did you hear?

[jeffba]

Where we go for our October trip, is a place that has real nice cabins and some RV sites. Last year we had the RV portion to ourselves. This year we barely found a site.

[DebNJim B]

Fellow member of our golf league who's wife passed away in Feb had decided not to camp anymore w/o her. Put his 5er and tv up for sale and the first looker paid him his asking price for the package, which he had set high to give room to bargain.
Another member is a partner in a large local RV, boat and swimming pool dealership. He told me they are backlogged for pool installs, nearly out of boats, and running low on RV's. Sales are the highest in the co.'s 45 years. Having a terrible time getting both boats and RV's from the factory, plus it's compounded by their suppliers and venders running behind demand.
If I was just in this for the investment, I'd sell my rig now and wait two years to buy a used one. But alas, I want to camp.

[Donsantell]

Originally Posted by Charlie 3931fb

Hi All,

Was told today by my salesman at CW that there is now going to be a 3 to 5 month wait on new Montana's coming out of the factory. They are working on a 100 day back log. Hope nobody has order a trailer from keystone. Might be a little while to receive your unit.

Sorry to bring you all the bad news.

Could just be a sales gimmick to give you a sense of urgency.

[Donsantell]

In Looking at both Montana and Alpine 5th wheels, I can’t see much of a difference. Is there something I am missing? What is the difference besides the name?

[Carl n Susan]

Originally Posted by Donsantell

Could just be a sales gimmick to give you a sense of urgency.

I don't think so. I was at my dealer yesterday. I asked the owner how it was going. His response "Great but we are burned out". They have had more customers then ever before and the staff is worn out dealing with them. The worst problem, for him, is their lot is almost empty. They have nothing to sell. The factories (not just Montana) are just opening up. The first priority is the rigs in the build queue when they shut down. Then the orders from last March (and later) that were held up. An order today is going to have a longer than normal wait before the RV arrives. Fortunately for my dealer, they had a bunch of stock rigs ordered in early March so they think they will be better off in a month or two.

[Paperthreads]

We ordered outs on June 13. It came off the production line on August 5. And now it sits in Elkhart, because they can’t get items from other manufacturers. We have no idea how much longer the wait will be, we don’t even know what’s missing, because our dealer can’t seem to get an answer. They also have been terrible at communicating with us. We have to call repeatedly just to finally get any kind of information. Frustrating- yes. Understand that this is happening because of manufacturing being shut down, I get that part. What I don’t get is why they can’t communicate to their customers. Hoping to have it by Oct. as we plan on taking it for a month to Texas in November- and want to make sure we have done a couple shakedown trips first.

[Bob and Jeannette]

I ordered an air conditioner and was told that I just missed them. This was a month ago. I wanted a Dometic Blizzard NXT to match my front and rear. So I am waiting but also hoping that nothing brakes on my existing ones.

[Montana Man]

I just sold an 08 toyhauler yesterday to the first one that looked at it. He drove about 200 miles to look at it and has seen what little inventory there was between us. 5 days from listing it.

[lightsout]

Originally Posted by Donsantell

In Looking at both Montana and Alpine 5th wheels, I can’t see much of a difference. Is there something I am missing? What is the difference besides the name?

Alpines are Wide Body providing a few more inches in width. additionally they are built with a few higher end finishes than the Montana. The major difference is width. Construction quality is still the same shoddy workmanship as the Montana.

[Montana Man]

Originally Posted by lightsout

Alpines are Wide Body providing a few more inches in width. additionally they are built with a few higher end finishes than the Montana. The major difference is width. Construction quality is still the same shoddy workmanship as the Montana.

My experience is different. Our friends bought an Alpine the same day we got our Monty. Perhaps our legacy package upped the game a bit but theirs has nothing on ours and has been maintenance intense, moreso than ours. Alpine has the two piece tanks (which busted numerous times) ours has the rotomold tanks. Alpine brand X tires, ours GY. Alpine rotoflex pin box, ours MorRyde.

The level of build quality seems similar.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by Paperthreads

We ordered outs on June 13. It came off the production line on August 5. And now it sits in Elkhart, because they can’t get items from other manufacturers. We have no idea how much longer the wait will be, we don’t even know what’s missing, because our dealer can’t seem to get an answer. They also have been terrible at communicating with us. We have to call repeatedly just to finally get any kind of information. Frustrating- yes. Understand that this is happening because of manufacturing being shut down, I get that part. What I don’t get is why they can’t communicate to their customers. Hoping to have it by Oct. as we plan on taking it for a month to Texas in November- and want to make sure we have done a couple shakedown trips first.

