Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 

Go Back   Montana Owners Club - Keystone Montana 5th Wheel Forum > MOC Technical Forums > Montana Problems, Problem Solving & Technical Help
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 01-09-2008, 12:14 PM   #1
snfexpress
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: South
Posts: 2,499
M.O.C. #5140
Axle Bracket Warning!

Was under the 5er yesterday trying to diagnose why the galley tank is leaking when it fills up. So, while trying to get the belly pan cover off so I could see up in the belly, I saw this:





The first picture shows that the bracket is completely broken and the leaf spring making direct pressure contact with the frame.

The second picture is the same axle, but the passenger side. Here, you can see the bracket near failure.

Right next to me is a 2007 Montana - guess what? He has fatigue cracks developing on the rear axle brackets, as well.

I spoke with Bill at Lippert and he is sending me two new U brackets and has promised to reimburse my expenses of hiring a mobile welder. I am out of warranty with Keystone, but within the 2 year warranty with Lippert. He was extremely helpful and courteous on the telephone.

I do not want to move the Monty until the brackets are replaced.

I would suggest that everyone take a look underneath your 5er where the rear axle leaf spring attaches to the bracket to see if your bracket is showing signs of fatigue or worse.
 
snfexpress is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2008, 12:24 PM   #2
Waynem
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Texas City
Posts: 5,736
M.O.C. #7673
Ouch!
Thanks for the info.
Waynem is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2008, 01:20 PM   #3
Ozz
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: K.C.
Posts: 11,731
M.O.C. #5980
Thanks, Michael for the heads up, and good luck on it. Good thing you are observant. Good luck on that galley tank problem as well.
Ozz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2008, 02:07 PM   #4
richfaa
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
Good that you caught that..Could have been big trouble. We had all that replaced with the heavy duty brackets and grease fittings at the fall rally. Will go down and look at Dave's (dsprik) tomorrow.
richfaa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2008, 02:15 PM   #5
snfexpress
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: South
Posts: 2,499
M.O.C. #5140
Rich - do the newer brackets replace the ones in the above pictures? If so, whom do I contact to obtain them?
snfexpress is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2008, 02:37 PM   #6
HamRad
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bakersfield
Posts: 5,316
M.O.C. #15
Rich,

I think the pictures that Mike has posted show the actual bracket that connects the leaf springs to the frame of the trailer. I think what you had replaced was something other than the actual bracket.

We replaced our worn shackles and equalizers. We used the heavy duty ones for replacement. But we did not replace the brackets that are shown in the pictures Mike posted.

Now there's something else to check. Thanks for alerting us Mike.

Dennis
HamRad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2008, 02:46 PM   #7
noneck
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Wappingers Falls
Posts: 1,303
M.O.C. #6263
Send a message via AIM to noneck
That is NOT good! Rear axle brackets only? Would make one wonder if some sort of additional re-enforcement should be considered as pictures suggest the plate thickness fractured and it had nothing to do with any prior weld fault?
noneck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2008, 03:04 PM   #8
snfexpress
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: South
Posts: 2,499
M.O.C. #5140
Noneck - I agree with your assessment about the thickness of the brackets, especially when I look at my neighbor's 2007 and see similar fatigue cracks. Don't quite know how to make it better...
snfexpress is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2008, 03:35 PM   #9
racerjoe
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: silver creek
Posts: 1,507
M.O.C. #7770
Can I ask,how many trips or miles are on this unit? Do you pull on long trips or many short weekends etc: Could this be caused by many tight turns when backing into sites or back home parking. It sure wants to make us all do a good inspection this spring when out of winter storage.
racerjoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2008, 04:04 PM   #10
snfexpress
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: South
Posts: 2,499
M.O.C. #5140
We have been in this unit full time since 4/07 and were long time since 4/06. In '07 we pulled it from Reno to San Diego, thru Colorado, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Florida, Louisiana, Texas, Arizona and their connecting states - so, yes, we have some miles on this unit. Backing is minimal, but like others, we back into spaces when necessary.

