Is Ford understating payload capabilities?

[richfaa]

Yes. We crunched about those same numbers. The only difference was a additional 25 gals of fuel since it came with 13 gals aboard.We do have the 4X2 and those numbers are why we do not worry about pin weight.The average person never gets into this weight issue with the trucks and Rv's like some of us do and the manufactures count on that. The truth is the average buyer believes what the manufacture tells them. The two questions we always got when selling campers was...Can I pull this with my truck..and..How much will the monthly payment be...How much does it weigh was a rare question. The manufacturers count on..no rely on the fact that most buyers do not care or are not smart enough to figure these things out. Everything we did was weight related..No 4X4 on the truck, no high gloss, no dual pane windows, no fireplace.( the diesel motor is another story)

[bardave]

one comment regarding a 3/4 ton vs 1 ton being the same payload capacity ratings ..the Ford book, (page 24 of the 2007 brochure) says the F 250 4x2 SRW can carry 3100# payload ...the F350 4x2, SRW can carry 4200# payload...
that is why I am getting the 2007 one ton, F 350....it can carry 1100# more payload...
but all else between the two seem to be the same (according to the Ford Book)

have read many comments regarding waiting until Jan for the 6.4... my experience in life tells me not to get the first edition of any model...car, motor home, 5th wheel etc.. maybe just my lousy luck but first editions have been bummers for me.

[Wrenchtraveller]

Bardave, yes to get the max GVWR in the SRW F350 you need the 18" or 20" wheels to get tires that support this impressive GVWR. I have 11200 on my model and I remember when duallies only had a 10000 lb GVWR.

[David and Jo-Anna]

Don--thanks for the tip on 18" wheels--so that's what Ford means by the footnote saying to see your dealer "for payloads with 17" wheels/tires and 10,000# GVWR." Wish they would be more forthcoming in their literature. Hate to rely on having to ask dealers since they seem to know so little.

Question regarding the impact of 4x2 vs. 4x4 and GVWR. My impression from reviewing the Ford brochure is that going to 4x4 adds 500# extra to the F350s. Ford seems to respond by increasing the GVWR for F350 Supercab SRW 4x4 by 400# while dropping the payload by 100#. My question--what does Ford do to beef up the GVWR capabilities of the F350 when they go from 4x2 to 4x4? Hope they don't simply raise the weight rating while doing nothing to the vehicle itself.

[Wrenchtraveller]

Well in the past, Ford had one GVWR for every model. The F250s were 8800 for years but of course every option on the truck adds to the weight and takes away payload. A 4X4 with it's transfer case, front differential, hubs, and extra drive shaft weighs a lot more than a 4x2.

Same with the diesel. A PSD weighes 1000 pounds versus 500 pounds for a gas V10 like mine.

A diesel 4x4 already has 1000 pounds more weight to carry around than a 4X2 gas powered truck.

Starting in 05 Ford went engine and model specific on their GVWR. The diesel got a higher rating to compensate for it's extra weight, likewise for 4x4.

It all adds to the confusion, and to be quite frank, it is really a bit of a numbers game but some of the numbers have to add up. The best example I can give you is my rear axle is rated at 7000 pounds. You have to have tires that are good for over 3500 pounds each to have that rating.
My 18 inch tires are rated at 3640.

Even the Lariat, because of all the goodies it comes with will have a smaller payload than a cheaper model. A few years ago Ford came out with F150's that could be overloaded with 6 large people in the cab and NOTHING in the box so they are attempting to correct this problem.

It all comes at a cost and Ford added over 300 pounds of weight to the Superduties in 05 to get the new GVWR ratings so it was not all gain. Not all of the figures make sense and you can spend a lot of time going over the brochures. I do know one thing after buying 8 new Ford pickups over the last 31 years...........spend 30 minutes going over the brochure and you will know more about Ford pickups than 95% of Ford Salesmen.

We bought our Honda Acord new in 02 and it felt so nice to have a salesperson that actually knew his product. When will Ford start applying this radical new concept? Take care.

[Cat320]

Bardave...you have probably not read my standard post on how to find the TRUE cargo capability of these trucks. Here is a cut and paste:

To find the true weight capability of a truck, take the "The combined weight of cargo and occupants should never exceed___ pounds," from the sticker on the pillar, on the left rear door, entitled "Tire and Loading Information." That is the maximum weight you can put in your truck...cargo, pax, fuel, hitch, tools, etc. It will be a few pounds different for every truck.

