Trailer Backing Question

[tim43]

I try and avoid anything but pull thru sites. This has been a great learning thread for me and hope to benefit from it. Being left handed and backing up just seems to add confusion to the process for me, but I'm getting better. I have a slider hitch, so when I have to make those tight backing maneuvers, I always slide the hitch back which seems to help the process.

[HamRad]

Bob Pasternak,
Bob we sure missed you this year at Lake Siskiyou. I especially missed you at our annual Mexican restaurant gathering. I can still see you in your little Bolder Hat! Sure sorry you've had to cut back on the traveling.

We certainly could have used your expertise in backing too. As a retired truck driver I'm sure you could straightened us all out on the proper backing procedure.

Take care and hope to see you on down the road.

Dennis and Mary Kay

[Waynem]

I have never had a problem backing up EXCEPT (never say never) the very last time I tried to back it into my storage spot. I had made that maneuver many times with success, but the last time I backed, and backed and backed and after (in my mind) an hour, I got out and did a walk around. DW was directing me. I went to a spot in the drive and made an "x" with my toe and told her to signal me as soon as my back tire was on that spot. She did and I put it in storage as I had always done before, between the steel girder and the other 5er in the stall next to mine. There were several people standing around making me feel like a "learner permit."

It will happen. There will be a time where you have that mental block and just can't seem to get it right. Slow is definitely a must, and a ground guide is a must also.

[richfaa]

At home we back off a standard city street into our drive way then do sort of a "S" to stuff it against the house and the edge of the driveway. Helen does it most all of the time and I spot. That works best for us. She will set those little orange cone on the drive way to mark her turn points.Some times she can do it in one smooth maneuver most times not.We have the camera in the back that helps. I am a simple person and like to do things in a simple manner. We can almost always get into a pull through in one try.....

[Mrs. CountryGuy]

Jim,

Gotta say, I like this:

"Getting the trailer into the site on one try isn't the goal. Getting it into the site in one piece is."

That said, backing up is one of the things Mrs. CountryGuy has not come close to mastering. SIGHHH

[indy roadrunner]

I have to precision back mine off the street to a spot beside the house and we even have 2x10 boards we back up on that are half buried in the gravel so we are level - and this process is a jackknife off the street. One thing I do and mentally this helps me is that while in the process of tightly turning the trailer you look at the wheels and they are straining with the bend. So I will pull forward just a little bit just to unload the wheels and it seems to me helps with the manuevering. Once again no facts on this - just seem logical to me to unload some of the pressure on those wheels when they are bent over trying to make the bend. Might save you sidewalls some.

[exav8tr]

I actually prefer the back in sites as most are on the perimeter of the CG and usually, AGAIN, usually they are the preferred sites as you normally do not have someone behind you. Another trick I learned at Truck Driving School, is to put the truck in 4WD, if you have it. This gives you a lower gearing and the turck will virtually creep in reverse, you don't need as much gas control. BTW, my first Back-in job was into a 90degree site with no room for awning and barely enough for the slides, it was in Canada. Many onlookers really made me slow down and do it right. As it was it still took me several tries, but I did not damage anything and that is the object, as Carol says....

[mtpocket2]

Just last week we had a site that was at a 90 from the street. The street went steeply down hill and the campsite was on an up hill slope. The road was 1 and a 1/2 cars wide with a 2 foot drop off on one side. Trees on the other. The first try I probably had it but thought I can do better. It went down hill from there. Couldn't even get close to going in after that. Before it got uglier time to re-rack. So I told the wife I will be back and went around the campground loop again. Went right in. Sometimes I do not know how these State Parks come up with their equipment lengths. The pad was long enough but if you cant get the equipment in there doesn't matter how long the pad is. You will eventually need to back up and it's important as previously stated to be able to do it. The most important rule is do not get mad at the wife directing. Trust me I know cause I often violate this rule and the fines are very, very, very high. The other thing to remember is the people watching and the people waiting to get by will not pay your deductible if you tear something up so let them wait and watch and point and laugh. Take your time!! They can wait.

[sreigle]

First time I saw our neighbor (earlier this month) in this park he congratulated me on a fine job of backing into this rather difficult (uphill on gravel with trees on three sides) site. I had to explain to him that standing near the driver door as I was backing was one of the park workers assigned to talking rv owners through the backing process. This guy was good. It would have taken me more time and a few back and forths had he not been there. As others stated, a good spotter is very helpful.

