Get rid of the remote thermostats

[Glenn and Lorraine]

quote:Originally posted by Eric Roellig

Ed,

My understanding was that all the people that had replaced the thermostat was the older non-IR remote type. The problem with the IR remote thermostat is that the wiring is completely different and no one has figured out how or if a more conventional thermostat will work in its place...

Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

All I was suggesting is that the wiring for the IR remote could be WAY different than the old conventional. If true, then it could be really difficult to find a replacement.

Eric

Eric, you are correct. The only thermostat replacements made up to this point were of the NON-Remote type. I being one of them.
Up to this point none of the MOCers have figured out a way to replace these JUNK remote units.

What truely amazes me is Montana's claim that they read these threads and their claim that the MOCers comments are important to them and yet they do little if anything to assist us.

[mazeeff]

Camping world now sells the RVP remote as an upgrade. The RVP ComfortBeam is the same remote we have.

http://www.campingworld.com/browse/s...27169&src=SRQZ

It states that it is for a Coleman unit. I am beginning to wonder if this unit was ever intended to be used with a Duotherm! If someone is close to a camping world, perhaps they can stop in, and copy the instructions. It might give us a clue, how the unit is wired in. The camping world unit has one review, and it is 5 stars, so it must work fine with the Coleman!

[Montana_2785]

This is too funny.

I followed the Camping World link to take a look. No picture... Check the tech description. Nothing there. Check the review. The one listed is some lame comment about being able to stay in bed.

The funny part?

The reviews said that 5 of 5 people found the review "helpful".

I clicked the "No" button that it wasn't helpful. The next screen I see is that there is now one of these things in my shopping cart!!!

Eric

[Montana_2342]

I belive the message that parrothead is refering to is the early remote threads were about if you were not pointed directly at the unit when changing the remote the remote changes temperature but the thermostat doesn't and you have to point remote away from the sensor until the units are back synced at the proper temp again. I am a pretty smart guy, but I have limited free time and this is like solving a big logic puzzle which is nice if you enjoy that kind of stuff but I don't. I am not bad mouthing Montana but I would like to have something that works properly.

But even at the 10 degrees off the trip point has a greater range than I prefer and moreover, my furnace will stop blowing hot air at certain times and the red light will blink at me - why I have no idea... Regardless I am hoping that someone here will find an answer and I really appreciate all the work people are putting into finding an answer to this problem. I am certain at some point someone will arrive at a material solution much like the digital Hunter thermostats from Wal mart that worked for the older style. I wait with eager anticipation.

Barney

[Broome101]

Heard back from Brandon Tom from Keystone on my email to them concerning the thermostat. They said that the remote is very sensitive and that if you operate in I Feel mode and remote is not in area that gives good air flow than a large swing in temp may happen. Brandon went on to say if we do have large swing in temps than then sensor is not picking up true room temp, which in my case the senor is the wall unit. I have went to the wall unit as book says that the default temp in AC is 74 degrees and heat is 69 degrees and from actual room temp and what defaults are there is about 10 degrees diff. In saying that the remotes may not be the problem it may be the wall senor that is the issue.

[Broome101]

Tuesday, February 15, 2005

Dear Mr. Broome,

We have just reviewed your email sent Sunday, February 13, 2005. The system
itself has a very sensitive electronics so a large swing in temperature
normally indicate that the sensing location isn't picking up the true
average room temperature. The temperature swing referred to could be from
having the "I Feel" button depressed on the remote. The receiver that is
mounted on the wall is where the temperature is normally sensed by the
system. Montana units are normally toward the center of the unit on an
inside wall. However, if the "I Feel" button on the remote is depressed the
sensing mechanism is now the remote control itself. If the remote is out of
the air flow (in a drawer, night stand in the bedroom etc.) the temperature
swing could be dramatic. Please check this and let me know what you find.
You are the eyes and ears in the field so to speak. Your comments, both
positive and negative are welcome as they will help Keystone build more
practical, reliable, and user friendly products.

Thank you for your time and input,

Keystone Owner Relations

Brandon Tom
Owner Relations
Keystone RV Company

[Broome101]

Just thought I would try posting his email from Outlook, i guess it worked, so you can see Keystone's reply. I got a new remote today from dealer just got back from camper after letting it run today now I have only 6 degree swing in heat, cannot speak about AC since it's too cold for it to work properly. Has anyone tried the auotchange mode yet and does it work in switching from heat to air?

[BillE]

Eric: I think you are right. The wall unit is the interface, but can't normal stats also be considered the same. It's only a trigger to tell the AC or furnace to do it's thing? Guess that's all one big question.

I looked more at the furnace thermostat connection AT the furnace. It's just the regular 2 wires that would go to a stat. I think the magic happens when it goes in the AC box and then out.

Another thought, the way I think it is supposed to work is like the way new cars/trucks have 'climate control.' Set it and forget it.

I do agree with MB3...I'll buy a new whatever without any Keystone involvement. Just please tell me how to.

Oh, the part number (on mine at least) is 3308448.004. I went to the various Dometic sites and plugged that number in. Came back with no results.

