12V Lithium vs 6V deep cycle batteries

[rames14]

You will love your Battleborn batteries. And maybe not for the reason you think. The time to charge is significantly less. Given that many National Parks only allow 4 hours per day of generator use, it would be virtually impossible to keep the 4 6v batteries at 100% with only 4 hours of generator time. And that was with an RV fridge. The charge profile and charge rate (with the proper Charger) is a game changer for Boondockers with or without solar. Best of luck.

[mlh]

Originally Posted by GreG L.

Just helped the next door neighbor replace his 2-6V's with one 200Ah LiFePO4 from Amazon, $399.00. Not my first choice but has all the bells and whistles, we will see.

Was this a lithium battery?
If so this is a smoking deal.
Lynwood

[Creeker]

Originally Posted by rames14

You will love your Battleborn batteries. And maybe not for the reason you think. The time to charge is significantly less. Given that many National Parks only allow 4 hours per day of generator use, it would be virtually impossible to keep the 4 6v batteries at 100% with only 4 hours of generator time. And that was with an RV fridge. The charge profile and charge rate (with the proper Charger) is a game changer for Boondockers with or without solar. Best of luck.

I have 470Ahrs of Deka GC2 lead acids. I have no problem getting them back to 90% from a 200Ahr deficit in 3 to 4 hrs. I do have 120amps of charging available though. That last 5 or 10% is the killer and honestly, I don't worry about it unless I'm more than 4 or 5 days without a top charge.


I get what your saying though with the Lithiums charging faster. It is the absolute main reason I will go with them next. I think they are even more advantageous for campers like me who rely mostly on a generator to recharge. We're in the east and almost always in the trees.

[rames14]

But, the unfortunate thing is you need to be at your camper to run the generator instead of out seeing sights, regardless. We have a BIM in addition to generators and solar.

[Creeker]

Originally Posted by rames14

But, the unfortunate thing is you need to be at your camper to run the generator instead of out seeing sights, regardless. We have a BIM in addition to generators and solar.

Breakfast time and late evening dinner/shower time is generator time for us. Before and after the days activities.

Solar is of little importance to us at this time. I do have a 40 amp DC to DC charger.

[mlh]

When not in use can you leave lithium batteries on charge from your inverter all the time?
I always leave my camper plugged in because I use it all the time, to take a nap, for my garden supplies and any thing I might need it for.
Lynwood

[rames14]

We leave ours plugged in all the time. Our inverter/charger is built to not harm batteries when left on shore power.

[mlh]

Thanks Ron
Lynwood

[phillyg]

Recently saw a program where a lithium "expert" stated that all cables between the batteries, and the two cables to the controller, had to be equal length to minimize any imbalance in the charge/discharge rate, otherwise the battery connected with the least resistance would be overworked. I don't know, and I have no opinion on the validity of this, other than it seems logical.

[66 Galaxie]

Originally Posted by phillyg

Recently saw a program where a lithium "expert" stated that all cables between the batteries, and the two cables to the controller, had to be equal length to minimize any imbalance in the charge/discharge rate, otherwise the battery connected with the least resistance would be overworked. I don't know, and I have no opinion on the validity of this, other than it seems logical.

Not really.

http://www.smartgauge.co.uk/batt_con.html

This is the best write up I've found.

[drj736@msn.com]

I found it very interesting reading all the posts about batteries losing charge. I like to start our fridge the night before we take off on a trip. Lately my battery has discharged to the point where I cannot operate the jacks. I am wondering if a fridge takes that much power or if I have other issues.


I have a 2019 38 foot Montana. This did not used to happen.


Bob

[RipNC]

I use "Method 3" as it appears on the linked smartgauge page. Worth noting that it states there:

"Note that it is important that all 4 links on each side are the same length otherwise one of the main benefits (that of equal resistance between each battery and the loads) is lost.

The difference in results between this and the 2nd example are much smaller than the differences between the 1st and 2nd (which are enormous) but with expensive batteries it might be worth the additional work. Most people (myself included) don't consider the expense and time to be worthwhile unless expensive batteries are being fitted or if the number of batteries exceeds 8."

At 1 boat unit each (1 boat unit = $1,000) I consider my 3 LiFePO4 batteries "expensive". I made equal jumpers to busbar for both the positive and negative leads.

PS - even for David's (smartgauge guy) "new" method 4 he suggests making leads as equal as possible.

[Carl n Susan]

Originally Posted by drj736@msn.com

I found it very interesting reading all the posts about batteries losing charge. I like to start our fridge the night before we take off on a trip. Lately my battery has discharged to the point where I cannot operate the jacks. I am wondering if a fridge takes that much power or if I have other issues.


I have a 2019 38 foot Montana. This did not used to happen.


