Broken Frames

[tyme2par4]

I can't be the only one having major frame problems. I see they're popping up a lot with Grand Design, but haven't seen anything here.

We had a 2021 335BH for about 15 months and put 15k miles on it when we realized the frame was failing. Every one of the cross members had failed so there was nothing holding the frame together.

Now we are in a 2023 351BH and it's happening again. We had 1 cross member break in the first 3 months and 1k miles. That was repaired by a qualified welder under Keystone direction. Now here we are about 15 months and 12k miles later and we have more broken welds. This time not just the cross members. We have broken welds in the walls, in the floors and in the front cap section. It's to the point where the expansion joint under the slide has opened up almost an inch, and opens more when we travel.

We typically run a few hundred pounds under gvwr and have never hit any large pot holes. Any dirt roads have been driven at slow speeds.
We thought maybe the first one was just a fluke, but now it seems to be a trend.

[Mikendebbie]

There has been TONS of threads about frame flex/ frame related problems on Montanas in this forum since I joined in 2018. I don’t know exactly how far back the problem goes…meaning did the problem occur in 2001 models etc. Or does it occur in High Country models and Legacy models on an equal basis? You can search for the threads but you will not find answers to “why does this continue to happen?” Or are there certain models that are more susceptible to frame problems…or is there anyway to prevent frame problems happening to me?

You are fortunate to be within the 3 year frame warranty period.

[Daryles]

"Frame flex" (actually wall flex or broken welds in the wall frame) and a broken frame stringer welds are entirely two different things.
I recall seeing a video on YouTube where they took the front storage area apart on a GD and you could see the Weld breaks where the front overhang attaches.
I believe another of our members experienced broken stringer welds. You would need to do a search.
We had our "wall flex" fixed at Affinity RV Group in Goshen Indiana in January 2020. It's still perfect.

[RMcNeal]

I have some problems with "wall flex" in the corner of both rear slides. It's going back to Keystone next month after the dealer has spent 2 years and 4 attempts to patch. I've been told it is likely broken welds somewhere in the aluminum framing of the walls but dealer has been unable to find them. Honestly not sure they even tried, but they have cut bigger and bigger holes in the sides attempting to patch it with no luck.

[Mikendebbie]

Originally Posted by Daryles

"Frame flex" (actually wall flex or broken welds in the wall frame) and a broken frame stringer welds are entirely two different things.
I recall seeing a video on YouTube where they took the front storage area apart on a GD and you could see the Weld breaks where the front overhang attaches.
I believe another of our members experienced broken stringer welds. You would need to do a search.
We had our "wall flex" fixed at Affinity RV Group in Goshen Indiana in January 2020. It's still perfect.

I agree with Daryles - separate issues.

[ChuckS]

Pictures of the issue would help others give you better info...

[tyme2par4]

The first picture show the expansion joint with no weight on the pin. You can see by the tape line where it is supposed to be, and it opens more after driving.
The second picture is the slide mechanism. You can clearly see it's not square anymore because the stud is twisted.
Third picture is a broke cross member weld right behind the axles.
Fourth picture is showing how much our frame was twisiting on our 2021 because all of the cross members were broken.

[twindman]

In the 'old days' early 2000s, frame flex was just that. The 10 inch frame where it went up at the front would have welds break. Then never used any kind of angled bracing (forget what you call it). I had this happen in 2012. Apparently kind of new, as the dealer near Seattle said they 'never heard of it'!!!! I limped home to Mesa with fingers crossed and my dealer took the front end off and welded it and added gussets (just remembered their name!).

Then on my 2013 model after several years the back end started detaching (slid back about 2 inches). Dealer put in bigger screws and pushed it back together. About 2 years later same thing. I took off the side panels to see the screws and the holes in the aluminum studs holes were stripped out. Put in screws near by. Another year or 2 and same thing - holes were completely covering the end of the studs! Dealer took sides off and found all 3 short studs along the side were broken off, so fixed those and put in a new rear stud so screws could hold.


Both these things happened a couple of years after going to Alaska - maybe that is a hint.

[rohrmann]

This is a photo of the repaired frame on our rig from almost eight years ago. The arrow points to where the only weld was on the factory gusset where the vertical frame is connected to the rectangular beam that goes all the way across the rig, in the drivers side propane compartment. The circled place is where the beam was totally broken. The mobile RV tech/welder was able to weld the beam and the gusset and also added 1/4" gussets on the bottom of the beam. He also welded where cracks were showing on the brackets that attach the pin to the the frame. We were very fortunate that he was able to come to us at the RV park to make the repairs.

