Does Keystone care about safety and quality?

[Mark N.]

If you recall, I found a 120V short under my bed, the direct result of sloppy, careless work by somebody in the factory. I documented it well with photos and a video. (http://www.montanaowners.com/forums/...ad.php?t=65547)
I called Keystone and at first they acted like they cared. I got someone's direct email, and she told me to contact her with any updates. They even called me to check and make sure I had an appt. with my dealer.
Well, I emailed her the updates including the video. I took the trailer into the shop on the 19th.
I've checked with the dealership twice now, and so far, Keystone hasn't bothered to call the dealership, or email them or anything.
It's been in the shop for like 8 days now, with a serious, safety related fire risk, and nothing from Keystone whatsoever. Nothing back to me, nothing to the dealership.
It is not a stretch at all to imagine that my trailer defect is not a one-shot fluke. Whoever did this to mine undoubtedly did it to others on the assembly line. I would think in the interest of safety they would be all over this.
I have filed a case previously with the National Highway Transportation Administration.
This wasn't a case of bad fitting parts, loose or missing screws, misaligned hinges or something else being simply sloppy.
It was a 120V electrical short, right under a bed because of improperly aligned electrical connectors, that were totally hidden from view and inaccessible without disassembly of trailer components. Scary in my book, but not to Keystone evidently...

[Phil P]

Hi

If Keystone cared at all about the end user the dealer I purchased from would not be selling Keystone products any longer.

Phil P

[dieselguy]

Like any other scenerio today ... if you're say one of two people that actually raised a concern about the same issue it will be considered extremely minimal to a manufacturer that shoves thousands of units out the shipping yard. I understand your personal concerns, but unless several units are involved in reporting this issue, Keystone's stance will more than likely be a disappointment to you. Look at our Marabomb saga ... despite several forums with pages of complaints, I still see new units with them mounted proudly on the wheels.

[JandC]

Here is my take on that Mark N.

Keystone, especially the Montana model has enjoyed a pretty good reputation over the years. Many brand/model loyal buyers were convinced for years that they were "special" in the eyes of Keystone because of a little attention they may have received at the fall rally.

But when it comes right down to it, Keystone isn't selling these units to us (general public), they are selling them to their dealers. If the dealers don't keep buying them from Keystone then Keystone goes out of business. Keystone knows the quality of product they are putting out there and that is why they only have a one year warranty that doesn't cover everything. They are in business to make money, which apparently is working for them.

My suggestion for any owner of a Montana that has a repair issue, for which Keystone either drags their feet fixing, or refuses to fix, and that issue is safety related, then the best bet is to contract the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration. It is very fast and simple to fill out a complaint online. During the last year the investigators from the NHTSA have been involved in cases with Keystone. The defective arms for the fire escape windows, that were not available for a year, were suddenly available once these investigators became involved. They were also recently involved in the issue of Keystone installing the rear ladders over the fire escape windows.

I would surely consider your issue a MAJOR safety concern. The same $8.00 an hour untrained worker may have wired dozens of models like that and it is just a tragedy waiting to happen.

[WaltBennett]

JandC is right. Although there are some, I've found very, very few manufacturers of anything in this country that will do any better unless there's some sort of outside pressure. Service companies are the same - but the BBB works for them. All you've got to do is spend some time working for a big box company of any nature to get an understanding of how poor our pathetic our corporate ethos and management capabilities have become. Lots of verbiage about how all of them want satisfied and happy customers, but that's all it is, just words. Have you noticed how every one of them is more focused on us having a great 'experience', rather than product quality or satisfaction?

[CORattler]

Yup. Poor QC and quality workmanship is not a primary concern for many manufacturers of RVs. Doesn't make it right, it just is. I will not participate in making excuses for these yahoos.
Caveat emptor!

[richfaa]

Keystone and the other manufacturers meet every safety spec it would be a huge legal issue if they did not. Poor workmanship is and has been a problem in the RV industry for a very long time .There are no excuses and the manufacturers bottom line has not suffered.
It is just not cost effective to build a better unit.

I my case I purchase a good extended service plan and repair as these things fall apart.

[1retired06]

When they installed the refrigerator in our 2015, with all the packing material still attached to the cooling unit, which caused it to run hot and quickly fail, I considered that a serious safety issue from a potential fire perspective as did my dealer. Dealer sent pictures to Keystone, never heard a single word back.

[jcurtis934]

If you want to feel good, think of it this way...you are buying the ability to enjoy some time outside of a house and can move when you wish. The montana is just to keep you off the street and provide you the opportunity to learn about rv diagnosis and repair. John

[Phil P]

Diselguy

I personally provided 5 VIN numbers and the problems caused by the selling dealer that sold ours not using trained technicians to Keystone their response was “we don’t track those things”. I have since heard the same horror stories from other owners that were without their trailers for extended periods of time because of the disorganized and incompetent service personnel at this dealer.

Keystone doesn’t care about the end user or they would do something about this dealer but they don’t because they are a high volume dealer.

This is the reason I will never purchase another Thor product.

Phil P

[bigskyjimmy]

So you are thinking all the other Companies don't have the same issues as Thor???? LOL ,I have met so many other people with SOB's with the same complaints....Good luck if you buy a Forest River,Evergreen,ETC..ETC... SAME STORIES, different Companies and Dealers quote]Originally posted by Phil P

Diselguy

I personally provided 5 VIN numbers and the problems caused by the selling dealer that sold ours not using trained technicians to Keystone their response was “we don’t track those things”. I have since heard the same horror stories from other owners that were without their trailers for extended periods of time because of the disorganized and incompetent service personnel at this dealer.

Keystone doesn’t care about the end user or they would do something about this dealer but they don’t because they are a high volume dealer.

This is the reason I will never purchase another Thor product.

Phil P

[/quote]

[richfaa]

As I have said many times .We have been Rv'ing for @ 25 years this 13 3402 is our 2nd Montana and 6th Rv. Both wife and I worked the big RV shows here in our area for years and we sold many brands. We have toured many of the different factories. If we thought there was a better brand in the price range we would have it.

[mlh]

I agree with Rich. I had a friend who owned a small Camper dealership. He always said after you get the skin off of campers there isn't much difference in them.
Lynwood

[Phil P]

I have watched the forums for other companies as well.

I find three companies that don’t have these problems.

One was recently put out of business because of several natural disasters in a row. One was recently purchased by Thro so their quality will decline in favor of more profits and the third is the one I have an order with and will start building upon receiving our deposit.

You can tell the difference by the warranty offered. All of these three offered a 2 year cap to cap and 5 years on structure.

You see I have paid as much for this bottom of the line trailer as I would have for a top of the line trailer because Keystone didn’t stand behind their warranty and the dealer damaged the trailer by having their farm tractor mechanics work on it.

When you go into a large dealer with 12 acres of facility and you find ¾ of their maintenance shops are doing pre delivery repairs and the other ¼ is doing repairs for end users it is a real eye opener about quality. One of the technicians called the largest part of the shops a “Completions Center”.

Phil P

PS:

I have toured the facilities of most of the builders. The three companies that I refer to have a very good production line inspection system in place the rest didn’t have any production line inspection system and relied on inspection of the completed unit.