[H. John Kohl]

All the comments are right on the money, however, I feel only Wayne seemed to provide information focused on answering your question. Without using my hands this is going to be hard so we will just forget it. LOL.

My impression of Jack knifing into a site means you want your truck to stay on the road and your trailer be heading into the site. Wayne's "S" comment is on track.

First I would like to discuss my thoughts of the basics of a fifth wheel movement when backing/turning. You steer the trailer by pushing the nose. So you have to maneuver the truck into an angle to the nose of trailer to push the nose in that direction. The tighter the turn the more angle the truck has to have on the trailer before the nose of the trailer starts moving in the desired direction. This sets up my first rule of thumb, pull farther forward than you think. And I have to pull even farther forward after that.

Most folks will find that backing from the driver’s side is easier than from the passenger or “blind” side. This means you would pull down the road and your site is on the drives side or the back end of the trailer has to turn in towards the driver’s side.

So if you pulled down the road in a straight line, the site is on the driver’s side and your truck and trailer are still straight when you start to back into the site the first action you have to do is make your truck push the nose of the trailer away from the driver’s side of the road.
You do this by pushing your back end of your truck away from the driver’s side of the road meaning the front wheels have to force the nose of the truck close to the driver’s side of the road. Rule: Never have the truck and trailer on the extreme edge of the road for a backing maneuver. While you are adjusting or starting to position your truck to move the nose of the trailer your trailer tires are move backwards. This is why you have to pull farther past the site than you think.

You will have to learn how fast your vehicles (truck and trailer) react and the parking lot practice is a great place to practice that.

Once you have your truck at about a 45 degree angle to the road you are almost on a 90 angle turn with your trailer. This means you are pushing the nose at the fastest rate based on reward motion of the truck.

Your trailer tires should be on the corner of the site and the trailer pivoting on them. As stated this is the worse torque on them and the trailer suspension.

Now you have to get the truck lined up with the parking spot as well as the trailer so you have to turn your truck so the back end is moving the nose towards the driver’s side. To do this you now forces the nose of the truck to be swung towards the passenger’s side and a blind spot (around your front fender) develops quickly. Make sure the front passenger tire does not take out a marker post on the passenger’s side of the road. Been there, done that, got the T shirt. Note: a lot needs to be said about blind spots for truck and trailer so you want a person watching the spots you cannot see. Also remember the tops of the trailer for low limbs.

If you are good you have corrected the nose swing at the exact time. (I am not that good.) So, your truck and trailer are lined up to push back it a spot.

With the above discussion Wayne’s comment about the “S” is most important because the S will help position the truck so it is already getting into position to move the nose because it is in a turn instead of a straight line. To set up the “S” you would move to the driver side of the road then turn the truck to the passenger side bringing the nose of the trailer as close to the passenger side of the road and then turn the nose of the truck so it is pointing toward the driver’s side. Your trailer does not have to move as far back before the truck is at the desired angle.

As suggested, I recommend going to a parking lot and use their lines as a marker. With cones or buckets mark a site around your trailer and then pull your trailer out of the marked site making the jack knife turn moving forward. Use a rope to mark where the trailer tires are during this turn will give you a guide for where your tires should be when backing in. This will give you a feeling of the “perfect position” for the truck if it was doing the action in reverse. Now try and retrace the step/movement. Then pull around the block so to speak and try setting up to do it as if you just arrived.

Remember it is all in the three magic words. PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE

Hope this helps and it is a short version of the process.

[Mrs. CountryGuy]

WOW JOHN!!!

Now, I know why I cannot back up!

Fine piece of writing there, I am gonna have to read it several times for it to sink into my thick gray matter.

Would you mind if I have some more java first??

Seriously, good stuff!!

[Fire5er]

I too use the method Waynem outlined. Another suggestion for communicating between the driver in the cab and the spotter...we use our cell phones. I put my cell phone on speaker or hands-free so I can use both hands on the wheel. DW talks to me via the cell phone about what I can't see. I watch the trailer wheels in the mirrors and steer them where I want them. The cell phone allows us to both talk at the same time if needed....like when we need to STOP. We found that using the walkie-talkie type radios that if one was talking the other couldn't say anything until they released the button. Now being a Firefighter for 27+ years I understood this concept, but my DW didn't... and when she started talking - well the cell phones work better for our marriage of 33 years.

