Frame Flex or Adjustment? - Montana Owners Club

lightningjack11 · 09-18-2006, 04:14 AM

Ok I guess the bug has bitten me. After my last trip I started cleanup and noticed my bedroom slide was slightly skewed. Looking at the slide while it is in the slide appears slanted to the left very slightly. At the top right it is about 1/2 inch off normal.

I can find no other evidence of frame flex such as molding changing positions etc.

I started to call Dale and by mistake got the Cougar division of Keystone. The party said that the bedroom slide is fully adjustable but if I contacted Dale he could walk me through it. There are 4 bolts for the adjustment.

Finally dialed the right number and got Dale's phone and left a message.

I will post pictures and provide more info as I get it.

My Monty still appears completely servicable.

I think I will drop the cover and take a look see underneath.

DHenry · 09-18-2006, 05:03 AM

Is it askew while hooked up or unhooked? Mine was both before the repair but after the repair I am straight when unhooked, but still askew while hooked. That makes sense to me because while hooked up we are no where near level. Please let us know what Dale has to say.

lightningjack11 · 09-18-2006, 05:45 AM

Doug,

Will let everyone know. Right know I am unhooked. I had some hauling to do so I removed my hitch so I have to install it and try it hooked up.

I think it is the same. If it is it is probably adjustment. If it changes then it is probably frame flex.

Hope to do this before Dale calls back.

bsmeaton · 09-18-2006, 08:43 AM

Tom!
Don't even hestitate to pull down the front belly. It's a critical inspection. All of the forward walls are attached to the side of the frame, not on top of it. They use a tack welded flat steel plate that extends out beyond the frame, and the aluminum structure is screwed to that from the bottom. IF THOSE WELDS ARE BROKEN - ground your unit. If you attempt to tow it the "pitch" forward on your RV will push the floor up and the side walls down causing damage similar to what Doug had (see his picks on the broken welds). Because the slide rests on the frame, the walls will stress downward and forward around the slide structure and crack. Also check your frame welds fore and aft in the LP and generator compartments for cracks.

While you have the front cover off - check for movement in the frame at the sides when supported by the pin and then by the landing gear. If the frame/aluminum structure slides down and the siding stays when supported on the landing gear, you've got something broken in the aluminum structure forward of the slide (weak point). (see my pics at http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/...51&uid=6528899). Check both sides.

It may very well be a slide adjustment, but I would inspect it anyway regardless. The front nose belly piece comes down pretty easy (you'll need to reseal the trim). It will help you sleep better at night.

Keep us posted!

lightningjack11 · 09-18-2006, 02:21 PM

Thanks a bunch Brad.

After talking to Dale this afternoon he suggested dropping the cover and checking the welds. So I did. I connected and disconnected about three times and could not find any broken welds. However on the Bedroom slide side the framing has a large amount of rust so I will clean it up and paint it. I am taking pix of everything I do.

Dale was unable to tell be how to adjust the slide because mine is not a Lippert system. I was unsuccessfull today but I have some new tricks to try tomorrow.

At least no welding is necessary.

Will post more as it happens.

Oh, my skew seems to be about 1/2 inch or a little more off at the top of the slide. When I connect it moves about 1/4 inch in the right direction. I don't consider that a lot flex and it were adjusted properly I am sure I would never see that movement.

Anyway my prime concern right now is to get it adjusted so the seals fit properly before El Nino gets here.

OH, THANKS FOR TALKING TO ME DALE BRUBAKER.

bsmeaton · 09-18-2006, 02:58 PM

Tom,

I'm happy to hear your welds are good! I think I'll make that a routine inspection for the fall from now on based on my model year.

I've never messed with my slides - so can't help much. I have my HydraGear manual - but I think thats a Lippert product. If you think you could use it I can try to copy it and email.

Brad

lightningjack11 · 09-18-2006, 03:48 PM

I have the Dewald books but they don't help much for the bedroom. There are 4 bolts. The hydraulic side has 4 horizontal elongated holes on the alignment plate. The Slide plate has 4 four vertical elongated holes. So you Have lots of room for adjustment. Still experimenting with it. The trick is adjusting the slide level then tighting up the four bolt. Easier said than done.

The way it looks like it wants to work to suspend the slide just slightly so the frame does not take the direct weight. Right now my slide puts all the weight on the frame. I want to adjust so the majority of the weight is on the 2 steel rails. We will see tomorrow.

bsmeaton · 09-18-2006, 04:11 PM

That sounds quite a bit different than the HydraGear. Keep us posted, I'm getting an education.

