tires & wheels

[kipandbob]

Hi, all,

I'm contemplating replacement wheels & tires for my truck when the time comes. I will be towing a 3455 HE in the near future. Per the Keystone brochure, the 3455 weighs in @ 12,270#. Does anyone out there know the approximate percentage of the total on the 5th wheel hitch?

I realize how much "stuff" is in the trailer, and how its distributed play a role; I'm just looking for a ballpark number.

Some wheels I looked at specify a maximum load of 3,200#. Seems to me that a pair of those wouldn't support the rear of the truck (2008 F-250) plus what sits on the hitch.

The truck currently has BF Goodrich LT265/70R17 tires. They look a little small for the truck. Which tires, wheels, brands, sizes have ya'll used on your trucks? Of those tried, which would you NOT use again?

Thanks in advance. You've been a great source on info in response to my previous questions.

Cheers,
-Bob

[Art-n-Marge]

Bob,

To answer your first question the percentage of hitch pin weight for a 5er is between 18-25%. Others will state 15-22% but I am finding with our Monty's it's the higher percentage. I will be shopping for new 18" wheels and tires. The BF Goodrich is okay, but the word is great for Michelins, then probably Bridgestones at the high end. Hopefully Lonnie or Glenn (the tire guys) will be by to mention other brands that work well.

The real test is the ACTUAL weight at the pin. I have been burned by the paper and label estimates and nothing beats the actual weight measurements. You also don't mention your pillar ratings (RAWR, FAWR and GVWR) for your model year F-250. Here's my story:

I have a 3500RL listed @ 12,040 and guess what? With all the storage compartments for heavier stuff at the front of the rig and everything else in the rig, I measured my rig at 13,000 lbs with 2700lbs (21%) at the pin. This is within the estimate of 18% to 25%. Check your TV's RAWR first (my 2006 Ford F-250 PSD was 6100lbs), then your GVWR (my 2006 PSD Ford was 10,000lbs). My problem was that the measured RAW and GVWR for my TV was over by about 400 lbs! I did have Firestone Air bags to remove the sag and keep the TV level and I have the same wheels and tires as you that supports 3200# or 6400 lbs max, but this does nothing to increase the weight capacity. I could still tow on the highway and up the hills, but I was not comfortable being overweight.

I ended up purchasing and installing an extra "overload" leaf spring and brackets from Ford, to turn my rear end into a comparable rear end of an F-350. In order to complete the upgrade to a RAWR of 7,000 lbs (like an F-350) and a GVWR of 11,200-11,500 lbs (like an F-350) I MUST upgrade to at least 18" wheels and tires that support 3,600 lbs each. I found these were the two differences between the weight ratings of an F-250 and an F350 - overload leaf spring, plus hardware and bigger wheels and tires with higher weight capacities. Then I can tow within specification.

In a nutshell, you can upgrade your wheels and tires to 18" or bigger to install tires with higher weight ratings but without at least upgrading your F-250 leaf springs you will still not be able to support anthing heavier without upgrading them, too.

I hope this makes sense. I recently spent many weeks on this research before pursuing this. A Montana is really too heavy for most 3/4 ton TVs. Check your 2008 F-250 ratings and maybe you do have a higher weight rating than my 2006. I do know that the 2008 leaf spring packs are very different than a 2006. Then check your pillar label against the actual weights to know if you are within the weight ratings.

Hang in there and I wish you luck.

[TLightning]

When "estimating" weights, you are normally better off using gross weight, because that's where we usually run these things. Like Art said, a good estimate for pin weight is around 20%.

As for the truck...get a 350/3500 series. Sure you can go to the trouble and expense of numerous upgrades, but you still have an over weight 3/4 ton truck.

[sreigle]

Bob, I won't debate numbers with anyone because that's not my purpose here. I just wanted to note that we had a 2005 F250 with those same tires you have. We towed this 3400RL and our 2003 3295RK before that with this truck. I replaced the OEM truck tires at 70,000 miles. The wear was even across the board and I never had a problem with the tires. By the way, our current Dodge 3500 came with and still has, at 48k miles, the same BFG tires as the Ford did.

We had our rig weighed at each wheel at the recent Fall Rally. Now I know we're over the rear tire ratings by 55 lbs on one side and 130 on the other. The tires look good and as noted above we never had any problems with the tires on the Ford. That doesn't mean I condone running over the tire ratings but it does note that we recently found out we're over those tire ratings. Our pinweight is 2900 and the trailer weight is 15,475. We run heavy!

"Conventional Wisdom" is that FW pinweight should be 20% of total trailer weight, give or take 5% (15 to 25 percent, in other words.) Ours is 18.7%.

