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Old 08-11-2020, 10:32 AM   #21
CADman_KS
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Originally Posted by Slow Hand View Post
I must have one of those perfect trucks.
Ford does do a better job of breaking out the numbers for all the different options than Chevy and Ram do.

However, they still list the "base" model in their configs. So, if you have an King Ranch, or a Platinum, the truck is going to have less capacity than what the literature says.

The best numbers are typically long box, 2WD, regular cab across all makes. There aren't many of those in the wild in any brand...
 
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Old 08-11-2020, 11:08 AM   #22
432bartman
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I wonder what would happen if you went a few pounds over? Nothing
Lynwood

Exactly. His truck is fine as long as he doesn't load a Rhino onto the back. A couple hundred pounds is not going to matter one bit. I'd say go get that trailer and enjoy it.
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Old 08-12-2020, 01:31 PM   #23
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I tow a 2019 Montana 3121RL with a 2020 GMC 2500 Duramax 4x4 short bed and it does great. Yes you are close to the max weight but the truck really handles it well. No white knuckles for me.
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Old 08-12-2020, 01:51 PM   #24
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If your fresh water tank is behind the trailer axles, you can remove weight from the pin by filling the tank. Likewise, you can remove weight by reducing what's in holding tanks in front of the axles. Hope this helps someone.
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Old 08-12-2020, 02:19 PM   #25
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I would check out the Montana High Country 330 or 331 RL’s. They’re a bit lighter and made for 2500’s. We also have a duramax 6.6 2500 , ours is a 2017. We love our new 330RL.
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Old 08-12-2020, 02:27 PM   #26
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The Answer

This is a constant topic here - how much trailer can I tow. You see the usual answers, from marginally accurate, to wholly misleading based on experience. There is an answer to the question though, and there is a reason why its important.

First, you need to put everything in your truck (fuel, people, stuff, etc.) that you intend to camp with, and weigh it at a CAT Scale. Make note of that weight.

Second, subtract that number from your GVWR. That's your actual remaining payload. The yellow sticker is ratings related to tires, etc. The absolute objective remaining available payload of your vehicle for our purposes here, is the weight of it fully loaded subtracted from your GVWR. Simple as that.

Third, does your hitch weight of your trailer exceed that payload number or not. its probably close, but you're probably over but i don't know...you have to weigh your truck with everything in it and see. Then you'll know the answer to what your remaining available payload is. The only imprecise thing in this discussion is the pinweight...no one knows or will actually ever know to the pound, what that is exactly. You can kind of figure it out in theory if you weigh your whole rig, but even then it won't be precise to the pound. So that's the only reason you can't get but so excited over a few pounds here or there.

But...there is a reason to be concerned if a few pounds turns into a few hundred pounds or a 1000 pounds, as is often the case with a 3/4 ton truck towing a large fifth wheel. Those reasons are:

First, some states will actually weight you and you could just flat out get a ticket for having overloaded your truck's GVWR. Period. Rare, but more and more states are doing that by running you through scales set up for truckers. So be aware. it might matter.

Second, if you're involved in an accident and you're overloaded, several things could happen, and unfortunately all at once: 1. You may be presumed to be at fault because you exceeded the capacity of your vehicle; 2. Because of #1, an injured party's attorney will use that fact against you to show fault...even if its not actually your fault; and because of that...3. your insurance may not defend you in the lawsuit, and it also may not pay out your own claim for your own trailer because you have intentionally overloaded your vehicle. You will hear people scream and cry that is not so, but I promise you...it is so...at least potentially so.

So that is the answer to "the question" about how much can you tow with your truck. Nothing else is correct. Its not complicated, and its just math and it has nothing to do with what your truck will pull, or what others have gotten away with for years, etc. Its just numbers, and the way the law and insurance polices work. Sorry.
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Old 08-12-2020, 02:42 PM   #27
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I know everyone really worries about pin weight. The trucks will handle more than what the stickers say. The manufacturer probably leave at least a 20% margin to cover them in a law suit if someone was right at sticker weight and something happened.
I’ve had two f250 fords they both pulled a 14400 40 ft (Dry weight and full timed in it ) trailer with no problem on my springs. I do run air boots to help with bouncing roads of today. I have a 2018 3121 legacy and pulled it from Utah to Maine and hadn’t had any problems. And the roads nowadays really test your springs on both your trailer and pickup.
Seems like everyone likes the big 3500 DW that you have to have a football field to park when going sightseeing or shopping. My F 250 short bed 4x4 works great.

So if you are comfortable pulling it with your truck do it , if not get you one you are comfortable with to pull it. As you see everyone that has a big truck has a different train of thought that those with 2500 series.

