and most likely the higher management that should be involved are off.But someone should return his call.I think he was most upset at the workmanship ,as I remember doors loose, some hard to close. No generator nor the slide tray installed as per the order form. Plus other items, even before the pdi. I don't believe that he recieved what he ordered. Someone has to be responsible enough to stand up tell what happened. Bill

[Mudchief]

Brad,I agree with you 100%. As a dealer for a larger company I am their customer not the end user. I don't care what the warranty states. I take care of the customer first then fight with the factory to make it right with me. That is the way any good Montana dealer will be also. After having many failures on the Quest 4000 in my Montana the dealer put a different unit in it even tho my unit was out of warranty. I did not call Keystone because he knew there was a problem with those units and he took care of me the customer like any good dealer should.

[RMccord]

MSBeaton I think in this case Keystone does have an obligation to talk to me since I ordered this unit at the Manufactures RV Show not a dealers RV Show. There were multiple Keystone people pitching the product and I spent over 2 1/2 hours talking exclusively to Mark Farnham for about 1 hour and Charles Wade (one on one) for 90 minutes plus. Sure Mike Thompson's people were there but Keystone staff were there to answer every question and squash any purchasers concerns. They just have not live up to the hype.

I was told today when we went back to see the unit again (and still things were not fixed.) That Charles Wade had advised them that he was calling me Friday evening. I did not get a call.
I have as of this afternoon now canceled that order after driving there again today and seeing that now a week later that some of the minor items have not been addressed not to mention bigger ones.

I still expect Keystone to follow up with a call but we are now non Montana owners and we have traded our Mountaineer in else where. If they do fine if not well that is ok too. As I was not sitting around after last Saturday but looking at other Montana dealers and other SOB's. After the trip this morning and still loose ends we unwound the deal and went over and picked up another unit. If interested in that you can view my post in the SOB area.

I hope I can remain a MOC member. I have enjoyed all the input and sharing information and if the Spring Rally lets non Montana owners attend we will provided I can wrangle the time off like to attend.

Bob

[TLightning]

Some dealers have serious internal problems. My dealer, owner and sales/office staff, are all very knowledgeable, helpful, courteous and our rig came exactly as ordered in excellent condition. However, we have had several high dollar ad ons that were ordered and installed by the dealer's service department. The service manager does not have a clue about the majority of things going on in his end of the business. When I have a W/D installed, I don't expect him to come out with an extra part and say, "I don't know what this is, it came in the tub." This has happen with the W/D and a similar instance with the 5th Airborne pin box he installed.

I had an idea things were not good, when he gave me all the instructions, including installation instructions, still in a sealed wrapper.

[PartyCrashers]

RMccord-

I have read your post and all the follow-ups.
I feel for you and your dissappointment about the delivery of the Big Sky. What a shame because that is a nice unit.

I must tell you that I have agreed with everything you have said and done. We all should learn through your experience.

As far as owning a SOB. I will tell you, we too are SOB's owners. It is just the way it is for us right now.

Why are we members of the MOC?....Well we do have plans of owning a Montana (someday) But also my sister who owns a Montana and is a member on this site introduced us to this site.

We have particapated in the mini rallies on the West Coast. Meet really nice and friendly people who have the same interest that we do....owning an RV.

I continue to be a member of the MOC because even thou I own a different brand of trailer I still have the same interest....dump questions, slideout being level or sticking, tires, smoke alarms being sensitive, GPS, .....suggestions of campgrounds....many more ideas and seeking knowledge that have nothing to do with what brand of trailer I have. The MOC has always been there for us and I too will still be there no matter what type of trailer I have.

I'm saying all this to you, so you will know that even thou you are now an SOB you are still like the rest of everybody else here....A fellow RV owner with the same interest as everybody else.

I also want to let you and everybody else know that the reason I choose to stay on the MOC is because of the type of people on here....they all have class! There are other sites to choose from, but as we all know the one most popular site out there has a few idiots that can ruin it for everybody else. I also belong to a web site that is geared for owners of the SOB I own. Nice site too....but I crave the MOC

So Thank You RMccord for being honest and sticking with what you feel is right, and yet handling it with respect to other MOC owners.

And Thank You MOC members for allowing me to continue to be a MOCer, even thou I'm an SOB

Denise

[RMccord]

I agree I have enjoyed the friendship and many off forum emails from many MOC members. It has been fun and informative. I too intend to continue to stay on board but there are a couple who seem to have an issue and I did respond to one post. I will do my best to refrain and behave but I also am not one bit disappointed or second guessing my decision. We have owned Montana and could again I just won't be owning one for a while.
Thanks for your remarks and support and thanks to everyone for your feedback, recommendations, and any other help you have rendered me. I would like to attend the Spring Rally if I can pull somehow getting the time off and if SOB's both myself and my new unit would be welcome.

[FulltimeFollies]

I see more of a personality conflict , rather than a Keystone/Customer conflict. But like most, thats just my take. Strangest stroy I have heard in months.

[Dustytuu]

A good dealer can make a purchase of any brand good or bad.
I would not purchase anything that cost as much money as an RV without checking out dealer ratings on the web.

http://www.rvservicereviews.com/Index.asp