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Old 04-23-2020, 05:00 AM   #21
Eagleback
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Originally Posted by Montana Man View Post
Your insurance will cover your negligence such as overloading. They may not renew, or upcharge you like a dui. You could be shopping for new insurance and you won't save $500 in 15 minutes going to Geico.

The question to ask your agent is, I purposely overloaded my truck prior to that wreck and intend to continue to do it, do you mind?

Agree, There is always that one who has the 3/4 ton or smaller and they know they are over weight. Ether in payload which is most of the time or tow capacity and some how has to try to justify that position as if its ok. I saw a tacoma pulling a 5ver down I75 and could not get that rig over 60mph and swaying all over the road. If its too heavy you need a bigger truck or smaller unit. Be safe everyone.
 
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Old 04-23-2020, 06:18 AM   #22
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If they are hot shotting as a commercial business they fall under DOT rules and are required to have a commercial driver's license per below. Get the connection?... Commercial business, commercial license? Private licenses(non commercial) fall under state law.

...
You are not required to have a CDL to HotShot. See this link:

https://www.truckingtruth.com/wiki/t...-shot-trucking

I don't care about hotshotting. I was just using them as an example of someone who stays under 26K, regardless of what the truck/trailer GVWR's are. The thing that I'm trying to get my head wrapped around is whether or not it's how much you weigh, or how much you COULD weigh, and how that applies to RV's.

According to this site:

http://changingears.com/rv-sec-state-rv-license.shtml

Kansas requires a Class A or B non-commercial if you're over 26K GVWR or GCWR. And, that's been in place since at least Feb 2014. I have never heard of this law, and I looked on their website for quite a while last, and I couldn't find anything to support this. I also couldn't find anything on how to get a Class A/B, or what they even are. That's another matter.

If all of this is the law, and GCWR is the number your license needs to be good for, if you own a dually that has a 14K GVWR, you are limited to a 12K GVWR 5er, and that ain't very big...
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Old 04-23-2020, 09:46 AM   #23
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If all of this is the law, and GCWR is the number your license needs to be good for, if you own a dually that has a 14K GVWR, you are limited to a 12K GVWR 5er, and that ain't very big...
The Dually does not weight that much under normal 5er towing you are assuming GCWR is maxed out, most dually will not be loaded to 14K , then some of the trailer weight is on the pin that you were not considering. So a say a pin weight of 3500 and a balance of the 5er at 12K is nearly a 16K 5er and then the likleyhood of your Dually GVWR being maxed in very remote for 99% of folks which allows you to tow even more. A F350 dually dry is about 7500lbs-8000lbs so it is a long way to 14K. You are really only limited to the combined Actual weight not potential weight.
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Old 04-23-2020, 11:02 AM   #24
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The Dually does not weight that much under normal 5er towing you are assuming GCWR is maxed out, most dually will not be loaded to 14K , then some of the trailer weight is on the pin that you were not considering. So a say a pin weight of 3500 and a balance of the 5er at 12K is nearly a 16K 5er and then the likleyhood of your Dually GVWR being maxed in very remote for 99% of folks which allows you to tow even more. A F350 dually dry is about 7500lbs-8000lbs so it is a long way to 14K. You are really only limited to the combined Actual weight not potential weight.
So, you would say it's based on WHAT you weigh, NOT what you CAN weigh if maxed out. What you can weigh, in my understanding is GCWR, and according to website I sited above, if you're over 26K you need the ClassA/B license in KS. So, at that point, it doesn't matter what your actual vehicle weighs, it is what the TOTAL weight CAN be.

This seems to be a lot harder to understand than it should be, and some of that is because of the language used. Again, on the back of my license, it says "any single vehicle with a GVWR of less than 26,001 lbs". What is the definition of "single"???
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Old 04-23-2020, 02:17 PM   #25
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To the OP, I can't speak for sure and for certain about your original question. But, I can't imagine how registering a vehicle can change what the manufacturer recommends for a maximum payload. It doesn't sound reasonable for the manufacturer to be concerned about how a truck is registered, if at all. I can see registering a truck to lower than max load weights for various reasons.
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Old 04-23-2020, 03:23 PM   #26
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So, you would say it's based on WHAT you weigh, NOT what you CAN weigh if maxed out. What you can weigh, in my understanding is GCWR, and according to website I sited above, if you're over 26K you need the ClassA/B license in KS. So, at that point, it doesn't matter what your actual vehicle weighs, it is what the TOTAL weight CAN be.