Hopefully you get your rig in time to make those shakedown trips. As far as shortages of who knows what;

Got home from FL on 8/4, walked in and knew something was amiss; the fridge had stopped sometime quite a while back (we had been gone over 3 months). Immediately started to find one - none, backordered etc. I'm thinking what the heck? Toilet paper and now fridges??

After a day of looking and calling we got a tip from our neighbor about a small appliance store in a small town. Went there and they had ONE fridge similar to what I needed so bought it. We had a long talk about the lack of availability. The shutdown has affected nearly every facet of everyday life which then affects almost every facet of product production and delivery. He advised that the extended unemployment, which was more than many of the folks made that produced or delivered these items, kept many of the workers home when the businesses started opening back up. This he said, was told to him by multiple suppliers. So everyone sits in the dark. A similar story was told to me by CW when I took my trailer in for repair last week - they will assess it but have no idea when they can promise to have it out because parts may or may not come in.

I figure the above is why Keystone has no idea what is going on in the production of the units. When they depend on dozens of independent suppliers who themselves depend on other manufacturers and none of them, including the manufacturer knows when and how many they can produce of what.....everyone sits around in the dark and does just what the business owner told me...."we hope" it's getting better. Not a good deal for anyone but as the owner told me I too "hope" it's going to get better for all our sakes.

[lightsout]

Originally Posted by Montana Man

My experience is different. Our friends bought an Alpine the same day we got our Monty. Perhaps our legacy package upped the game a bit but theirs has nothing on ours and has been maintenance intense, moreso than ours. Alpine has the two piece tanks (which busted numerous times) ours has the rotomold tanks. Alpine brand X tires, ours GY. Alpine rotoflex pin box, ours MorRyde.

The level of build quality seems similar.

Sorry to Burst your bubble but the Alpine is considered the higher end Brand (that is a very loose term as Keystone does not make anything "high end"), with that said the legacy changes that a bit but the Alpine also has the Legacy option available. The Wide Body is the main difference and the Alpine also has solid wood Stiles like the legacy amoung a few other nuances. The Alpines to sell for more than the Montanas. The 2019 Alpine we actually made an offer on had the Saliun Tires and the Rotomolded tanks. There is very little between the brands, that are made in the same plant by the same people. The Alpine was to compete with Grand Designs wide body' 5er's.

[Bob and Jeannette]

Originally Posted by lightsout

Sorry to Burst your bubble but the Alpine is considered the higher end Brand (that is a very loose term as Keystone does not make anything "high end"), with that said the legacy changes that a bit but the Alpine also has the Legacy option available. The Wide Body is the main difference and the Alpine also has solid wood Stiles like the legacy amoung a few other nuances. The Alpines to sell for more than the Montanas. The 2019 Alpine we actually made an offer on had the Saliun Tires and the Rotomolded tanks. There is very little between the brands, that are made in the same plant by the same people. The Alpine was to compete with Grand Designs wide body' 5er's.

Alpine starting price is $15,000 less and 300 pounds less?

[AZ Traveler]

When we bought a couple of years back the Alpine was less expensive than the Montana. They had different floor plans and most had dishwashers but otherwise they were very similar.

[Montana Man]

Originally Posted by lightsout

Sorry to Burst your bubble but the Alpine is considered the higher end Brand (that is a very loose term as Keystone does not make anything "high end"), with that said the legacy changes that a bit but the Alpine also has the Legacy option available. The Wide Body is the main difference and the Alpine also has solid wood Stiles like the legacy amoung a few other nuances. The Alpines to sell for more than the Montanas. The 2019 Alpine we actually made an offer on had the Saliun Tires and the Rotomolded tanks. There is very little between the brands, that are made in the same plant by the same people. The Alpine was to compete with Grand Designs wide body' 5er's.

Perhaps we are speaking about a difference in model years. Our units are 2015/16. Your comparison may be different model years. The Alpine had awnings that actually flew off going 60. I saw it in my mirror and radioed to him to pull over. The siding on the Alpine has fiberglass fibers you can actually see. Sun fading really brings that out even more. My Monty has a smooth high gloss finish that is visually superior. The Alpine "listed" for many thousands less for comparable size and options. And, the weight of the Alpine is significantly less which tells me they made up for that in places you can't see. If a few inches of width is so great, neither of us even noticed it. I'll have to look into that now. Perhaps the 2019 Alpine is now equal to at least a 2016 Monty, I don't know.