The more I think about it, especially after looking at my neighbor's 2007 Montana were I see fatigue cracks (small, but they are appearing), I wonder how many of you have the same thing? I would be interested in knowing.
snfexpress is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2008, 04:13 PM   #11
rickfox
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Royse City
Posts: 520
M.O.C. #2959
You can bet that I'll be out there looking tomorrow.
rickfox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2008, 02:15 AM   #12
richfaa
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
Took a look this AM..Those brackets are wielded to the frame and are NOT part of the heavy duty kit although there is a grease fitting there now. Mine are fine and show no signs of stress.Looks like it broke right at the wield..Do you think the wield was defective???or maybe due to side to side stress.The stress cracked are hard to see but look like they are right at the wield. How were the front brackets??Strange that they both broke at the rear...there is more to this than meets the eye??You put a lot of miles on the unit could this be a problem that is going to occur with high highway miles?? This is of great concern to me.Perhaps the person who replaces the brackets can determine what the cause was...keep us advised...
richfaa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2008, 12:03 PM   #13
sgtpp214
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Washburn
Posts: 591
M.O.C. #1782
Took the Monty in to get broken right rear leaf spring replaced and mechanic discovered the stress problem with the rear spring bracket. Unfortunately Easy Care wouldn't cover it under our extended warranty. I checked the other brackets and no stress cracks evident.
sgtpp214 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2008, 12:23 PM   #14
racerjoe
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: silver creek
Posts: 1,507
M.O.C. #7770
The reason of my question is that we do several trips a season,so we are always having to manuver it into a camp ground or back at home. When we park it at home,the turn from the road to a blacktop driveway does put some stress on the rear axle it seems. Thats why I was asking if your trips are short hops or more highway miles,which in your case that is the bulk of it. So it will be interesting to see if our short trips in and out of camps and return home is doing the same thing.
racerjoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2008, 03:53 PM   #15
sreigle
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oceanside
Posts: 20,028
M.O.C. #20
Thanks for the tip, Michael. Now I need to crawl under and check ours. It's about time to check our shackles, too.
sreigle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2008, 03:01 AM   #16
hazmic
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: cedar rapids
Posts: 703
M.O.C. #4962
When the brackets are made they probably are stamped cold. When metal is bent this way there is a weakness and stress in the bend. After they were bent they should have been heat treated to relieve the stress in the bend and of course that takes money. Also as you can see where the bend is it stretches the metal and it is thinner there then in the rest of the bracket which also weakens the bracket. There things that they could do to correct this problem. Let's see if the [Lippert] corrects this problem. In my opinion replacing the brackets is just a band-aid as the new ones can break also.
hazmic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2008, 04:01 AM   #17
snfexpress
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: South
Posts: 2,499
M.O.C. #5140
The welder is due any minute, now. I have been thinking about how to reinforce the brackets and feel that a gusset above the bolt hole might provide considerable strength. We'll see.

While Lippert is helping me in this situation, the specifications come from Keystone.

I'll keep everyone posted.
snfexpress is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2008, 10:22 AM   #18
snfexpress
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: South
Posts: 2,499
M.O.C. #5140
Okay, here are some pictures of today's efforts:







Added some gussets to the brackets. Welder's opinion was 3/16" steel is insufficient - should be at least 1/4" thick stock.

I'm beat - I was the gopher and helper.
snfexpress is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2008, 10:30 AM   #19
richfaa
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
I will have a chat with the Keystone folks at the Tampa Rv show re the brackets and why they figure 3/16 stock is sufficient??
richfaa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2008, 10:34 AM   #20
snfexpress
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: South
Posts: 2,499
M.O.C. #5140
Rich - very interested in their response. If the passenger side bracket had failed completely, like the driver side bracket did, while on the freeway, would we still be in one piece? Or would we have signed off from this forum for good?

I looked at an Alumascape next door - wow! The brackets are thick and reinforced:


snfexpress is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Add tv bracket to basement drbatdorff Additions & Improvements 8 03-10-2017 04:11 AM
Montana pin box bracket johnpjpa Tow Vehicles & Towing 5 03-03-2011 12:05 PM
What kind of bracket Allen in MT Montana Problems, Problem Solving & Technical Help 7 12-10-2008 08:51 AM
Drape Bracket? Dick n Marie Montana Problems, Problem Solving & Technical Help 4 10-13-2007 06:33 PM
Do I need a slide bracket? SRD Montana Problems, Problem Solving & Technical Help 0 12-22-2003 11:02 AM

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Montana RV, Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:10 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.