5 Slide Out 5er with 3/4 Ton Truck - Montana Owners Club

timandsusan · 10-05-2011, 01:21 AM

The day before we left Asheville, NC, a Landmark 5er with 5 slide outs and doors on the drivers and passenger sides pulled in. It was from OK and pulled by a 2500 GMC crew cab with 5 adults. It had to be 40 feet long and looked great with a full paint job. Lots of RV for a 2500 especially with 5 adults. I could not find a floor plan on the Internet. It basically looked like a 3400 with an extra slide out in the bedroom and the second door on the driver side just behind the bedroom. I will stick with my Monty.

HOOK · 10-05-2011, 02:22 AM

Years ago, there was an advertisement in most Airstream info. showing Wally Byam towing an A/S with a bicycle. Obviously possible. My question was and remains today, is it more important to move it, or to control it in any situation? Larry

BB_TX · 10-05-2011, 04:55 AM

We live near a highway that carries a lot of RV traffic. I am constantly amazed at how many 250/2500's I see towing some of the largest and heaviest 5ers made.

Phil P · 10-05-2011, 05:29 AM

Hi

KZ makes a unit like that. It is 42.7 feet long and the GVWR is 19,000 lbs.

Phil P

Art-n-Marge · 10-05-2011, 07:26 AM

Ratings don't mean much to many people. A few years ago I read two different articles that declared that approximately 40% of RVs (I don't recall they distinguished what types) are above their weight ratings. I don't remember the source, but that number has always stuck in my mind and was used as my inspiration to investigate where I stood and found I was one of the 40%. Since then, I fixed this problem and know enough not to do this again. There is an admission from the tow vehicle manufacturers to be conservative on their ratings to improve safety, but because of this many have discounted the ratings altogether.

Then listen to folks who post in favor that "they aren't having any problems", or "you should be just fine" when others ask for advice instead of stating what's considered safe. They base much of their approval because they haven't had a problem that they can attribute or they just say they can do this because the engine and transmission are rough and tough and can tow trains.

There are so many other factors to consider besides the engine & transmission so I won't even list them since I have many times. But I do know people who have had difficulties and ignore the fact it could have been from abuse and they'll get rid of "that piece of junk" and then buy something bigger to replace it after the fact.

Like all the other misguided freedoms we allow in this country, towing overweight is a conscious choice and maintained by the "innocent until proven guilty" and "this isn't enforced so I haven't been caught" mentalities to justify our decisions. For me, since things can break under normal operating conditions, I try and not only stick to the ratings, but try to have some margin, too. That's my choice in this freedom loving country. A lot of my motivation is that DW learned all this along with when I did and her regard for security and safety are much higher than mine would ever be.

I'll guarantee that if more wives and family members knew the facts, then there would be far less than 40% on the roads. Many owners just don't know and are included in the angry citizens that read the story about some overweight trucker who just caused a problem, not knowing they could be next.

Believe it or not, I am not trying to be political, but I am agreeing with these posts that this is not what we'd like to see. I'm just summarizing the many stories, testimonials and posts I've read ever since I became aware of this potential issue. I do feel good that many others who asked my advice have changed their attitudes in favor of compliance than not after they learned how to understand the weight ratings. There are other things I do that might be considered over the fence (like towing with the fridge/propane on), but exceeding weight ratings will not be one of them since I haven't found a suitable alternative.

Be safe everybody.

seahunter · 10-05-2011, 08:02 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by BB_TX

We live near a highway that carries a lot of RV traffic. I am constantly amazed at how many 250/2500's I see towing some of the largest and heaviest 5ers made.

I have been wanting to ask this same question. Why do so many people get a 3/4 ton? The price difference is negligible, and your payload is higher on the one ton. If you're going to be towing a fifth wheel, why would you not want the higher payload? I'm still new to a lot of this but is there some reason why people go with the 3/4 ton?

Phil P · 10-05-2011, 08:46 AM

Quote:

quote:
I have been wanting to ask this same question. Why do so many people get a 3/4 ton? The price difference is negligible, and your payload is higher on the one ton. If you're going to be towing a fifth wheel, why would you not want the higher payload? I'm still new to a lot of this but is there some reason why people go with the 3/4 ton?

