50A Cheater Box

[bsmeaton]

Here is a slick way to get 50A service for your Monty when only 30A is available. If the pedestal is provided with a standard outlet and the 30A, this combines them.

http://www.tweetys.com/index.asp?Pag...OD&ProdID=6765

[4 beader]

That is extremely cool, thanks so much for the tip. I have never seen anything like this before... but it makes sense: 30amp + 20amp = 50amp !!

[Capt Kidd]

Hate to rain on anyones parade but I don't think it works like that. What I think happens is that you have 30 amps coming to the pedistal and the twenty amp comes off that. Adding the two together will still only give you 30 amps.

[TLightning]

Some CGs have a sign (with photo) saying not to use that gadget.

[bsmeaton]

Why....those dirty rats!

[ols1932]

quote:Originally posted by Capt Kidd

Hate to rain on anyones parade but I don't think it works like that. What I think happens is that you have 30 amps coming to the pedistal and the twenty amp comes off that. Adding the two together will still only give you 30 amps.

I think if you check out the circuitry you'll find that it is wired such that you do indeed have 50-amp power.

Orv

[carlson]

I think it depends on the size wire that they wire the boxes with.
It the power post has it own meter then the wire is probably properly sized to do it.
If a group of power post run off one meter a distance away, then it may not be.
I think it is important to look at the voltage.

[bsmeaton]

I posted similar on RV.net and got a lot of feedback about GFI issues as well. May not be such a great product unless you knew how the CG was wired.

[bncinwv]

I have a similar model (CW) and rv.net is correct. If the 20 amp feed at the pedestal is equipped with a GFCI, the contraption will not work. Don't know why, but every 30 amp campground I have been at so far has GFCI equipped 20 amp receptacles. Live and Learn.
Bingo

[bsmeaton]

It's called a Cheater Box Bingo - does that just re-enforce that "cheaters" never prosper?

[bncinwv]

Now c'mon Brad, I paid for the electricity with the site. Even when I am not "cheating" with the "cheater" box, I am still using both the 30 and the 20 amp receptacles. 30 amp to the rig, 20 amp to extension cord with multi-switch under the rid to feed basement television, garish hanging globe lights, etc. etc. LOL.
Bingo

[ols1932]

quote:Originally posted by bsmeaton

I posted similar on RV.net and got a lot of feedback about GFI issues as well. May not be such a great product unless you knew how the CG was wired.

Brad,
The feedback you got about the GFI receptacle is correct. This unit absolutely will not work with GFI. GFI circuitry looks for an imbalance between the lines and when you connect up this unit you have an imbalance. It doesn't take much of an imbalance--something around about 5 millivolts.

Orv

[MacDR50]

Long time since I studied electrical tech. If they have a single wire feed to that pillar and it is protected by a 30 amp circuit breaker I believe you can plug in all the "Cheaters" you want and it will still blow at 30 amps. Now I suppose that some CG's run two circuits to a pillar but I haven't seen this at any CG I have been in except where one pillar feeds two sites. Also current flow would be evened out across the two circuits unless you draw on them with separate loads. Before you draw 50 amps the 20 amp circuit should blow. I am going to dig out my basic electrical book and check this one out further. This sounds like a definite risky proposition.

[G McCall]

I am not wired for 50 AMP but.......for us 30 AMP folks..
ANOTHER CHEATER method I use is that I installed another outlet to the side of my trailer and ran wire from that outlet to a receptacle next to my bath sink. I make that receptacle hot by running a seperate HD chord from the 20 AMP reptacle (own its on breaker)on my 70 Amp RV BOX at my deer lease. That receptacle is seperate from my trailer 30 amp circuitry. We run hair dryers and space heaters off this extra receptacle. May not be able to do that everywhere.

[MacDR50]

Ok You have one 240 volt 3 wire plus ground feeding the pillar. You take one hot and run it through a 20 amp breaker and then combine it with the neutral at the receptacle. Try to pull more than 20 amps through that wire and the breaker trips. This controls the total wattage available to the trailer to (ignoring resistance) 120X20=2400 or enough to run a toaster oven and the lights. If the DW switches on her hair dryer pop goes the breaker. Now take the other hot through a 30amp breaker and combine it with neutral at the breaker and you now have 120x30=3600 watts. Now if you take the two hots and neutral and recombine them in a single receptacle you have 240 volts. The question is do you now have 240X50=12,000 watts available? Any electricians here that can answer that question. If the answer is yes then I can see why CG's would not be happy with a device that could see a trailer eat a lot more power. They pay for electricity in kilowatt hours.

BTW the circuits have to be separate and not GFCI protected.

http://www.progressiveindustries.net/ADT230.asp

[SlickWillie]

Why would a 30 amp rv panel have 240 volt supply? The 30 amp wire is merely hot/neutral/ground. The two plugs (20 & 30 amp) would have to be out of phase to get the 240 volts.

[Exnavydiver]

We are presently at Skidaway State park in Savannah Ga. We have a 30 amp service, but the pedestal has two 30 amp outlets. I checked with park maintenance and was told that they have two separate circuits (legs) in each post. I am using one of the so-called cheaters and it works fine. Have checked all GFIs all work fine, used Wiggans on post, rig, and all outlets. Everything checks out fine, I don't see what the problem is. I lit off everything in the rig to see if it would work. the only problem I had was trying to run the Micro and a toaster at the same time on the same circuit. The CG service handles everything fine with the cheater. Without the cheater I dropped the load right after the second AC came online... Dave and Betsy

[kmh3212]

Exnavy diver. I live in Georgia and as the state updates the older tate park scampgraounds 2 30A plugs will be everyhwere in GA. Some of the sites also have 50A and a 30A along with 20A. I have used on of these cheater boxes for years with no problems at all. These boxes cost about $75.

[mtheo]

To answer the question about a 50 amp service, is that it is wired with two legs, 50 amps on each leg. 120 volts x 50 amps and 120 volts x50 amps or a 50 amp 240 volt circuit. A 30 amp service has one leg with 30 amps, 120 volts x 30 amps. Most but not all parks use one 30 amp curuit for the 30 amp plug and one 20 amp plug on the same curcuit. If the 30 and 20 are on differnt cuircts then you end up with 120 volts x 30 amps one leg and 120 volts x 20 amps on the other leg. You still don't end up with 50 amps.
If your trailer is wired with 50 amp plug, most have a good share of electrical demand of the trailer on one curuit and the 2nd A/C and the washer/dryer on the other curuit, with maybe the bedroom plugs.
Not sure if that made sense to anybody but me,but I tried.

[bsmeaton]

Your explanation makes perfect sense Mark.

Now my first Montana had one 30A X 120VAC and one 20A X 120VAC circuit with a 50A plug and they called that 50A service back then (2003). In fact it was an expensive option. I think that would be the standard configuration expected from this box.

50A - 120VAC early Montanas
50A - 240VAC newer Montanas

does that terminology sound right? I never understood how to say it.