This seems to be a lot harder to understand than it should be, and some of that is because of the language used. Again, on the back of my license, it says "any single vehicle with a GVWR of less than 26,001 lbs". What is the definition of "single"???
That would be your tow vehicle would be my guess.

Ram's chart on my truck shows 14,000 gvwr and a payload of 5,690 pounds. I have IL D license plate which is 14,000 pounds, I also had the same license on my Silverado 2500hd Duramax before I traded.

Chart says GCWR of 33,800.

Max trailer is 25,020.

So your site says
KS
N
Y > 26k lb
DL Web Site
Above 26,000 lb GVWR or GCWR requires non-commercial Class A or B
Feb 14

So according to that if your entire setup is over 26000 pounds you need a non commercial Class A or Class B.

http://www.kslegislature.org/li_2014...8_002_0034b_k/
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Old 04-23-2020, 05:14 PM   #27
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Thanks for sharing the link. I actually was able to finally find that this afternoon. That is the statute, but no where that I've found do they talk about these no commercial licenses or what it takes to get one...
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Old 04-23-2020, 05:20 PM   #28
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That would be your tow vehicle would be my guess.

...
According to the KS website, single any one vehicle, or anything hooked to that vehicle, so the TOTAL GCWR cannot be over 26K.

So anyone pulling a 5er in KS (licensed in KS) must have at least a non commercial A/B license, if their combined weight rating of their truck and trailer are over 26K. That is not a very big camper to get over that point, and anyone with a dually, is for sure over that weight, unless they have a 30' 5er...
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Old 04-23-2020, 10:03 PM   #29
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The Dually does not weight that much under normal 5er towing you are assuming GCWR is maxed out, most dually will not be loaded to 14K , then some of the trailer weight is on the pin that you were not considering. So a say a pin weight of 3500 and a balance of the 5er at 12K is nearly a 16K 5er and then the likleyhood of your Dually GVWR being maxed in very remote for 99% of folks which allows you to tow even more. A F350 dually dry is about 7500lbs-8000lbs so it is a long way to 14K. You are really only limited to the combined Actual weight not potential weight.
Cadman is right. They go off of what the max gvwr of the truck is and also the gvwr of the trailer.
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Old 04-26-2020, 01:37 PM   #30
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Legal towing weights. Interesting nd important never-ending discussion. I know this doesn't really add to the discussion. It is worthwhile to read the posts.

Sounds like most everyone with a 5th wheel needs to be driving a dually. A small 5th wheel has a hitch weight of approximately 1,700 lbs , add storage stuff and you're near 3,000. A large travel trailer can push hitch limits even if your truck has payload capacity.

Bigger truck is better. We have to suck it up and just pay the huge fees and deal with confusing regulations. I'm being facetious, but if I'm in an accident and it involves high speed, I'll run over and check trailer tire speed ratings, age of tires, and claim they exceeded vehicle tire capacity. Then, I'll verify if the rig driver has a CDL, etc., etc., and if not, has inadequate training. Maybe every state needs a 55 mph towing speed limit like California.

Recommending dually for everyone except travel trailers.
I'll be chastised for a bit of humor and reality.
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Old 04-26-2020, 02:31 PM   #31
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Check your state's Dept of Motor Vehicles

I was reading a similar thread a few months ago. I live in South Carolina, and one post referred to needing a special license for larger RV towing configurations in this state. I did some digging online and, sure enough, SC does require a non-commercial Class "F" license if the sum of the two vehicles' GVWR exceed 26,000 lbs. It doesn't matter if you don't fully load them, it's based on the stated GVWR of the pickup plus the GVWR of the trailer. I added mine together and they are at 27,625. I'm not sure if there is a written test, but they have you do a road test with your tow vehicle AND trailer. There is an agility test (driving thru cones) and what looks like a parallel parking test. The nearest DMV that administers this test is over an hour away. Hardly anyone I've talked to or asked knows about this requirement. Not sure if I'm going to consider upgrading my license, or down-size my trailer. I imagine if something goes wrong and law enforcement gets involved, I could be in some trouble.....
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Old 04-26-2020, 03:03 PM   #32
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If you're legal in your state, you're legal in all 50.
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Old 04-26-2020, 03:24 PM   #33
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I would like you all to look at your license. My Georgia and also my current Nevada license said I can tow a trailer <10,000 lbs. In Nevada I had to test and road test to get a class "J" endorsement. I think you're more likely to get a ticket for improper license that improper weight. Your state may be different.
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Old 04-26-2020, 03:27 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by CADman_KS View Post
You are not required to have a CDL to HotShot. See this link:

https://www.truckingtruth.com/wiki/t...-shot-trucking
.
Yeah, if your under 10k. It's required for over that. Thats what para 1 says in my original and your link.

