Engine programers

[08UltraRider]

[quote]quote:Originally posted by Clyde n Deb

Originally posted by 08UltraRider

I've got an Edge tuner where it doesn't do anything for mileage. I didn't get it for mileage increases and no it doesn't void the warranty

This from another post this morning:


"told me the Banks system compromised the GM OEM electronics, and there will be no warranty work performed. Charged me $105.00 and noted it in GM records with my VIN. This truck only has 18k miles plus I had bought an extended warranty when new."

Magnuson–Moss Warranty Act states that the modification had to have caused the defect before warranty can be denied. By what the OP stated in his post "the Banks system compromised the GM OEM electronics" so I would go along with that claim.

I learned this from first Harley Davidson when I did some mods on my new Ultra Classic which was again backed up by GM when I changed the exhaust system through the dealer when the truck was new. This prompted me to read up on the act and found it true.


ON EDIT:

Taken from Magnuson-Moss act for dummies:

Under the Magnuson-Moss Act, a dealer must prove, not just vocalize, that aftermarket equipment caused the need for repairs before it can deny warranty coverage. If the dealer cannot prove such a claim — or it proffers a questionable explanation — it is your legal right to demand compliance with the warranty. The Federal Trade Commission administers the Magnuson-Moss Act and monitors compliance with warranty law.

That being said, if you choose to modify your car, and suddenly the fancy new electronic control boxes that you added to your car make it run rough, not start when cold, or buck like a bronco, the dealer can and will charge a diagnostic fee to find out what is wrong with your car. If it turns out that your modifications are the cause of the problem, the dealer has every right not only to charge you for the diagnosis and repair, but to also void the portion of the warranty that has been compromised by the use of those aftermarket parts. Likewise, a dealer may refuse to service your car if it is adorned with aftermarket parts to the extent that its technicians cannot reasonably be expected to diagnose what is wrong with your car.

[1retired06]

Very few folks I run across after years of fulltiming add any performance enhancers to late model diesels

[Dave Nowlin]

Most of the manufacturers claim to be able to tell if you modify their new trucks. If you're caught bye bye warranty. I sort of understand their position. People have put programmers on these diesels and blown head gaskets and had other failures by pushing these engines well beyond design parameters and then they pull the programmer off and claim innocence. If I destrpy an engine by hopping it up, I shown own up to what I've done. I run bone stock. If you destroy the engine or fuel system in one of these new Fords it will definitely cost you way more than $10,000 just for the parts. Never mind the labor. Some programmer manufacturers claim teir systems are undectable. Not true when certain parameters are exceeded with these new engines a record is kept. When those parameters are outside of what is possible with a stock engine, you are busted. Honestly I have no need for more power that my King Ranch produces.

[TLightning]

quote:Originally posted by richfaa

I have got nothing against tuners it is to me a cost vs benefits issue. They will not improve MPG much and we do not need more power so it is of no benefits to us. Nearing 50K this 08 Ford is getting better MPG solo than it ever got.We were advised when we purchased it that MPG would improve with milage and that seems to be the case. The Ford does not do as well as the GM or Dodge but then they are much heavier.

My thoughts also...why do it??

[larrymul]

[quote]quote:Originally posted by Clyde n Deb

Originally posted by 08UltraRider

I've got an Edge tuner where it doesn't do anything for mileage. I didn't get it for mileage increases and no it doesn't void the warranty

This from another post this morning:


"told me the Banks system compromised the GM OEM electronics, and there will be no warranty work performed. Charged me $105.00 and noted it in GM records with my VIN. This truck only has 18k miles plus I had bought an extended warranty when new."

I'm the poster referenced here. I've since returned to Texas and gone to my local dealer, who did some warranty work on my DM. After that, the dealer actually sent a road tech out to program my new remote start module for free. The dealer said that Lamb Chevrolet was wrong for not fixing my truck on warranty. I received an email from Banks today with a couple of documents from Banks Engineering warranty adviser, Jim Moore, explaining why the manufacturer can not arbitrarily deny work without proof the add on was the direct cause of the failure, that mere existence of an aftermarket device, or devices is not a valid reason for denial, and explains what the dealer and/or manufacturer has to do to deny coverage. It's interesting reading, if anyone would like a copy, PM me with your email, I'll send it.

[Ken Ralston]

So if I am reading this right everyone is saying Superchips & Smarty J ' s will not add Fuel Mileage in most cases but may add HP with a lot of black smoke that you don't Need. I just bought a 2011 Ram with a Cummins and its gauges said i was getting about 16 to 17 at 78mph then switched to 67mph seeme to be around 19 to 20 but gauges are deceptive I know. I worried about tying on to the Monty but haven't yet it seems to have done its best after 4500miles. And dealer said it would improve with miles. As far as I know Superchip doesn't make one for a 2011 but Smarty Does but I too am skeptical of warranty.

