The Good, the Bad, & the Ugly!!

[AZCampinfool]

Warning….this is a long rant!! Just got back from a 16 day trip to Yellowstone/Tetons in our new 06 Mountaineer. This was only our second trip in the new fiver. Overall the trip was great and the scenery was breathtaking. I wish I could sing the same praises about the Mountaineer. Here is the good: We love the floor plan, separate bunk room for the kids, enclosed bath, spacious storage, good tank capacities, rock steady towing…in essence all the reasons we bought the Mountaineer to begin with. Now for the bad: 170 miles into the trip we stop for a break and I notice the 5” x 6’ wood molding above the bedroom closet has come loose and is sitting on the floor. Further inspection reveals it was mounted with brad nails that were nailed into a void space securing it to nothing. Trim piece gets put into basement storage. To date, I think I have pulled up 9 staples from our carpet throughout the fiver. They seem to be surfacing at random and I usually step on one before I ever see it. All I can figure is they randomly stapled the carpet down and they are slowly working their way out. Sharp staples are not good for anyone’s bare feet, especially my little kids. I wake up after our first night and as I am doing the hitch up routine I notice a small water drip leaking into the front basement storage under the bathroom. Further investigation after removing panels reveals water is somehow leaking from the shower. Checked all the fittings..all good, then discover the water is leaking between the small tub and wall. I re-caulk the entire shower focusing most of my effort where the shower surround meets the top of the tub. To this date, water is still leaking and I am stumped as to exactly where it is coming from. Here comes the ugly……Second day out, we discover all the dresser drawers in the bunk room do not stay closed while traveling. When I try to close them, something is wrong and they are not sliding on the drawer glides correctly. Further inspection reveals the drawer glides are mounted to a 1x2 pine frame in the back of the dresser. This flimsy frame is once again stapled together with no other fasteners or glue. All of the stapled joints have come apart during our travels resulting in the separation of the drawer guides which then allowed the back of the drawers to collapse into the dresser. Remember I am on day two of a 16 day trip with wife and two young kids trying to drive 1000 miles to meet our friends in the Tetons, so it is not like I have tons of time to deal with these issues or seek out a dealer for repairs. We secure the drawers so no further damage happens and drive on. We arrive for our second nights stay and my dear wife comes out of the Mountaineer with that look on her face. She says you won’t believe it, but go look at our closet. I go look and discover the entire closet rail in the front closet is down on the floor, clothes and all. Further inspection reveals that the closet rod brackets…metal brackets and wood supports they are attached too, have separated from the underside of the closet shelf and wall. Once again, these wood brackets were stapled from the top of the shelf with no glue or any other bracing. At this point I am thinking what kind of idiot would mount a closet rod with just staples and expect it to hold a closet full of clothes while bouncing down the road!! As you can imagine, I am not a happy camper and am flat out disgusted at the cheap way this unit was put together. I know most of the folks here have Montanas so hopefully your rigs are put together better than the Mountaineers. This is one of those….if I only knew then what I know now I probably would not have purchased this fiver. This is my third RV…first a Jayco, then a Forest River and now the Mountaineer and I hate to admit the workmanship on this unit is definitely the worst of the three. Luckily for me, I have a background in woodworking/furniture making and I was able to repair everything I just mentioned with my cordless drill and some supplies from Walmart while I was on my trip. The difference being I did use some glue and wood screws and secured everything real good like it should have been done in the first place. Unfortunately with the problems I have had, it has left me wondering what is going to happen or fall off next?? You would think for the money that we spend on these units that they would at least hold up longer than a couple of days on the road. I did take pictures of all of these issues and you can bet Keystone will be hearing from me. I don’t expect them to do anything for me especially since I already fixed their shoddy workmanship but I do feel they need to know about these issues and maybe someday, someone will wake up and start building these things right. (I know….wishful thinking!!) The one conclusion I have come to after all of this is the fact that I think I need to invest in a Trail air or Mor-ryde type pin box and maybe even shocks or equivalent for the fiver. After seeing how everything seems to be shaking loose I figure it certainly can’t hurt. For those of you who read this far, you are very patient....thanks for letting me vent!!