Under that is probably like being any other courier service.
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Old 04-26-2020, 04:26 PM   #35
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ok lets not get into "I tow with this no problem"
I know laws are different from state to state.
are there any laws on the books that make it illegal to tow exceeding gvw?
example Code? currently in a P*ssing contest and would like to know it is illegal per state code...…
Or am I misinformed. we all know this is hardly ever enforced but legal is legal. or if I'm in an accident being over weight your cited for reckless driving or something.

thank you
Where I live in Canada my truck must be registered for the GCVWR which means the total of truck, trailer and everything in both of them. My setup weighs in at 25,000lbs so I am registered for a total weight of 26,000lbs to be legal.
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Old 04-26-2020, 04:33 PM   #36
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People make this WAY harder than it has to be.


My truck (F450) has the following max weight ratings



Front axle 6000 lbs

Rear axle 9,000 lbs
Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR): 14,000 lbs.
Gross Combined Weight Rating (GCWR): 42,000 lbs.


One of my trailers (not an RV, but easy numbers) has the following ratings:


Each axle 10,000lbs
GVWR 25,900


So, I can't exceed ANY single number. Just that simple.



Because I've weighed my truck, I know that just the truck weighs 9500 lbs, with 5300 on the front axle and 4200 on the rear. I can't plop 4800 lbs into the bed, because that will take me over the 14,000 GVWR, even though the rear axle could handle that. So the max weight I can add to my truck is 4500 lbs.



Even though the GCWR indicates I could haul a trailer that weighed 32,500, I cannot. The reason is, even if I had a trailer that could handle that weight, I cannot put enough pin weight (minimum 15% = 4875) on the truck.


So, again, I know I put out a lot of numbers, but again, just don't exceed any single number. BTW, all that math that kids said they'd never use when they were in school, we're using it.
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Old 04-26-2020, 05:23 PM   #37
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I would like you all to look at your license. My Georgia and also my current Nevada license said I can tow a trailer <10,000 lbs. In Nevada I had to test and road test to get a class "J" endorsement. I think you're more likely to get a ticket for improper license that improper weight. Your state may be different.

You should have just done the non-commercial Class A. It's the same pre-trip and skills test. The written is only slightly different. I had the "J" endorsement for years. After purchasing the Montana, I went to the Carson City DMV and they asked why I wanted the Class A NCDL since I had the "J" already. Apparently they didn't understand the combination of vehicles GVWR weight math...
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Old 04-26-2020, 05:32 PM   #38
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Remember, a CDL is “commercial driver’s license” if you are driving a vehicle that is a combination 26,001 you must have a CDL. With that said, must states do not enforce the CDL license for RV’s, but they could. Some states do require a CDL. I’m a PA CDL examiner and we have a lot of “Hot Shot” driver’s getting cdl’s.
Only my opinion but I think anyone pulling over 26000 pounds down the road should have a license to do it. That’s my 2 cents for what it’s worth.
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Old 04-26-2020, 05:39 PM   #39
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Agree with your 2 cents. I'd reduce weight to 15,000 considering what I've seen.
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Old 04-26-2020, 06:07 PM   #40
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Weighed my truck before we hooked up to come to Ca..

Steer 5400
Drivers 4500
Truck 9900

I took 250lbs out of the bed and reduced
Drivers to 4250
Truck to 9650

Hooked up the 3160RL

Steer 5560
Drivers 8120
Trailer Axles 11700
Gross weight 25380

This puts me with in approximately 500lbs of my gross carry capacity on my 18 Ram Dually and approximately 500lbs on the gross carry capacity on my 3160RL.

I had plenty of rear axle and front axle capacity being it’s 6000 and 9750 but as you see there no way I could have added more the approximately 500lbs of pin weight, well maybe a little more if it’s disturbing enough to the front.
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