You will really like your new 3120 trailer
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Old 08-12-2020, 03:55 PM   #28
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Has anyone noticed...the OP hasn’t been on the forum for SEVEN days. He’s probably already made his decision.
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Old 08-12-2020, 04:37 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Lcwl View Post
I know everyone really worries about pin weight. The trucks will handle more than what the stickers say. The manufacturer probably leave at least a 20% margin to cover them in a law suit if someone was right at sticker weight and something happened.
I’ve had two f250 fords they both pulled a 14400 40 ft (Dry weight and full timed in it ) trailer with no problem on my springs. I do run air boots to help with bouncing roads of today. I have a 2018 3121 legacy and pulled it from Utah to Maine and hadn’t had any problems. And the roads nowadays really test your springs on both your trailer and pickup.
Seems like everyone likes the big 3500 DW that you have to have a football field to park when going sightseeing or shopping. My F 250 short bed 4x4 works great.

So if you are comfortable pulling it with your truck do it , if not get you one you are comfortable with to pull it. As you see everyone that has a big truck has a different train of thought that those with 2500 series.

You will really like your new 3120 trailer

I have a 3500 and not a 2500 (which I loved) because a 2500 has a finite limit to what it can carry, just like a 3500. You can pull it all day long but that isn't the same as carrying it. So, I have no different train of thought than those with a 2500 except thinking because it IS a 2500 it's big enough for anything...they're not.

RPM3402 made some good points but disregarding the payload isn't wise. As mentioned the "payload" gives you a little cushion before you hit gawr. GAWR should be the drop dead, stop here number....no fudging. Since folks won't abide by that we have a payload number.

As far as states weighing you I've personally watched a NM trooper with a large 5th wheel and truck stopped carrying a portable scale around. I went back by later and the trailer was there, driver, truck and trooper gone. So it does happen will happen more frequently going forward the more folks push weight boundaries.
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Old 08-12-2020, 05:01 PM   #30
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Lots of discussions about pin weight and axle GAWR ratings but not 100% of that pin weight goes on the rear axles unless your hitch is directly over , or behind, your rear axle. Some portion goes to the front axles. Anyone know how much? I bet this opens a can of worms. Lol.
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Old 08-12-2020, 05:12 PM   #31
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If only we were required to go over the scales these threads would disappear. My last Montana was 1700# over published pw when loaded and hit the scales.
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Old 08-12-2020, 05:25 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by sourdough View Post
I have a 3500 and not a 2500 (which I loved) because a 2500 has a finite limit to what it can carry, just like a 3500. You can pull it all day long but that isn't the same as carrying it. So, I have no different train of thought than those with a 2500 except thinking because it IS a 2500 it's big enough for anything...they're not.

RPM3402 made some good points but disregarding the payload isn't wise. As mentioned the "payload" gives you a little cushion before you hit gawr. GAWR should be the drop dead, stop here number....no fudging. Since folks won't abide by that we have a payload number.

As far as states weighing you I've personally watched a NM trooper with a large 5th wheel and truck stopped carrying a portable scale around. I went back by later and the trailer was there, driver, truck and trooper gone. So it does happen will happen more frequently going forward the more folks push weight boundaries.
You are 100% correct. You don't mess with your rear axle GAWR. Best to know what your real rear axle weighs, by going to the scales and get a real weight, first without the rig but a full tank of fuel, , then throw your fully loaded, fill up that fresh water tank, 5er on there and weigh the rear axle again. Easy math, subtract the weights and you will know what your real wiggle room is. As some know, I modified my 2500 diesel with springs and upgraded tires( tire ratings exceed GAWR rating) but exceeding rear GAWR is asking for disaster. Yes, there is some fudge in the ratings I’m sure, but that is just too big a risk, not worth pushing that envelop. Go from there.
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Old 08-12-2020, 05:49 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by RPM3402 View Post
This is a constant topic here - how much trailer can I tow. You see the usual answers, from marginally accurate, to wholly misleading based on experience. There is an answer to the question though, and there is a reason why its important.

First, you need to put everything in your truck (fuel, people, stuff, etc.) that you intend to camp with, and weigh it at a CAT Scale. Make note of that weight.

Second, subtract that number from your GVWR. That's your actual remaining payload. The yellow sticker is ratings related to tires, etc. The absolute objective remaining available payload of your vehicle for our purposes here, is the weight of it fully loaded subtracted from your GVWR. Simple as that.

