Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 

Go Back   Montana Owners Club - Keystone Montana 5th Wheel Forum > GENERAL DISCUSSIONS > General Discussions about our Montanas
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 10-05-2022, 05:46 PM   #21
Camp CA
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: Bencia
Posts: 484
M.O.C. #25828
Disconnect the battery and you are good.
 
__________________
2020 Montana 3780RL fifth wheel
2016 F-350 6.7L Diesel Crew Cab Long Bed DRW
Camp CA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2022, 06:33 PM   #22
Lrazzano
Established Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2022
Location: Hubbard
Posts: 15
M.O.C. #30831
Yes, I don't have it in the convenience center.
Lrazzano is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2022, 08:57 AM   #23
rames14
Montana Master
 
rames14's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Livermore
Posts: 4,840
M.O.C. #1920
Foldbak, by code the brake disconnect always has power to it. I would bet there are other loads such as propane detector’s that also run. I have not tried it, but check a few circuits with the battery switch off. You maybe surprised.
__________________
Ron and Terrie Ames with Sirius - MOC #1920
2021Montana 3230CK Super Solar Legacy Package
2021 Ram 3500 Laramie Longhorn, BIM Charging
4x4, SRW, LB, Crew Cab, Pullrite 3900 Hitch
rames14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2022, 09:35 AM   #24
Foldbak
Montana Master
 
Foldbak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2022
Location: Shingle Springs
Posts: 820
M.O.C. #30417
You are correct however the breakaway switch is a no load circuit in the normally open position. Therefor no drain. See below. The only thing connected to the positive side of the batteries before the disconnect switch is the (no load) breakaway switch and the positive side of the auxiliary solar port which if a panel were connected would charge the batteries. So there is no drain with both inverter and battery disconnect switches off. Now if the positive side of the battery were corroded to the battery case there would be a drain to ground.



__________________
Tony & Donna
2022 Montana High Country 295RL, Solar Flex 400, Onan 3600 LPG, 2000 Dimensions inverter
2020 GMC Denali 2500 6.6 Duramax, Demco 21K Auto Slide
Foldbak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2022, 10:41 AM   #25
mhs4771
Montana Master
 
mhs4771's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Sebring
Posts: 3,508
M.O.C. #9969
I will agree the Break-a-Way switch is a no load, but good friends thought it was OK to pull the pin and leave it out. Couldn't understand why their batteries were dead, but before the batteries totally died they burnt the contacts destroying the switch.
__________________
Michelle & Ann
2018 Chevy 3500HD High Country DRW 4X4 Crew Cab w/Duramax/Allison, Formally 2010 Montana 2955RL, Now Loaded 2016 SOB, Mor/ryde IS, Disc Brakes & Pin Box, Comfort Ride Hitch, Sailun 17.5 Tires.
mhs4771 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2022, 01:51 PM   #26
Foldbak
Montana Master
 
Foldbak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2022
Location: Shingle Springs
Posts: 820
M.O.C. #30417
Quote:
Originally Posted by mhs4771 View Post
I will agree the Break-a-Way switch is a no load, but good friends thought it was OK to pull the pin and leave it out. Couldn't understand why their batteries were dead, but before the batteries totally died they burnt the contacts destroying the switch.
Wow! They should check the brakes. They probably damaged the magnets or melted some wiring.
__________________
Tony & Donna
2022 Montana High Country 295RL, Solar Flex 400, Onan 3600 LPG, 2000 Dimensions inverter
2020 GMC Denali 2500 6.6 Duramax, Demco 21K Auto Slide
Foldbak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2022, 02:20 PM   #27
Carl n Susan
Site Team
 
Carl n Susan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Carmichael - CA
Posts: 6,426
M.O.C. #4831
Thanks Foldbak, your pic answers a lot of questions. I had heard references to a "Giggy Box" but didn't really know what it is. It seems to be an new feature in 2022 and newer models and replaces the old almost disconnect switch in the convenience center along with the auto reset breakers and wiring on the back wall of the battery compartment.

Here is part of Keystone's description:
Based on customer input, Keystone Innovation Lab's Giggy Box was developed to organize and centralize an RV's 12V wiring connections. When appropriately equipped, it also allows owners turn off all 12V power to the RV—eliminating parasitic draw that can cause dead batteries. While the battery disconnect cuts power to 12V components, it maintains power to the breakaway switch for safety. If the RV has a solar power system, the batteries will still be charged when the disconnect is in the OFF position.
Ref: https://www.keystonerv.com/innovations/giggy-box

IMO this is a terrific improvement to the crappy wiring system they used to use. I do wonder if the self-resetting circuit breakers include an 80 amp one for the hydraulic system?

