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Old 02-20-2020, 04:08 PM   #21
rohrmann
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We had the Titan kit installed by Performance Trailer Braking this past June. Bill, who was the installer and also put on the presentation at the rally said there are three different actuators used, the Brakerite EHB, which is the one Performance installs, the Hydrastar that Dexter uses and is also what MORRyde installs and is also the one on the Legacy packages, plus one other brand. All of them spool up to pressure very fast, the Brakerite is the fastest, but between the fastest and the slowest, most people will never notice the second or two difference, if itís even that much. Compared to the pitiful braking from the drums, even a couple seconds of delay is still going to stop you much faster with any of the disc packages, so once you start running with which ever system you have, you will still stop much faster. If you have discs, you will never want to tow another rig without them.
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Old 02-20-2020, 05:15 PM   #22
Carl n Susan
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As I recall the Brakerite is significantly faster than the others. Plus it is compatible with most vehicles as is.
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Old 02-21-2020, 12:41 AM   #23
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When we purchased our 2019 3791 Legacy we had a F350, the delay was 2-3 seconds, however now we have a new 2019 Ram 3500 no delay. Same 5er different trucks.
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Old 02-21-2020, 08:32 AM   #24
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Called Dexter and described the issue. The response was:
Inertia
Ok, I knew that was a factor in any brake controller's response rate but with the magnet type it varies the voltage and even though you are at a standstill, the magnet still "actuates", just variable strength based on the voltage applied. I suppose I never paid attention to the exact moment that it happens. I could always tell that my wife was holding the brake pedal as we set up because I could hear them hum.
So, on the hydraulic system, yes it still actuates at standstill but not immediately because the truck brakes can handle any movement. If you still have the brake pedal depressed, after a few seconds, then the pump will turn on, pressure will increase and calipers will clamp down on the disc.
Therefore movement is required for the brakes to act like we expect them to act when using the brake pedal, maybe as much as 25 mph.
I have always done a "tug test" after hitching up before getting out into traffic but that was usually with the manual controls and with magnet brakes.
So, I'll go ahead and bleed the air, then when I get a chance, hitch up, take it for a drag and decide what gain setting works best for me. Oh yeah, after all this SC/GA rain dries up. Anyone want to come crawl on the ground for me?
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Old 02-21-2020, 09:00 AM   #25
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If there is a delay on braking, there is air in the lines. When I did my install, I had a delay in mine. I power bled them over and over with no improvement. I then gravity bled them several times and got more air out with a huge improvement in braking.
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Old 02-21-2020, 06:44 PM   #26
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My truck is way older than most of you guys, but I did put on the "Max Brake" conversion kit years ago when it was still available. It works off line pressure of your brakes ... the harder you push on the pedal, the more line pressure there is. When sitting still, the second I apply the truck brakes, the pump starts. I'm reasonably sure the newer trucks integrated tow brake control also works off line pressure and not inertia with a pendulum inside like my old Reese Digi Trac controller did. Those of you with newer trucks in the know should respond here.
PS ... I have the HydraStar brake actuator.
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Old 02-21-2020, 06:57 PM   #27
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As for the difference in applied voltage to trailer brakes comparing the electromagnet drums to electric over hydraulic disk ... this is how I understand it ... then again maybe I don't. Electromagnetic brake magnets are directly fed 0 - 12 VDC depending on your trucks controller output. The more voltage, the harder the magnet tries to grip the brake drum. Electric over hydraulic (disk) have 12 VDC going to the pump and 0-12 VDC going to circuitry that bleeds off pressure as needed depending on your trucks controller output. In other words, the pumps output is always say 1600 psi, but circuitry inside the Hydrastar bleeds off some of that pressure in relation to the trucks controller output.
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Old 02-21-2020, 09:12 PM   #28
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Interesting comparisons, but not sure y'all are getting what's happening here, the 12v electric pump ain't doing s**t for 5-6 seconds, its not bleeding off pressure, it's not energizing at all.
Again, that's at standstill, so not sure about in motion, will update when the flood waters recede.
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Old 02-21-2020, 09:36 PM   #29
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I understand that your actuator isn't coming on for a few seconds ... I was just describing mine as coming on instantly. If indeed your actuator on your fiver is a HydraStar and your truck is a Ford or Chevy between the years of 2007 - 2017 with the integrated brake controller ... you may have to install an adapter to make it work right.

There are several sites discussing your issue in one fashion or another ... try this one for starters. Read all the way down and see if it applies to you.
https://www.etrailer.com/p-HBA-CAM.html

What others have said could apply in your case as well ... I'm just offering this up for you to consider.
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Old 02-21-2020, 10:29 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EMCS retired View Post
Interesting comparisons, but not sure y'all are getting what's happening here, the 12v electric pump ain't doing s**t for 5-6 seconds, its not bleeding off pressure, it's not energizing at all.
Again, that's at standstill, so not sure about in motion, will update when the flood waters recede.

I'm not disputing your problem with the actuator not working. You might pull the breakaway switch to see if the pump is operating. That is how you can bleed the systems, pull the switch, then bleed, then push the plunger back in, refill the reservoir, then repeat until all the air is cleared. If the pump motor in the actuator is not working, it will need to be replaced or maybe power is not getting to it when the brakes are applied. Pulling the breakaway switch will prove the motor is or is not working. You do not need the trailer connected to the truck to check this.
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Old 02-21-2020, 10:38 PM   #31
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I'm of the opinion that the Ford IBC is not the best. I have the old Brakesmart unit in my old F350 and it works great and has a lot of driver control options. In my 2013, it only has the gain options. No initial brake options. This is EOH and electric. Sometimes I feel like the truck is doing most of the work when braking. I know the later year trucks have an option in the IPC to adjust the IBC initial grab, but I'm not even sure it works well.
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Old 02-21-2020, 10:38 PM   #32
rohrmann
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On our rig, being towed with a 2012 Chevy, Performance had to install the Ford/Chevy adapter device so the brakes would work properly with the truck, otherwise, I believe the truck would not recognize the trailer for braking.
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