Brad

CRUZIN 2 · 09-19-2006, 09:26 AM

Brad

Great pictures, it looks like the pictures were taken of our rig, no broken welds or cracks. We took it to Goshen and they worked on it putting more screws from the side and up from the bottom. We are still getting some movement, just have to wait and see.

bsmeaton · 09-19-2006, 12:13 PM

Hey thanks Larry and LaVonne,

I hope you've got it fixed. I'm waiting to hear back from Keystone on the photos I sent. I really hope I can get it fixed locally rather than a trip to the factory.

Brad

lightningjack11 · 09-19-2006, 04:35 PM

Brad and Larry,

Found out today why I was having so much problem adjusting my slide.

The steel adjustment plate on the slide was hanging in there by a thread. So I took it out and there was moisture damage right where it was bolted down. The floor is just 3/4 inch ply and it looks like it was put there without and watersealant on the board. Dont know where the water got in. Never reached the carpet. Completely hidden. What a bummer. Monty is now down for the first time since I bought it. It will take some time and thought to make the repair. But I will make it better than it was before. At least it explains why I could not adjust it.

bsmeaton · 09-19-2006, 05:39 PM

Tom,
Bad news but actually kind of good news! At least it's not structural frame or the slide components. It's probably a better place to work on the flooring, as you've got direct access from underneath. It could be a lot worse if it was the lower floor above the tanks and all of the insulated enclosure.

I know you'll probably want to replace the rotted floor section, but you could probably rig a substantial steel support from from underneath spanning the frame.

It would be great if you could photo your progress and final fix for a posting, as it would be a great reference for others.

Good luck - and sorry your grounded.
Brad

lightningjack11 · 09-19-2006, 07:01 PM

ok Guys I have some pix so see if get this right.

The first one is what started it all on the bedroom slide.

The next pix is with the bedding all out of the way and shows the Hyd assemble. The hyd side attaches to the slide adjustment plate by four bolts. You can also see the rails that is supposed to absorb some of the weight of the slide especially when the slide is in.

The next pix shows that I removed the four bolts and retracted the actuator so the Slide Adjustment Plate is showing.

The next pix shows the Slide Adjustment Plate out and the damage to the plywood.

I plan on using a 3/4 oak ply and bolt it to existing ply. I will mount the slide adjustment plate 2 inches closer in so that I can inspect future damage if it occurs.

More pixs in a few days.

bsmeaton · 09-19-2006, 09:05 PM

Tom,
Do you think the water came in through the roof seal at the outer edge? Looks like you've got the right fix.

Brad

Wrenchtraveller · 09-20-2006, 02:54 AM

Good find Tom, and it looks like you have the problem solved. Let us know how the fix goes.

lightningjack11 · 09-20-2006, 04:03 AM

Brad,

I never knew that it was leaking. I see nothing wrong with the slide leak wise. First it is obvious the bottom cover draws some moisture. It could have been condensation. Remember I live in high humidity and this has been going on since 11/99. The damage appears around where the bolts were holding the slide plate so my theory is that the condensation over the years gathered underneath at the bolts.

Last night was more rain than we had in year and no leaks so I am leaning to the condensation theory.

It is unfortunate that they don't use waterproofed boards for the slideouts.

The area is damp but not soaked so I will remove the damage and dry out the board for several days or more. Then I will fill the void with silicon seal and finally a water seal coat. I will put about 10 coats of water seal on the new oak board. I wish I could remove the slide.

CRUZIN 2 · 09-20-2006, 07:44 AM

Tom

Great pictures, but bad news, when we were a Goshen In. they did some work in this area on the seals. We didn't know that there was a problem, but Keystone did lots of extra things.

Keep the pix coming, your doing a great job, I wish I could get my pix on, when I try it takes the screen up.

mfoss · 09-20-2006, 09:49 AM

I may be totally off base here. This spring we noticed a crack in the fiberglass that is on the passenger side, facing front, right where the camper begins to curve. This is right around the corner from the last amber reflector that is below the bedroom window. My first thought was that someone had purposely hit it with a fist or something but with all this flex talk I'm wondering...? Is the flex problem on the other side where the slide goes out? This camper has only been used 3 or 4 times and has only been 90 miles from home. It's a 2005 3400RL. Technically challenged, Marilyn

lightningjack11 · 09-20-2006, 12:46 PM

Hi Marylyn,

Cracks occur for a variety of reasons. For me I had no cracks until my bedroom slide assembly broke on my last trip causing some stress so now I have joined the crack club. Mine is up at the left corner of the slide out frame. Since you got a new rig I would take it to the dealer and they will probably fix it free.

I am presently working in the overhang area de rusting part of the frame so I will be posting here some pics and I can then explain what the front frame flex is about. So staye tuned to this thread.

A lot of trailers are getting these cracks not just Keystone and it started when the industry first went to filon and aluminum framing.

mfoss · 09-20-2006, 01:33 PM

Thanks, Tom. I will definitely stayed tuned.

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