I loved the way the BFG tires wore and replaced the OEM tires on the Ford with another set of the same tires. I was thrilled when this Dodge came with the same BFG tires, too.

[Red939]

I'm very hesitant to upgrade any vehicle used for such a heavy duty job as towing one of these monsters. An upgrade to one component might be fine, but, if you use it to it's maximum rating, could overload another component. I would recommend any upgrade be approved by the manufacturer, Ford in your case. That way you could be sure you have not inadvertently caused a problem as noted above, plus you could have your truck recertified to a new rating (F350) if it meets all the requirements.

[kipandbob]

Thanks to all who responded. I'm impressed by the depth & breadth of knowledge & experience out there in MOC land!

I test drove a new 350 King Ranch yesterday; the dealer had no used 350s. Wow, what a nice truck. But, it's quite pricey; they want $35K plus my 250 to get me payments of $735/mo. Too steep for me.

I asked "my" salesman to look for a used 350 dually. We'll see.

Thanks again,
-Bob

[Lawman]

I've been the 3/4 route, get that dually, you'll love it.

[Tom S.]

For what it's worth, I have a single rear wheel one ton and have been very happy with it. I only have to buy 4 tires instead of 6, don't have to worry about rocks caught between the rear tires, or worry about the rear wheels sticking out to far.

[Lawman]

quote:Originally posted by Tom S.

For what it's worth, I have a single rear wheel one ton and have been very happy with it. I only have to buy 4 tires instead of 6, don't have to worry about rocks caught between the rear tires, or worry about the rear wheels sticking out to far.

FWIW, I looked at the SRW D/A Chevy. Found out that the GVWR is only 900# more than the 3/4 ton, and about half that increase is lost on the heavier suspension of the SRW and the long bed...no short bed available on any GM one ton truck.

[jjackflash]

quote:Originally posted by Tom S.

For what it's worth, I have a single rear wheel one ton and have been very happy with it. I only have to buy 4 tires instead of 6, don't have to worry about rocks caught between the rear tires, or worry about the rear wheels sticking out to far.

I'm on my fourth 3500 Dually and believe it or not I've never had a rock caught in between the rears and I know as long as my mirrors clear my rear fenders will clear and I always have two extra spares if I need them. Also, with six tires you can rotate them and not need tires for a long time plus the stability is great with a heavy load.Of course this is just my own opinion!
Jack

[Tom S.]

quote:Originally posted by Lawman

FWIW, I looked at the SRW D/A Chevy. Found out that the GVWR is only 900# more than the 3/4 ton, and about half that increase is lost on the heavier suspension of the SRW and the long bed...no short bed available on any GM one ton truck.

Even so, our truck is within specs when hauling our FW (3500RL). When not hauling, I drop the tire pressure to 55 psi and the air bags to 10 and get a decent ride.

Besides, I don't need training wheels.

Now that I've got the DRW'ers stirred up, truck brand and weight rating is a matter of personal choice, provided you don't go too light for the expected load.

BTW: I saw a Ford 150 last week with a 5th wheel on the back, and not a small 5th wheel either! Some folks do need help, no matter what they think!

[Delaine and Lindy]

We have used Michelins on most all of our Trucks. And always got good service. The Chevy Kodiak 4500 came with Michelin 19.5's and the wear was excellent. We just put a set of Toyo's 22.5's on our Freightliner on the steer axle and will see how they perform. I have a 2008 Chevy 1500 (1/2 ton) for hauling the grocerys, and will replace the factory tire with Toyo's when I need to replace them.

Some who have the GM Trucks are having the 19.5's with the Alcoa aluminum wheels installed to fill all the empty space. But that means you will have to change rims? I very seldom change from OEM wheels anymore. In the past (younger days) that was the first mod for new car or Truck. However as I now look back that was a waste of good money. Good Luck with your choice. GBY...

[sreigle]

quote:[i]Originally posted by Tom S.I drop the tire pressure to 55 psi and the air bags to 10 and get a decent ride.

Tom, just wanted to comment when I had airbags on our 2005 F250 I dropped them to zero psi when not towing. The manual said to keep 5 psi or more in them to avoid damage should the suspension be bottomed, pinching the bags. When I look at that suspension when there is no weight in the bed, there's no way I'd ever bottom it. So I ran zero psi. That truck had 91,000 miles when we traded it, almost all with the airbags.

So, just a thought that you might further improve the ride if you're willing to risk bottoming the suspension and damaging the bags. If found a definite ride improvement compared to when I used to run 5 psi empty.