Hi

The common remark I get when I pose this question is “we don’t want to drive a truck that big” most of the time they are referring to the dual wheels. Even the one tone truck with single wheels is 1,000 or so lbs. lighter in GW that the dual wheel truck.

In Florida the motor vehicle has been declared a ”dangerous item” like a gun or sword. Like the gun or a sword the deliberate misuse of it becomes a felony. This includes operating at a weight greeter than the vehicle is rated for.

Phil P

richfaa · 10-05-2011, 08:52 AM

According to RVSEf the folks that weigh rigs better than 65% of rigs are overweight in one or more categories.

08UltraRider · 10-05-2011, 09:13 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by seahunter

I'm still new to a lot of this but is there some reason why people go with the 3/4 ton?

The reason I went with a 3/4 ton was because I couldn't fit the added width of the dually and our Jimmy into the garage at the same time.

Yes it limited our choices however we are happy with the High Country where the pin weight keeps it within the ratings of the truck.

Art-n-Marge · 10-05-2011, 09:41 AM

Tim & Nadine... I think the real question is why wouldn't you go with the 1 ton which has the same footprint as the 3/4 and provides more rear axle weight (and therefore a higher GVWR).

The only way to know for sure is to weigh each axle, then side to side and know for sure. Estimating, calculating and guessing do not work. A

08UltraRider · 10-05-2011, 10:10 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by Art-n-Marge

Tim & Nadine... I think the real question is why wouldn't you go with the 1 ton which has the same footprint as the 3/4 and provides more rear axle weight (and therefore a higher GVWR).

The only way to know for sure is to weigh each axle, then side to side and know for sure. Estimating, calculating and guessing do not work. A

The one ton fender flares make the truck wider therefore a tighter fit into the garage. I could fit one in there by itself but then I would still have the DW to live with when she was sweeping snow off her Jimmy.

All I had to go on was the factory stats before delivery but I did weigh the unit on the first outing at a self weigh station loaded and the fresh water tank full. I don't have the exact numbers in front of me but they were close to the GVWR limit on the truck with the left side of the trailer being a bit heavier than the right.

timandsusan · 10-05-2011, 10:36 AM

I have the weighed my truck full of fuel + riders as well as my Monty ready for travel. All are below the Ford Specified Limits. Yes, go to the scales--take the weights and see what you have. I heard recently that new truck regs beginning in Jan '12 will require all pick up makers to use the same method for determining load limits. Only Toyota uses the Fed Regs so far. All the rest make up their own--sound familiar.

RickW · 10-05-2011, 01:11 PM

I think the problem is lack of education on a very complex issue. A issue that does not come with simple or one size fits all type of answers. And it then gets hard for a guy to accept that he spent $45k+ on a truck and it is still not enough truck for his new palace on wheels. Throw in salesmen who will tell you that the truck you already have will pull a 18k# trailer with a 3/4 ton P/U. (KZ salesman told me that).

Why a 3/4 over a 1 ton. In my case it was because I already owned the truck. Some are also looking at the fact that the truck will be a daily driver and are wanting a softer ride for daily use. I think another reason some buy the 3/4 over the 1 ton is they figure they will only tow a very small percentage of the miles over the life of the vehicle.

With my choice of TV I have met far more of my neighbors than I ever did when I used my P/U. While most think my choice in TV is cool I some how offend a few because I know and can discuss truck & trailer weight ratings and actually know my pin and trailer weight. Some can quote the brochure for a truck/trailer but have no idea on the actual weights. When I ask them to guess the weight of my trailer loaded most guess around 12k#. They are very shocked to learn that the dry weight on the trailer exceeds their guess and the gross is almost 16k#. I have even shown a few my weight stickers on the side of the trailer as they do not believe me. I know I have far more truck than I need but when looking for a new TV last year (weight ratings was only one of MANY different reasons for choosing the Volvo), but I was determined to make sure I chose a TV that would be legal with my current or any other future trailer I may own.

richfaa · 10-05-2011, 01:16 PM

We were weighed at the Rally by RVSEF and at the service center by keystone,One of those two scales is 400lbs off as the 3400 weighed 400 lbs less at the service center. We are over on two of the LT load range E tires and we knew that..25and 50 lbs on the galley side.We are close on the GCWR as these Fords are heavy.