[farmboy]

quote:Originally posted by Ken Ralston

So if I am reading this right everyone is saying Superchips & Smarty J ' s will not add Fuel Mileage in most cases but may add HP with a lot of black smoke that you don't Need. I just bought a 2011 Ram with a Cummins and its gauges said i was getting about 16 to 17 at 78mph then switched to 67mph seeme to be around 19 to 20 but gauges are deceptive I know. I worried about tying on to the Monty but haven't yet it seems to have done its best after 4500miles. And dealer said it would improve with miles. As far as I know Superchip doesn't make one for a 2011 but Smarty Does but I too am skeptical of warranty.

Your gages are reading about the same as my '04.5 5.9 CDT. I am not complaining even though I have been buying fuel at $4.09 since Christmas at about $100. every 2 weeks. JMO.

[Rspradling]

It does add horsepower, and I do not any see black smoke unless i STOMP ON IT. I am running a smarty jr. Dodge 2500 Cummins 6.7. Also, there is an increase of about 3.5 MPG Highway (im getting 23.5 Highway). But that is not with the smarty alone. You must also get rid of the Diesel Particulate Filter (DPF) (this will void your warranty). The MPG gain while towing, was only about 1 MPG but any increase while towing is good.

Its just a risk, to void warranty for a gain, or not to void. I did due to problems with the DPF and they would not replace it (its covered up to 36k miles). $2500 repair, so i just got rid of it.

[mlh]

Rspradling
I don't see any black smoke either.
Quote
Its just a risk, to void warranty for a gain, or not to void. I did due to problems with the DPF

It is a risk and I love a risk, some people do and some don't. And I love the extra power. I will be pulling 470 miles tomorrow in the mountains of western Virginia and she wont even break a sweat.
Lynwood

[denandannie]

Just to add a bit of reality to all you diesel owners who are getting such great fuel milage. I have a paid for 2001 Chevy 8.1 gas that only gets 7 mpg towing and 12 solo. To get better milage I'd have to upgrade to a diesel at what, $50k or more. Now, I can sure buy alot of fuel for that price and take many rv trips until I've got two feet in the grave. I am being factious here. Just be thankful for what ya got. Some of us have far, far less. Contentment is in the eye of the beholder.

[Tom S.]

quote:Originally posted by denandannie

Just to add a bit of reality to all you diesel owners who are getting such great fuel milage. I have a paid for 2001 Chevy 8.1 gas that only gets 7 mpg towing and 12 solo. To get better milage I'd have to upgrade to a diesel at what, $50k or more. Now, I can sure buy alot of fuel for that price and take many rv trips until I've got two feet in the grave. I am being factious here. Just be thankful for what ya got. Some of us have far, far less. Contentment is in the eye of the beholder.

To upgrade to any new truck will cost you, but what if you upgraded to a 2001 diesel? A lot less than $50,000!

[steelpony5555]

It is not the programmer that gets you the increase in fuel mileage, it only gives you more power. As was said it takes more fuel for more power. But its the other things you have to do to run the programmer at a higher setting, like the free flow exhaust,(read DPF/cat delete) and also the EGR delete, are what gets you the higher fuel mileage. On most programmers it says you should and most say if you don't do the deletes, you will damage your motor. Remember Dodge's 5.9 before the DPF filters got probably 2-3 mpg more then the 6.7.

And dealers do all the time deny warranty work if you have a programmer. Now and then you will find one who realizes that it's not right to deny work if it's not the programmers fault. I would talk to your local dealer first and see what their stance is on it.

[1retired06]

I had Bank equipment on gas engines; power increase, minor MPG. None with Diesel, I value my warranty too much, and have found stock diesels more than adequate for towing, with better MPG than the big gassers.

[mlh]

I just got back from a 1000 mile trip and checked my fuel mileage. I filed up to the rim not one more ounce of fuel could be added. I left home and got on I81 at exit 132 and headed up Christingsburg Mt then into the New River Valley and on to I77 south to Fancy Gap and down into North Carolina to Charlotte NC . At the top of Christingsburu Mt my gage said 8 MPG by the time I got to the bottom of Fancy Gap it was up to about 10. When I stooped for fuel it was reading 12.2. Going through Charlotta speed was 50 to 60, on 81 it was about 70 and on 77 speed was about 75 except on Fancy Gap about 60. My camper is a light 2955 RL, dry weight 9200 pounds says Keystone, the truck a 2008 F250 weighs 8400, with fuel 2 people probably 9000 pounds. It is tuned. 580+ HP with over 1100 pound feet of torque. As for fuel mileage 10.2 MPG.
The engine oil and coolant stayed at about 200 to 203 degrees.
The transmission ran at 165 to 172 except going up Fancy Gap when I got behind 2 trucks at 55 MPG then it went up to 242 until I could get back up to 65, then it down to about 200. Transmission slip was zero RPM even on a hard pull after the torque converter locked up.
Boost never exceeded 35 pounds, stock these trucks well go to about 40 pounds of boost.
EGT never exceeded 1200 degrees and on level ground at 70 to 75 MPH, EGT ran about 700 to 750 degrees. It is hard to pinpoint EGT will fluctuate 100 degrees in a second or two.
Lynwood

[Clyde n Deb]

So where'd ya go?

[mlh]

Hunting Island State Park South Carolina, the low country.
Lynwood