Third, does your hitch weight of your trailer exceed that payload number or not. its probably close, but you're probably over but i don't know...you have to weigh your truck with everything in it and see. Then you'll know the answer to what your remaining available payload is. The only imprecise thing in this discussion is the pinweight...no one knows or will actually ever know to the pound, what that is exactly. You can kind of figure it out in theory if you weigh your whole rig, but even then it won't be precise to the pound. So that's the only reason you can't get but so excited over a few pounds here or there.

But...there is a reason to be concerned if a few pounds turns into a few hundred pounds or a 1000 pounds, as is often the case with a 3/4 ton truck towing a large fifth wheel. Those reasons are:

First, some states will actually weight you and you could just flat out get a ticket for having overloaded your truck's GVWR. Period. Rare, but more and more states are doing that by running you through scales set up for truckers. So be aware. it might matter.

Second, if you're involved in an accident and you're overloaded, several things could happen, and unfortunately all at once: 1. You may be presumed to be at fault because you exceeded the capacity of your vehicle; 2. Because of #1, an injured party's attorney will use that fact against you to show fault...even if its not actually your fault; and because of that...3. your insurance may not defend you in the lawsuit, and it also may not pay out your own claim for your own trailer because you have intentionally overloaded your vehicle. You will hear people scream and cry that is not so, but I promise you...it is so...at least potentially so.

So that is the answer to "the question" about how much can you tow with your truck. Nothing else is correct. Its not complicated, and its just math and it has nothing to do with what your truck will pull, or what others have gotten away with for years, etc. Its just numbers, and the way the law and insurance polices work. Sorry.
Are you an attorney? Are you an insurance agent or claims agent that specializes in RV
Insurance?
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Old 08-12-2020, 07:40 PM   #34
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They all weigh a lot more

I have a 2015 3100 RL. My brochure pin weight is 2405#. My actual, based on a CAT scale is 3100#. That is with the trailer fully loaded. Check the cargo weight of your pick up in addition to your GCWR. I am using a 2015 Ram 2500 Mega Cab 4wd SRW with air suspension and my cargo capacity is 1950#. I have had to put Sumusprings on my rear end to keep the air suspension from indicating an overload. I'm looking for a 1 ton. A 1 ton can handle ~4000#'s of cargo.
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Old 08-12-2020, 09:06 PM   #35
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I am so glad this came up...
I actually weighed my rig today.
F350, crew cab dually. 3130re.
Results in pictures below.
Based on this my pin weight is 3100.
According to the 2019 brochure the pin weight is 2380.
My question is, is 2380 the max weight you can load the RV pin?
OR is 2380 the pin weight of the RV empty?
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Old 08-12-2020, 09:12 PM   #36
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2380 is the weight of the pin as the unit comes off the line empty. Once the deal let adds the batteries and you add clothes and a can of soda that number is gone. The pass through stuff and even water in any tank makes you realize how fictitious it is. For that reason payload becomes the number to watch. Don’t forget your rear gate as well.
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Old 08-13-2020, 07:18 AM   #37
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Proper Weighing Procedure

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daryles View Post
I am so glad this came up...
I actually weighed my rig today.
F350, crew cab dually. 3130re.
Results in pictures below.
Based on this my pin weight is 3100.
According to the 2019 brochure the pin weight is 2380.
My question is, is 2380 the max weight you can load the RV pin?
OR is 2380 the pin weight of the RV empty?
Thank you for posting this. I have never weighed my 5er but now I'm really interested. Do you just pull onto the scales at a Flying J or do you disconnect and weigh the truck first and then reconnect and weigh both? I don't want to look like an idiot when I go do this so any advice is appreciated.
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Old 08-13-2020, 07:42 AM   #38
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You can do either: Weigh the Truck and Trailer, pull off and park the Trailer and go back and weigh the Truck, or Truck first then both.
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Old 08-13-2020, 08:47 AM   #39
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Many like to quote the brochures that list the pin weights. That is a very low number, as noted by many posters, for the manufacturer to make you think you can use a smaller (read cheaper) truck to tow your RV. The best way to make a semi educated guess it to use 20% of the RV's GVWR.
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Old 08-13-2020, 09:28 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by allenclme View Post
Thank you for posting this. I have never weighed my 5er but now I'm really interested. Do you just pull onto the scales at a Flying J or do you disconnect and weigh the truck first and then reconnect and weigh both? I don't want to look like an idiot when I go do this so any advice is appreciated.

Download the CAT, "Weigh my truck" app from Google play store.
Open the app and setup an account including how you are going to pay ($12 initial weigh + $2 re-weigh).
Follow the instructions on the app. Its really easy, walks you right through the steps.
Here's a good video

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