[rubio171]

After seeing all the frame stuff, I asked a couple of Rv repair places locally about adding reinforcements to prevent this. First thing both asked me was 1. Do you have a gooseneck conversion on your hitch? NO I don’t…they said most of the time it’s the rigs with the goosneck adapter. Who knows…I think it may be luck of the draw.

[Britz]

No you're not the only one having major issues, I've had my share of problems with my 2017 Montana 3820fk.
Had the frame flex in the spring, fixed by Affinity, then all the outriggers are braking off at the axles location, and both cross members around the axles broke off from the frame, the floor is all wavy, the driver side wall is broken at the rear corner of the slide, but according to Keystone some of it is normal, or it's damaged caused by the tow vehicle, or it's because of the hitch on back, or some other lame excuse, but it has nothing to do with KEYSTONE. it's a P.O.S.
All fifthwheel from 2012 and up. A lawsuit needs to happen!!!

If you're gonna buy a Montana, buy a "PARK MODEL" cause the're not built to go on the road.

[Old Okie]

Agree with others that there are several types of flex/failures happening. My 2017 Montana HC 305RL is experiencing hitch to cap flex, while upper deck to frame flex measured according to the Lippert procedure is zero. I've had no caulk slip, fiberglass/filon cracks, nor any cracks in the steel main (underbody) frame, nor on any of the aluminum framing I can see from the cross-thru, or around the propane bottle, front jacks areas.

The hitch to body cap flex is 7/16" from loaded to unloaded condition, measured at about the center of the hitch pin. Since this is a cantilever setup, the movement back at the hitch to frame attachment will be a bit less. I talked to a Lippert Customer Service rep about both measurements and he wasn't too concerned about the hitch flex. It's not his trailer though! I plan to run it some and remeasure to see if anything has changed. That is unless some of you has some experience that would convince me otherwise!

Thanks!

[Britz]

[Britz]

[makeithappen]

Originally Posted by Britz

No you're not the only one having major issues, I've had my share of problems with my 2017 Montana 3820fk.
Had the frame flex in the spring, fixed by Affinity, then all the outriggers are braking off at the axles location, and both cross members around the axles broke off from the frame, the floor is all wavy, the driver side wall is broken at the rear corner of the slide, but according to Keystone some of it is normal, or it's damaged caused by the tow vehicle, or it's because of the hitch on back, or some other lame excuse, but it has nothing to do with KEYSTONE. it's a P.O.S.
All fifthwheel from 2012 and up. A lawsuit needs to happen!!!

If you're gonna buy a Montana, buy a "PARK MODEL" cause the're not built to go on the road.

Exactly, I have a 2021. mine was repaired at my dealer in ohio for a crack in the lower front corner of bedroom slide. Now I will be going to affinity rv In Indiana to get more frame issues taken care of in may of this year. On both sides where the radius meets the front storage or generator compartment. you put weight on truck and/or trailer you can see movement 0f approx. a 1/4 in. The welds look like crap, can't believe they put this junk out. Very frustrating!!

[ojo123]

We just had our 2021 high country welds on three crossmembers fail. I noticed one near the very back one day looking to be sure no rodent holes were visible in texas. Took it to a shop where I live and they had to repair two more. The crossmembers on my rig a basically sheet metal and making solid weld to the much thicker frame was impossible. The shop duplicated a patch to mimic the crossmember ends and re welded both pieces to the frame. It appears to be holding...knock on wood.

[tyme2par4]

Originally Posted by ojo123

We just had our 2021 high country welds on three crossmembers fail. I noticed one near the very back one day looking to be sure no rodent holes were visible in texas. Took it to a shop where I live and they had to repair two more. The crossmembers on my rig a basically sheet metal and making solid weld to the much thicker frame was impossible. The shop duplicated a patch to mimic the crossmember ends and re welded both pieces to the frame. It appears to be holding...knock on wood.

That's what happened on our 2021 but I didn't catch it early enough. By the time I realized what the problem they were all broken and the frame rails were twisted.
On our 2023 I caught 1 broken after just 3 months and had it welded and reinforced by a mobile tech. Now I know at least 1 more is broken and I'll be dropping the under belly today to check all of them. I'm willing to bet there's more.