If the Alpine is considered the higher end model, who is making that determination?

[Rondo]

lightsout-- Alpines ARE NOT MADE in the same plants as the Montana's. They are a totally separate brand from Montana and are made in their own separate plant. They were a few years ago a competitor with Montana and the company was started by two of the Montana engineers that left the company. Thor has bought both of them and they are now both part of the Keystone brand. I don't understand, if you are so down on Montana, why do you own one? You have the choice of selling your Montana and getting an SOB that you think are much better. By the way, what model and year of a Montana do you have?

[richfaa]

What Rondo said.

[R.S.O'Donnell]

Originally Posted by lightsout

Sorry to Burst your bubble but the Alpine is considered the higher end Brandthat is a very loose term as (Keystone does not make anything "high end"), with that said the legacy changes that a bit but the Alpine also has the Legacy option available. The Wide Body is the main difference and the Alpine also has solid wood Stiles like the legacy amoung a few other nuances. The Alpines to sell for more than the Montanas. The 2019 Alpine we actually made an offer on had the Saliun Tires and the Rotomolded tanks. There is very little between the brands, that are made in the same plant by the same people. The Alpine was to compete with Grand Designs wide body' 5er's.

I have to disagree....

We stayed in our sons Radiance R-28QD for two months while we transitioned from our class C to our 3121rl.

The best comparison I can make is:
Our Montana is the Waldorf and the Radiance is a Motel 6.

I'm not talking features and space.... I'm talking build quality.

It was a horrid thing. Thin flexing floors, plastic sinks and toilet, doors that were much smaller than the frame that wouldn't stay shut, plastic door frame moulding, noisy air conditioners. The list goes on and on.

[R.S.O'Donnell]

Originally Posted by Montana Man

Perhaps we are speaking about a difference in model years. Our units are 2015/16. Your comparison may be different model years. The Alpine had awnings that actually flew off going 60. I saw it in my mirror and radioed to him to pull over. The siding on the Alpine has fiberglass fibers you can actually see. Sun fading really brings that out even more. My Monty has a smooth high gloss finish that is visually superior. The Alpine "listed" for many thousands less for comparable size and options. And, the weight of the Alpine is significantly less which tells me they made up for that in places you can't see. If a few inches of width is so great, neither of us even noticed it. I'll have to look into that now. Perhaps the 2019 Alpine is now equal to at least a 2016 Monty, I don't know.

If the Alpine is considered the higher end model, who is making that determination?

Totally agree. You can hide lots of cut corners but the weight will give it away.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OA1vmN-skXo

[Baldicon]

Originally Posted by sourdough

Hopefully you get your rig in time to make those shakedown trips. As far as shortages of who knows what;

Got home from FL on 8/4, walked in and knew something was amiss; the fridge had stopped sometime quite a while back (we had been gone over 3 months). Immediately started to find one - none, backordered etc. I'm thinking what the heck? Toilet paper and now fridges??

After a day of looking and calling we got a tip from our neighbor about a small appliance store in a small town. Went there and they had ONE fridge similar to what I needed so bought it. We had a long talk about the lack of availability. The shutdown has affected nearly every facet of everyday life which then affects almost every facet of product production and delivery. He advised that the extended unemployment, which was more than many of the folks made that produced or delivered these items, kept many of the workers home when the businesses started opening back up. This he said, was told to him by multiple suppliers. So everyone sits in the dark. A similar story was told to me by CW when I took my trailer in for repair last week - they will assess it but have no idea when they can promise to have it out because parts may or may not come in.

I figure the above is why Keystone has no idea what is going on in the production of the units. When they depend on dozens of independent suppliers who themselves depend on other manufacturers and none of them, including the manufacturer knows when and how many they can produce of what.....everyone sits around in the dark and does just what the business owner told me...."we hope" it's getting better. Not a good deal for anyone but as the owner told me I too "hope" it's going to get better for all our sakes.

Ordered a refrigerator early May from Lowes, was told should be in in 14 days. Still waiting on it. Fortunately ours still cools, but manually have to defrost. And, the aggravating thing is there is zero communications from Lowes. And most of the time we call, they don't answer.