This is the actual weight that truck can carry...don't believe the pretty brochures or the shipping weight or certainly not the salesman.

[sreigle]

Bardave, the difference in the 2005/2006 F250/F350 is the F350 has an extra leaf (an overload leaf) on the rear springs and a rear stabilizer bar. Both are available on the F250 as part of the "Camper Package", which is for the slidein camper. We don't have the camper package so used airbags to provide the extra springing. I haven't seen numbers with the camper package onboard but since the axle, bearings, and brakes are the same part numbers on both models I would think the camper package would add to the GVWR. I'm not sure they actually increase the numbers, though, officially. I've seen an F250 with the camper package and the springs and stabilizer bar were the same as our previous Ford, a 2003 F350 SRW.

See another Montana or Mountaineer on the road? Flash lights twice, it might be one of us!
Steve Reigle (pronounced Regal)
Fulltiming since 3/21/03
'03 3295RK
'05 Ford F250 SD Lariat CC SB 6.0L PSD/TS FX4 4x4

Our RV Travels (now Firefox-compatible)

[steves]

My 06 F350,6.0 diesel, SRW, 4x4, CC, LB, 7.3 axel, Camper Package, 18" wheels has a GVWR of 11,500 and a GCWR of 23,000. My 3400 weights fall within those ratings

Steve & Betty
2005 3400RL Montana
2006 F350 PSD SRW CC LB 4X4 King Ranch

[sreigle]

David, I don't know how much this affects the GVWR but the 4x4 F250/F350 for 2005 and later have a much larger, much stronger front suspension including the control arms from the F450/F550. The 4x2 retains the older twin I-beam suspension. I just had the front end alignment checked on my 4x4 a week ago while in Fredericksburg, VA (Bennett's Front End Service or something like that). He told me this is one very strong, very good frontend. He offered that. I didn't ask. Looking at my tire wear at 62k miles I believe him. I don't know if front end strength has any impact on GVWR or not but it might since some of the payload weight rides on the frontend.

See another Montana or Mountaineer on the road? Flash lights twice, it might be one of us!
Steve Reigle (pronounced Regal)
Fulltiming since 3/21/03
'03 3295RK
'05 Ford F250 SD Lariat CC SB 6.0L PSD/TS FX4 4x4

Our RV Travels (now Firefox-compatible)

[Cat320]

Bottom line:

-GVWR is what it says on the sticker on the driver's door.

-Cargo capacity is the the "The combined weight of cargo and occupants should never exceed___pounds," from the sticker on the pillar, on the left rear door.

[steves]

Cargo capacity number is now on the GVWR sticker and for my F350 load capacity is rated at 3,667. Additionally, front axles are rated for 6,000 and the rear axle are rated at 7,000

Steve & Betty
2005 3400RL Montana
2006 F350 PSD SRW CC LB 4X4 King Ranch

[David and Jo-Anna]

Steve--that's interesting. Was that cargo capacity number on the same sticker as the GVWR, or on the tire load sticker?

According to the Ford brochure I'm looking at, the manual transmission version of the F350 PSD SRW CC LB 4x4, without other options, would be 4000#. Do you have auto transmission? If so, that probably drops your cargo capacity 200# or so according to my Ford dealer. Any other significant options you have that would account for the remaining 133# difference between the cargo capacity on your sticker and the capacity listed in the Ford brochure?

Maybe the Ford brochures are in fact pretty close to the mark with their listed cargo capacities, even though they don't tell you the weights of the various options that are going to reduce that capacity. Hey, doesn't that sound like Montana's practice as well?

David and Jo-Anna Kikel

[steves]

Yes - that number is off the same GCWR sticker. I do have an automatic, as well as, 18 inch wheels, camper pkg, 11,500 GVWR package, 12,500 receiver hitch and Fx4 skid plates.

Steve & Betty
2005 3400RL Montana
2006 F350 PSD SRW CC LB 4X4 King Ranch

[David and Jo-Anna]

Sounds like those additional options could account for the difference between the 3667# capacity on your sticker and the 4000# capacity listed in the Ford brochure. Even though the shipping weights on the invoices may be all screwed up, maybe we have to give some credence to the payload numbers in the Ford brochures. Just be nice if they would tell us what the options weigh.