For those with 2022 and newer units, you now have a viable battery disconnect system that actually disconnects everything and avoids parasitic drains.

Finally, to member Lrazzano, forget everything I (and others) wrote about adding a disconnect switch. The two disconnects you have (i.e. the Giggy Box and the one for the inverter) do isolate the electrical system for winterization.
__________________
Carl (n Susan)
There is more to life than fuel mileage.
2012 Montana 3700RL Big Sky Package towed by a 2015 Ford F350 6.7L PSD 4WD CC LWB

Carl n Susan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2022, 02:44 PM   #28
MandK
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Mar 2021
Location: Western NY
Posts: 234
M.O.C. #28430
And who says keystone doesn’t listen.
I forgot about the giggy box. It was talked about at the plant tour we took at the rally last month. Must of been one of those “ I don’t have one so this doesn’t involve me” moments.lol
__________________
Mark & Karen
2021 3121rl - slide toppers, cottage white, TST 507 TPMS, X-Factors, disc brakes
2021 F-350 SRW CC LB - B&W Companion, Timbren, Bakflip cover
MandK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2022, 03:34 PM   #29
Lee-CI
Montana Fan
 
Lee-CI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: Northeast TX
Posts: 418
M.O.C. #30262
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl n Susan View Post
Does this mean they got rid of the disconnect switch in the convenience center?
Indeed - no "turn and pull out to disconnect" key in the convenience center on MHC. Tony nailed it on this one. The new setups are a clean install easily expandable.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	20221006_152452.jpg
Views:	16
Size:	121.4 KB
ID:	13341   Click image for larger version

Name:	Correct Orientation.jpg
Views:	10
Size:	481.0 KB
ID:	13344  
Lee-CI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2022, 12:14 PM   #30
432bartman
Montana Master
 
432bartman's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2020
Location: UPLAND
Posts: 1,050
M.O.C. #26190
That's a slick setup.
__________________
2019 Keystone Montana 3560RL, 2020 Chevy 2500 HD, Firestone airbags, Air Lift wireless compressor, Curt gooseneck, 20K Reese Goosebox, TST-507, USMC combat vet & retired LEO. Robert, Anika, Breanna, Dylan & our Great Pyrenees Layla
432bartman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2022, 01:07 PM   #31
Foldbak
Montana Master
 
Foldbak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2022
Location: Shingle Springs
Posts: 820
M.O.C. #30417
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee-CI View Post
Indeed - no "turn and pull out to disconnect" key in the convenience center on MHC. Tony nailed it on this one. The new setups are a clean install easily expandable.

Lower pic is correct orientation
Dam those upside down pictures are tough on the eyes. But I noticed your setup is different then mine? Two things jump out. One is you have a battery charger? If this an add on? Mine charges of the solar and converter. Two is, WTH are the two toggle switches?
__________________
Tony & Donna
2022 Montana High Country 295RL, Solar Flex 400, Onan 3600 LPG, 2000 Dimensions inverter
2020 GMC Denali 2500 6.6 Duramax, Demco 21K Auto Slide
Foldbak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2022, 02:04 PM   #32
Lee-CI
Montana Fan
 
Lee-CI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: Northeast TX
Posts: 418
M.O.C. #30262
Quote:
Originally Posted by Foldbak View Post
Dam those upside down pictures are tough on the eyes. But I noticed your setup is different then mine? Two things jump out. One is you have a battery charger? If this an add on? Mine charges of the solar and converter. Two is, WTH are the two toggle switches?
Ah-HA! I figured out how to edit and change the orientation of pics once sent! Much easier on the eyes now...


The Renogy is a DC-DC charger to keep everything topped off while running the GE residential fridge during extended driving days. There are a pair of 206Ah SOK batteries unboxed in my den awaiting installation. Once the LiFePo4 batteries are installed, there must be a means of regulating the current coming off of the truck alternator. I'm running 2 AWG wiring coming off my alternator bank through a 60 amp circuit breaker to a Anderson connector next to the TV 7-way female plug. Without a DC-DC charger, the alternator(s) would fry. Dayles has an excellent write up for his installation which I plagiarized.
https://www.montanaowners.com/forums...hlight=charger


One toggle switch is for the ignition On line the to energize the DC-DC charger. The other toggle is to power the TPMS repeater in the far upper right side. Easy Peazy to do with the expansion possibilities of the Giggy box.