[Montana Sky]

I am sorry to hear about the problems you had while on the road. While the rv industry needs some quality control help, I still feel that Keystone is one of the better built rigs on the road. Please keep us posted as to the response Keystone gives about problems that have surfaced in your coach. Now that you have fixed these issue, I hope your future trips go much smoother.

[steves]

I can understand your frustration....I hope your dealer and keystone handles all your problems effectively and they use this information to improve their production quality. I concur with Montana Sky's statement that keystone is one of the better built rigs. Unfortunately, some production issue are still getting out to the customer

[315RLS]

AZ, After reading your note I can understand your lack of confidence in the construction of your 5'er. We also have a Mountaineer, TT not 5WHL and have encountered our share of funky stuff but not greatly different than others but not the staplegun approach to contruction. Sounds like a hack was on the line when putting yours together. I expect that Keystone would know by unit# who worked the line and a letter to them so they are aware and possibly others won't have the same experience. I'd be ripped if ours had this problem but wouldn't know what to suggest to fix it as its unlikely a dealer would take it back. Possibly others might have encountered the same problem and can offer some suggestions..

[Glass Guy]

I think Keystone should reinburse you for time, money, and any inconvenience you have incountoured, sounds to me like this is a unit that should have never left the factory. Good luck and hopefully all of your problems are behind you.

[CountryGuy]

Sadly, most of your issues have been brought to light here on the forum several times before. Check the archives and use the search engine, you will see what I mean.

Does NOT excuse the shoddy work. Does not help your mood, spoils the fun of having a new unit, makes the wife and kids upset. Bad stuff all the way around. Good thinking to take photos before you repaired!

Check our posts, in the past said it many times, will never pull another 5er without benefit of a air hitch or pin. Period! (I know, last night I said never say never, but this is one time when I think I can get away with it, that is how strongly we feel about the air hitch/pin being a necessity!)

I hope that after all the fixing ya did you were able to get out there and enjoy God's country. We have never been to Yellowstone, we drool when we read of others making the trip!

Good luck and hope that future trips will prove more enjoyable.

[dsprik]

Hope Keystone helps your peace of mind. That's not a good road trip when you stop and then are afraid to open the camper door... Staples in the carpet? Never heard of that. Hope they are not doing that on our Montana.

[CountryGuy]

Dave, our carpet is stapled down in places, specially around the edges. When they were doing some repairs on ours, they saw that the carpet under the couch/dining slide was not attached well, and they took a staple gun and shot along that edge, should be called a machine gun! We did have a few misfires to pick out, but the carpet is not fraying there, and so far the machine gun approach fix has served us well.

[lightningjack11]

I have found you have to be a handyman to own a trailer. I like my rig but I am constantly working on it. I have done a lot of work inside my cabinets and the drawers still sag from time to time. I just fix it and go on. The faults you found are just carelessness by employees trying to finish as quickly as posssible.

Good luck finding a solution with Keystone.

I wish each stage of construction had a traceable QC signoff so when problems like this occur, Keystone can trace exactly who approved it and thus solve the construction problem for follow-ons.

Be off for a few days while go to Ft Wilderness on a shakedown campout in preparation for my annual trip to Kansas.

[Wrenchtraveller]

I think the majority of Fivers on the road are staying together just fine with standard hitches.
I towed a cheap Kit Companion up and down I-5 from Canada to Mexico for 10 years. No problems.

My 3500 mile 6 week trip on my 2955 RL was completely trouble free. Your truck's suspension and your trailer's suspension, if working together can give good results. My unit tows excellent and things do not move around inside. Some units might need an air hitch. Some are fine with a conventional hitch.

Here is one example, my brother's 98 Dodge pulling a 26 foot Forest River Fiver on certain road conditions would go into a slamming on the hitch that was incredible. We hooked it up to my 2000 F350 Ford, went over the same section of road that had caused his slamming............ nothing,
smooth and easy. Why ? I don't know , a combination of wheel base, spring tension?
His new 05 Dodge pulls his same fiver just fine.

[richfaa]

You should contact the Mountainer plant and let them know of all your problems..We all need to do this is or nothing will change.Your post needs to go directly to the plant mamanger or better yet find out who the District sales rep for Montana/ Mountaineer is in your area and give him/her that information.If we do not let them know there IS a problem they will not know there is a problem.