Parts Ed · 10-05-2011, 02:03 PM

The ride issue (especially on older trucks) has been the reason why some people get a 3/4 ton vs 1 ton. But on the new(er) vehicles that doesn't really matter as the ride quality has improved on the new trucks.

richfaa · 10-06-2011, 03:18 AM

I did not want the one ton dually.I needed the one ton dually.Looked at all the numbers and they said one ton dually. It does not fit in the garage, does not fit in most car washes, bank lanes, is a PITA to find a parking spot and as a daily driver if I used it as such..would suck.. It is however within all specs for towing this heavy 3400 and that is what we purchased it for.

mhs4771 · 10-06-2011, 03:47 AM

I guess we were just lucky. Originally went looking for an extended cab, long box 3/4 ton when we were thinking about a 5er. Couldn't find one, but the local dealer had a 1 ton dually with just about all the options we wanted and made us a better deal than ordering a 3/4 ton. So that's what we ended up with, then only upgraded to a different TT, but after several years with that SOB pile of junk TT we bought the Monty. The dually was for towing only, had a Monte Carlo for a daily driver, but the garage door is 9 ft wide so I can still get the dually in if need be and by pulling in the mirrors can get through the Bank ATMs with a few inches on each side. I'm a member of several other Forums and it amazes me to see posts of folks pulling 40 ft triple axle rigs with 3/4 ton TVs. Lately I've seen some fairly large rigs behind 1/2 ton TVs, must be those fully informed sales people claiming that they rigs can be pulled by a Smart Car. For me I'm staying with my Dually.

seahunter · 10-06-2011, 04:28 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by richfaa

I did not want the one ton dually.I needed the one ton dually.Looked at all the numbers and they said one ton dually. It does not fit in the garage, does not fit in most car washes, bank lanes, is a PITA to find a parking spot and as a daily driver if I used it as such..would suck.. It is however within all specs for towing this heavy 3400 and that is what we purchased it for.

Thats what I did basically. I had a lot of trailer dealers ask "what are you going to be towing this with?" and I thought doesn't it make more sense to pick out our trailer and then decide what we NEED to tow it with? Then I went to the tow guide and it said a crew cab can pull 15,700 in an F-350. That's almost exactly the weight of the trailer. It would "work", but I thought why get a truck that is right at being maxed out for towing capability right out of the gate. The DRW is 21,500 towing capacity AND has over 2,000 pound increase in payload. I felt like it would be safer to go with the DRW 350 because that is what the numbers indicate.

RickW · 10-06-2011, 04:49 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by mhs4771

I'm a member of several other Forums and it amazes me to see posts of folks pulling 40 ft triple axle rigs with 3/4 ton TVs.

It is amazing how many of those setups exists today. Those are also the ones who typically want to give me crap for my choice in Truck. I meet a guy this past June. As we talked we learned we only lived about 10 miles from each other back home but were 1500 miles from home at the time. He was pulling a triple axle toy hauler with a 18k# gross with a 08 F250. His complaints were the lack of power his truck had even after several performance upgrades. He blew up the motor in the truck on the way home. He was thinking HDT now is looking at Class A DP. He needs to learn it is not about speed, it is all about safety.

Quote:

quote:Lately I've seen some fairly large rigs behind 1/2 ton TVs, must be those fully informed sales people claiming that they rigs can be pulled by a Smart Car. For me I'm staying with my Dually.

Let me guess most seem to be Toyota Tundras. I am looking for a new daily driver and just so happened to stop and look at Toyota's yesterday. The salesman was quick to point out that the truck could pull 10k#. (If you actually read the litature it is actually 9k# trailer with 1k# worth people/stuff). But like most salesman he was quick to point out the "cool" stuff and was stumped when asked a technical question. They have learned to sell the bright and shinny and not what will actually get the job done.

ols1932 · 10-06-2011, 08:03 AM

When we decided to buy our Montana in 2000 I knew I was going to have to pull it with the F-250. I also knew it should be at least a 350 but didn't have the money. I can pull all right but I have to be very careful knowing it will be more difficult to stop. Dealers who tell buyers they can pull these big rigs with a 3/4-ton truck don't even think about whether or not you're going to be able to stop.

My advice: Go with the biggest truck you can afford.

Orv

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