Bill

[OntMont]

quote:Originally posted by Broome101
[br Has anyone tried the auotchange mode yet and does it work in switching from heat to air?

It works, in a way. Problem is that if you set the A/C for say, 75 degrees, and at night the temp drops below that, the furnace will come on. There is no "null zone" where neither heat nor air operate. I had thought this would be one positive feature of this system, but it does not operate in a manner that I consider practical.

Another point that I noticed on re-reading the instuction sheet is that the remote and wall unit only communicate at 2 minute intervals, that means the furnace or A/C could be running for up to two minutes after the set point temperature is reached.

[Parrothead]

That reply from Keystone sounds like a lot of spin to me and also shows they are not ready to face up to this problem or are not reading our posts. Tom Brandon was the same person who replied to me about installing a washer dryer in the 3400 and told me there was nothing that needed to be done to floor. He was very wrong.

[Kimmrg]

UPDATE: Here's whats happening to us just now. Turns out our furnace is a Dometic remote and an Atwood furnace. Talked to our dealer, they told us to go to another dealer, not a Montana dealer in Dothan, AL about 16 miles from us. I said if we have to pack it up, might as well go another 50 miles back to the dealer. Kinda felt like we were getting the run around...or to be fair, maybe they were trying to save us a trip that far.
Then I called Montana and yes I was nice. I told them about the problems, the not working when below 40 degrees outside, the bench failure of the unit, the fixing of said unit, the not working of the unit, the two trips to the dealer and now the grinding noise and no heat at all. They were very nice, but Montana (Keystone) sent me to the ATWOOD furnace customer service.
Atwood asked me if I was ordering parts and I said "No, I just want my furnace fixed." They gave me the name of a RV and Marine Dealer in Dothan. I asked if they could replace my furnace under warranty to Keystone and the gentleman said, "Well, they are an authorized dealer..." Back to square one.
Called Montana back and they sent me back to our dealer, but they were very nice about it.
Called our dealer and tried to schedule an appointment to come in...got the "oh, yeah we have heard about this problem, you have talked to us before..." and now they have to call me back tomorrow to schedule an appointment.
Gosh I can't wait.

[Glenn and Lorraine]

Well Kim look at all the exercise you're getting from all this "run around".

Well at least your dialing finger is getting exercised.

[rldriver]

Might as well add my two cents worth to this thread. We took our first trip in our new Montana 2 weeks ago and had nothing but problems with our remote for the furnace. I tried "I feel" and set it on the table in the evening (no sun on it) and set it for 75 deg. It must have got down to 65 deg before it started the furnace and then it got so hot we had to strip down, now that is a scary sight.

I tried it with out the "I feel" setting and could not get it to operate at all with out setting it to a very hot setting. With out the remote the furnace will not maintain a temperature of 68 deg. I checked it's room temperature reading against another unit and it looks about right, plus or minus 2 deg.

I am more than willing to install an after market thermostat if and when some one comes up with a decent replacement. All I ask is the ability to set the temperature that I want and forget it. Am I asking too much?

There, I said it

[Montana_657]

Although I feel your pain the neighbors have a Montana with such a thermostat...

Should I pull the blinds or grab a camera????

You paint an interesting...ugly???? ....well.....interesting picture.

Ah well, all will be well till the next cold snap.

[Montana_2785]

Having a 2002 rig, I don't have to worry about the new thermostat. But, I have this vision of dozens (or hundreds) of Montana's circling around Dometic's corporate headquarters looking for someone who can show them how to operate it

Eric

[Broome101]

Well after many calls and emails to Keystone I got an unexpected call from Dometic today. the guy's name was Gary ? was very nice and understanding. At this point he sayd they have been able to get them working by swithcing out a few things. He is sending me a new interface which is the wall unti itself to try and remote. We will wait for it to come and try again.

[Parrothead]

Broome 101
Did you happen to mention there were lots of us having a problem?

[Broome101]

OH YESS they are aware, Keystone has made them very aware of this thread.

[OntMont]

quote:Originally posted by Broome101

OH YESS they are aware, Keystone has made them very aware of this thread.

I hope that they are also aware that the A/C to heat auto change over is pretty useless as it is presently programmed. (Heat and A/C come on and off at same temperature setting. Should be a null zone between them where neither operates.

Glad to hear though that our message seems to getting to where it counts. I'm sure Keystone has a lot more clout with Dometic than any or all of us!

If you overlook the fact that a remote thermostat is unnecessary in the first place, the main difficulties with the sysem are these(as I see it anyway):

1. The set point temperatures in the remotes and wall units are inaccurate, generally off by about 10 degrees F.

2. The auto change over feature does not allow for a null zone where neither unit operates.

3. The line of sight requirement for the remote limits its usefulness to only the living area, not bed room or bath room where it might have some usefulness.

4. It lacks any capability to program different day/night temperatures.

It seems like someone at Dometic got so fascinated by the technology, that they forgot about the functionality.

[Kimmrg]

Update 2 - Back to the dealer we go on Tuesday of next week. Wish us luck!