[sailer]

Well guys as exnavydiver saw at our house in bonita when we got back from the keys , I have to back into the driveway on the blind side on a 1 lane blj top rd with trees in the meaden with 2 ' of grass only ,, the drive way we park on the far side so i slip it in and the drive way from the overhang on the house is 38' 6" and the rd is 12' wide with 34" to a tree in the front of the truck. as we have a pullrite hitch you have to be 8 degrees from straight so it takes jacking back 18" to get the truck straight but sharon and i do it now in about 7 minitues and the nose of the monta is off the blk top by 3 " so the garabge truck can get through.. we only leave it there to load and unload about 2 days but i can get the monta on the far side of the drive and park the truck next to it on the concrete as its a 17' wide drive so its close,, slow down and be sure to use hand signs showing the 2 hands together how far from the room you are , not yell stop ,its too late ,pull the hand together as 4" apart and so but you have to see each other in the mirror. no talking and no dogs in the way , ask exnavydiver how close it is , he was amased sailer

[sreigle]

I used to use the "S" maneuver prior to backing because it just seemed to make sense. And it works in most situations. However, we once had to jackknife into a 90 degree site (sites not angled to the street) with 7' hedges on three sides of the site and a very, very narrow access road. The "S" maneuver did not allow enough rooom for the truck before I ran out of road for backing the truck (those hedges on the site across the street). I would have run down those hedges across the street.

Our new neighbor saw what was happening and came out to help. He explained to me he's a retired 18 wheeler driver and I should line up the truck and trailer straight and not do the "S" maneuver. Rather, he said to keep the truck and trailer straight and within a foot or so of the edge of the road. He then proceeded to talk me into the site. His method worked.

So, I'll do the S maneuver if the access road is wide enough. Otherwise, I use the trucker's method. It's the only one that has worked for me in that tight situation.

Whatever works for you, use it.

[Bob Pasternak]

Hamrad: Dennis, we missed being there a lot. Jeanne's B'Day was April 30 an I took her to Oahu. We just toughed it out on Oahu and Waikiki for a week. Thank you much for the thoughts, though.

[Bill-N-Donna]

When I back into our drive way I have to jack knife the camper and truck about 90°. I have to pull up a lot and straighten it out after I get around this large bush and then I have to turn the other direction to back it on in. I think the angle and number of adjustments will depend a lot on your wheel base. It isn’t always one smooth move but practice will make it a lot better over time.

[akf15e]

It sounds kind of simple, but it works for me. I visualize how the vehicles would come out of the spot and just reverse the process.

I adopted this process at home where I have to back 90 degrees into my driveway and the neighbors mailbox and ditches on either side of my driveway entrance all conspire against me.

One day I realized that I never drop the 5er into the ditches or hit mailboxes when I leave to go camping, so why should it be an issue when I return? So I watched carefully where my truck tires and 5er tires tracked as I pulled out one day and when I came home, I made small steering inputs to try and replicate the same track. Worked like a charm and still does.

Sometimes I have to do a bit of pull forward and correct and if a campground road is much narrower than mine it adds a new dynamic, but the same basic principle applies. Of course I include a lot of other good tips stated here - look at the spot first, use a spotter that I must be able to see at all times, etc.

[richfaa]

We really do not like to do the Jackknife thing. Note the stress on the suspension when you do that. The wheels are askew. That can't be good. We try to keep the truck and camper as stright as possible even tho it means doing that back and forth thing. This is one reason we prefer pull throughs. We try to avoid stress on the camper in any way as we put enough stress on it just driving down the road. The RV driver should be aware that they can do it if necessary but avoid it when ever possible.

[simonsrf]

quote:Originally posted by Bob Pasternak

I just point the trailer where I want it, then follow it.

Bob, I remember last year at Siskiyou when you backed into an obtuse angle site on the first try.....pretty tough on my ego. Just last week, in the very same spot at Siskiyou, I told the (your) story, again....you my friend, are a legend!

[KathyandDave]

akf15e said: "I visualize how the vehicles would come out of the spot and just reverse the process."
I've been trying to apply the same logic with spotty success, although it makes complete sense. More practice required, I guess. My best success was backing uphill into a jack-knife (perpendicular) slot with trees on both sides. Four-wheel drive was very helpful. My worst was backing into the in-laws' driveway where Kathy's dad has a pad beside the house from his days pulling a fiver. Talk about a tough crowd!