Bob

What refer do you have? The residential model does use a lot of battery.

[bcrvman]

Originally Posted by drj736@msn.com

I found it very interesting reading all the posts about batteries losing charge. I like to start our fridge the night before we take off on a trip. Lately my battery has discharged to the point where I cannot operate the jacks. I am wondering if a fridge takes that much power or if I have other issues.


I have a 2019 38 foot Montana. This did not used to happen.


Bob

If you have the usual (wrong) 12V battery and NO monitor (Victron BMV712 or SmartShunt) then the battery is probably dead or dying. If anywhere on the battery it says CRANK or the initials CCA or MCA then it is a hybrid battery, NOT a deep discharge. Solution is either plug in a trickle charger when you are connecting the battery to run the fridge overnight or plug the RV in. In either case you will likely need a new battery. The gold standard is a pair of Trojan T105's. A shunt is imperative, I bought mine months before my RV. Remember, ONLY ONE wire from battery (most)negative to shunt, all other negative wires get attached to the shunt. If there is more than 3 then put a marine grade busbar between all those wires and the shunt. Busbars are sized to the lugs being used, often 3/8" for battery connections. If you are not a full timer, and if you don't boondock often, then the existing wires are probably ok, but if there is an inverter in your future then make all the battery wires big enough for the inverter. A common size is 3,000W for most full timers, 1,000 if just a residential fridge. A 3,000 needs welding wire (super important) 4/0 GA and keep it under 3 ft. For 1,000 just 2 awg needed (welding wire). Marine grade (tinned) lugs, heat shrink, hammer or hydraulic crimper.
Welding wire is flexible due to many small wires (on amazon). Do not use auto store battery cables.
Message me if you want more help.

[bcrvman]

Originally Posted by nsdtr3

Hello RV'ers,

We have a Montana 40ft 5th wheel with 4 - 6volt Trojan batteries and they lose charge and we have to jump start the batteries to turn on our generator to recharge the batteries. We do have solar panels but the RV is stored under a a roof where no direct sun hits the solar panels, just ambient light from the rear and front of the RV. Wondered about changing to Lithium batteries like the RELiON 12V 300Ah Lithium Battery
Item No. 122875
sale price $3,429.99 was $3,488.95

The 6 volt batteries say 225 AH @ 20 hr - 185 AH @ 5 hr.

Which set up gives me the most energy and will the Lithium lose charge as quick as the deep cycle batteries?

Thanks for the help and advice,
John & Marie

The Lithium will give you close to 300AH, I limit mine to 90% of that. The FLA's will give you 225AH usable out of 450 available. It sounds like you do not have a battery monitor. I bought mine months before my RV. Either a Victron BMV712 or a Smart Shunt. Even with Lithium you should know what is happening to your batteries. Lithium loses charge very slowly. They don't like sitting at full charge, so fully charge, disconnect (NOT the factory disconnect, add a real disconnect at the positive battery post. Get a marine grade 300A disconnect. It will lose 3% per month so roughly 30 months. The FLA loses 4% per WEEK so only 12.5 weeks as you can only go down to 50% before you damage the battery. Those jacks need a fully charged battery so get a trickle charger to put on a few nights before regardless of battery type.

[djrich]

I have used Lithium batteries for the past three years with no problem. I don't know anyone using Lithium batteries who have had a problem. I am a full timer who boondocks 90% of the time with an all 3791RD Super Solarflex. Batteries are like a bank account, money i...money out. If you overdraw stuff doesn't work. Sounds like you spend more than you make. You might try using the battery disconnect when storing the 5er.

[bcrvman]

Originally Posted by GreG L.

Just helped the next door neighbor replace his 2-6V's with one 200Ah LiFePO4 from Amazon, $399.00. Not my first choice but has all the bells and whistles, we will see.

No way is it LiFePO4 for $399. If it is, post the Amazon link. The best price for any brand I have seen is $899.

[mlh]

Originally Posted by bcrvman

No way is it LiFePO4 for $399. If it is, post the Amazon link. The best price for any brand I have seen is $899.

This is true but I found a 105 AH Lion Energy for $899 with 10% off and no shipping or sales tax.
Lynwood

[bcrvman]

Originally Posted by mlh

This is true but I found a 105 AH Lion Energy for $899 with 10% off and no shipping or sales tax.
Lynwood

So was the $399 price a typo? If it's real, a lot of people in this forum would likely grab a bunch.

[mlh]

Originally Posted by bcrvman

So was the $399 price a typo? If it's real, a lot of people in this forum would likely grab a bunch.

I’m so sorry I didn’t mean to say you could buy a 100 amp lithium battery for $399. I certainly couldn’t find one any where near that price. The closest was the Lion Energy for $809.
Lynwood