[CountryGuy]

Don, as you point out, different trucks, different rigs, different roads, different springs, different everything on our rigs make for VERY different experiences.

We hauled Tana around for well over a year without a air pin. But, not all was well, we had what we felt was considerable bouncing. Did you ever hear the story of the bouncing bottle of Dawn dishwashing liquid? Short version: large almost full bottle Dawn, sitting in the deep sink of Tana. Took back roads from McHenry County Illinois to the first rally in Bremen,Indiana. (note: Al does not drive fast and does slow down for railroad tracks and such, ) Got there and found the Dawn had bounced OUT of that deep sink, laid on counter top and dribbled soap, then fell on the floor and made desert plate size puddle of dish soap in the back corner where the kitchen slide meets solid wall of unit. Dishes IN cupboards had bounced right past the spring bars (same as Steve and Vicki R have, they have never had this happen to them, we have almost identical 3295's, but they have different truck and are full timing).

Well, after the Rally we had repairs done to the unit and during the ruckus that creates, we ended up with a air pin.

After driving the unit another year and a half, we are still aghast at how much that nose bounces around and floats over the truck and hitch with that air pin. It is our feelings that the air pin is reducing stress on the front end of the 5er (well, that is what we hope HA HA). I have never had movement in the kitchen like I described above SINCE the air pin was added.

It is amazing to sit in the passenger side of Big Butt and turn around, look out the back window and watch Tana floating over that hitch. Watching it scares me to think of what was going on back there BEFORE the air pin.

This is another great example of doing what fits into your comfort zone. Yes, there are a lot of units out there hauled around for years and have no trouble without air something or other. There are others of us that will never be without one. That said, I sure see a lot more air pins being added to units, 3 years ago ya rarely saw one, now we see quite a few. Not sure what that says, just an observation.

Happy hauling!

[awaywego]

Richffa,

I agree with the first part of your reply. Let the manager of Mountaineer plant know.
The first year I had the Monty I had bubbles appear on the roof and called and talked to the district sales person and was told that was normal because the roof had to breath.
The next year while on a trip to the west coast the roof was breathing more than ever.
A dealer in South Dakota told me to call the head man over the reps and talk to him.
I did this and emailed him photos and he told me to take it to a dealer and have a new roof installed, which I did and Montana paid the bill of $2400.
Go to the top because the reps try to tell you that is normal.

[Sunshine]

Can only echo what has been said before. Off all the units that roll off the assembly line in great shape, it seems like every once in a while there is one that has so many problems it is unbelievable. You were wise to document your problems with photos and Keystone definitely needs to hear from you. It pays to be direct, calm and patient, state your case and carry on from there. Good luck in getting your problems resolved to your satisfaction, and don't give up 'til it's done!

[richfaa]

MOC 40 is correct..You need to get your message to the top in any way you can.It just so happens that the District rep for this area, Marl Krol is a "get things done" guy.

[Searchers]

Sorry to hear of the problems and Keystone should be ashamed of the poor quality in this particular unit. If an air type hitch is needed to keep things from falling apart it should have been delivered with one.

[boat391]

I have had a few of the same problems with our new monty and am in the process of going to the top at keystone your uses of photo's to doc is the best way to get your point driven home I to am able to fix our cabinets the way they should be fixed so I'll take that chore upon myself after seeing our dealerships service I'll not take anything to them It's a shame that we pay good money for shoddy work. as of now till I hear back from keystone I'll not recomend there product untill they can make there product a quality piece I do belive I payed for such a piece and will demand it from them so good luck with your 5'er too Iwill keep all of you posted on keystone's response

[mobilrvn]

It amazes me that for the price a a couple of tubes of glue and the additional time to apply it, that most of the RV mfgrs. only use staples. Sure that using glue along with the staples would resolve 90% of the complains and warranty work on things that come adrift---some common sense would help, too.

[richfaa]

money, money, money..time is money..they can staple way faster than they can glue.

[Dustytuu]

Our shower also had a small leak. Don found a loose connectiion under the shower floor in the plumbing. He tightened it and so far no leaks.