Oh - one other nifty idea which I picked up from truckers pulling refrigerated trailers, I wired up a green LED lamp that runs off of 120 vac supply coming off of the GVCI on the output side of the Inverter. Have that little puppy installed in the corner of the fresh air intake vent for the FLA battery box. Now I'm able to tell for certain via my driver's side mirror whether my inverter is indeed working and supplying inverted 120 VAC to our residential fridge while driving down the highway.
__________________
Lee, Edith & Lil' Bit the furry feline alarm clock
2022 MHC 331RL, Surge Guard 35550, SumoSprings,TST 507, 200W base solar package
2022 Ram 3500 CC DRW 6.7 CTD, B&W Companion
Lee-CI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2022, 09:51 AM   #33
Foldbak
Montana Master
 
Foldbak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2022
Location: Shingle Springs
Posts: 820
M.O.C. #30417
I've heard the term DC to DC charger but didn't know what it was. Now I do. so I'm clear, it ups the amperage output from the TV to the batteries for a better charge to run the inverter while traveling. And you have to manually turn it on and off.
__________________
Tony & Donna
2022 Montana High Country 295RL, Solar Flex 400, Onan 3600 LPG, 2000 Dimensions inverter
2020 GMC Denali 2500 6.6 Duramax, Demco 21K Auto Slide
Foldbak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2022, 10:27 AM   #34
Lee-CI
Montana Fan
 
Lee-CI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: Northeast TX
Posts: 418
M.O.C. #30262
Quote:
Originally Posted by Foldbak View Post
I've heard the term DC to DC charger but didn't know what it was. Now I do. so I'm clear, it ups the amperage output from the TV to the batteries for a better charge to run the inverter while traveling. And you have to manually turn it on and off.
Your got it correct Tony. The DC-DC charger has charge parameters for multiple battery types. Our unit is a 40 amp model. Since LiFePo4 batteries have extremely low internal resistance, without a DC-DC charger the alternator(s) would scream their full output capacity to the batteries
through the heavy gauge wiring from the engine compartment to the battery compartment on the fiver. Victron has an informative video on this.






Yes - it is an extra step but I close the circuit breaker beneath the hood each trip and then energize the DC-DC charger from the toggle switch in the battery bay.
__________________
Lee, Edith & Lil' Bit the furry feline alarm clock
2022 MHC 331RL, Surge Guard 35550, SumoSprings,TST 507, 200W base solar package
2022 Ram 3500 CC DRW 6.7 CTD, B&W Companion
Lee-CI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2022, 02:22 PM   #35
Tree Top Turkeys
Seasoned Camper
 
Tree Top Turkeys's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2022
Location: Ashland
Posts: 61
M.O.C. #30303
I have a negative knife switch on a 2021 and with the switch open my batteries were dead in two months. Is that expected? I did not disconnect the ground connected to the frame, but that goes to the battery? They are Lead acid interstates, should I check the fluid levels?
__________________
Thanks
Tree Top Turkeys is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2022, 02:34 PM   #36
Lee-CI
Montana Fan
 
Lee-CI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: Northeast TX
Posts: 418
M.O.C. #30262
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tree Top Turkeys View Post
I have a negative knife switch on a 2021 and with the switch open my batteries were dead in two months. Is that expected? I did not disconnect the ground connected to the frame, but that goes to the battery? They are Lead acid interstates, should I check the fluid levels?
Tree Top - unless there is corrosion on the terminals or some other nearby connection, then this doesn't seem right at all. If the batteries are truly dead then replacement would seem advised. If not, I'd fully recharge them and take them to an automotive parts store and have them load tested.
And yes - I check the fluid level in our FLA batteries every 60 days.
__________________
Lee, Edith & Lil' Bit the furry feline alarm clock
2022 MHC 331RL, Surge Guard 35550, SumoSprings,TST 507, 200W base solar package
2022 Ram 3500 CC DRW 6.7 CTD, B&W Companion
Lee-CI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2022, 02:29 PM   #37
Wheelhouse
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Aptos
Posts: 409
M.O.C. #11462
Battery disconnect

I use a battery disconnect switch on my system. If and when I am storing the rug it is a matter of lifting the lever to disconnect them. Get the lever that lifts up and not sideways. I got mine at the auto parts store. See attached picture.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	18D42B28-2FB7-4C04-910E-FE436383953D.jpg
Views:	6
Size:	247.0 KB
ID:	13359  
Wheelhouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
battery

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Montana RV, Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:46 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.