Steve, speaking of shipping weights, any idea what shipping weight they listed on your invoice and/or title? With a GVWR of 11,500# and cargo capacity of 3667#, that would suggest a vehicle weight of 7833#. Any idea what the unloaded weight of your vehicle actually is?

David and Jo-Anna Kikel

[steves]

David.....ooops - I just check my door sticker and I was wrong on the genesis of this info. The 3667 number come from a "Tire and loading" separate sticker just below the GVWR factory sticker. Perhaps the 4,000 is the correct load as you mentioned.

I cannot find any actual weight numbers from the factory but can tell you that I have had the truck weighed at the local dump (before and after wights) and the lowest after unloading weight was 8,000.

Steve & Betty
2005 3400RL Montana
2006 F350 PSD SRW CC LB 4X4 King Ranch

[Cat320]

Sreigle..."No such sticker on any of the four doors on my Ford. I just went out and looked. The sticker on the driver's door says GVWR is 10000LB. It's a 3/4 ton. On my 2003 one ton F350 SRW GVWR was 9,900. Tow was 14,200. GCWR was 20,000. Contrast that to 10,000, 15,400, and 23,000 on this 3/4 ton. Like I said, this F250 has higher ratings than most of the 1 ton SRW trucks of 2004 and earlier vintage and many newer 1 tons. I am still over GVWR but it is not a problem. You can do as you like. I'm satisfied with the performance of mine."

Can't speak for the 2005 Fords, but the 2006s have the cargo sticker...check the left rear piller if it's not on the door. As I have stated in the past, the F250's GVWR of 10000 is very deceiving...and really is irrelevant...it's the cargo carrying capacity that is important. The F250 (and it's 10000 GVWR) actually carrys only about 100 to 150 lbs more than a 9200 GVWR Chevy 2500HD. I have put actual numbers in previous posts and will not repeat them, but I looked at a 2006 3/4 PSD CC 4x4 with the 10000 GVWR...it had a max load capability of 2507. So what you have is a very heavy truck.

[sreigle]

I'll check again tomorrow but there were no stickers with loading info on the pillars or the doors. I might have missed it somehow so will look again tomorrow. Yes, it's a heavy truck, partly because of the increase in strength over the earlier vintage F250/F350. It sure does a sweet job of towing.

See another Montana or Mountaineer on the road? Flash lights twice, it might be one of us!
Steve Reigle (pronounced Regal)
Fulltiming since 3/21/03
'03 3295RK
'05 Ford F250 SD Lariat CC SB 6.0L PSD/TS FX4 4x4

Our RV Travels (now Firefox-compatible)

[Wrenchtraveller]

David and Jo-Anna, I just went and looked at my tire and weight sticker on my 05 F350 .

It shows a maximum payload of 3782 pounds and I have an 11200 pound GVWR because my truck has the lighter gas powered V10. It is a Crew Cab Long Box 4X4 automatic Lariat.

This truck weighs 7800 pounds with me and the hitch and a full tank of fuel so that only leaves 3400 pounds for the occupents , gear, and pin weight. This payload might allow some people to tow a Montana 3400 legally but because I travel with tools , and an auxilary 50 gal tank I would need the F350 dually to feel comfortable with a 3300 pound pin weight. Keep in mind if this truck had the diesel engine it would weigh approximately 500 pounds more.

My 2955RL has a pin weight of 2600 pounds and with this I am about 120 pounds under my GVWR.

I am no fan of government auto insurance but that is what I have to live with here in British Columbia and they are on record stating overweight means no insurance. I worked too hard for the modest wealth I enjoy and there is no way I would risk losing it by pulling with a too light truck. Take care and if you really want to get a SRW , I think you can do it with the F350 and the extra weight capacity of 18" tires. Stay away from the F250 with the 17" tires.


Don & Donna
Vancouver Island
2005 Ford F350 V10 Lariat CC 4x4 LB SRW 11200 GVWR
2006 Montana 2955RL
click on the little pic to see a big pic

[David and Jo-Anna]

Don--you give me such a HEAVY feeling. LOL!!!!

Jo-Anna and I are heading up to Philadelphia tomorrow morning for a weekend of classes at the Life on Wheels conference, so see you all back on line sometime next week.

David and Jo-Anna Kikel