FLEXING in 2013 (NEW) rigs - Montana Owners Club

mazboy · 10-17-2012, 03:52 AM

for all new montana owners who just got their 2013 5th wheel, check your front end for flexing. when you have it on the truck make sure the caulking has not broken or moved.

also check your front closet drawer wall at the front....is it broken or pushing out?

**DQDick** · 10-17-2012, 06:35 AM

I'm assuming from this that you have had the problem? Do you have the 11" or 12" frame?

Tom S. · 10-17-2012, 08:27 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by DQDick

I'm assuming from this that you have had the problem? Do you have the 11" or 12" frame?

Are they using the 12 inch frames yet? I thought they were waiting until the 2014's came out - but I don't remember. I'm pretty sure our 2013 is still the 10 inch frame.

dieselguy · 10-17-2012, 10:17 AM

I'm just trying to picture how a 12" frame is going to cure all front end flex. If you ever get a chance, look at a naked Montana fifth wheel frame ... Although some engineering firm has undoubtedly cast their blessing on it, compared to a horse or equipment trailer, there just isn't much structure forward of the propane tanks supporting the increasing weight as each model year passes. I'm not saying the 12" frame won't help, but what about beefing up what's ahead of the propane tanks that the pinbox is bolted to???? Just thinking out loud here ...

CRUZIN 2 · 10-17-2012, 10:57 AM

I agree with dieselguy, we have a 12" frame a ( Keystone product ) and still have some flex. The only way to get away from the flex problem is, to beef up the forward area of the overhang which is only about 6" rectangle tubing. Just my 1 cents worth.

mazboy · 10-17-2012, 11:38 AM

Broken caulking is a good sign of problems. Aug 2013 run there has to be a problem.
And yes they replaced my 37title foot wall.
2013 trailer keep an eye on your front.

Tom S. · 10-17-2012, 11:49 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by dieselguy

I'm just trying to picture how a 12" frame is going to cure all front end flex. If you ever get a chance, look at a naked Montana fifth wheel frame ... Although some engineering firm has undoubtedly cast their blessing on it, compared to a horse or equipment trailer, there just isn't much structure forward of the propane tanks supporting the increasing weight as each model year passes. I'm not saying the 12" frame won't help, but what about beefing up what's ahead of the propane tanks that the pinbox is bolted to???? Just thinking out loud here ...

I believe the thought process was the whole frame had enough flex to allow the front end to flex, and by making the main frame more rigid, the front end would be more stable too.

mazboy · 10-17-2012, 12:15 PM

I dont want to get into flex discussions other than IF you have a trailer bulit Aig 2013. Check it.
3 new trailers from that run so far!
Beware newbies.....

PapaBeav · 10-17-2012, 12:30 PM

We had flexing problems with our 2012, they had to rebuild the front end including the veneer divider in the front closet. It was replaced with 1/2" material instead of the veneer again.

**DQDick** · 10-17-2012, 01:26 PM

The only reason for my question is that there can be a case made for the thicker frame making the issue worse instead of better.

Champ_49 · 10-18-2012, 02:51 AM

IMHO there is in fact no way to eliminate frame flex. The physics just don't allow it. Built race cars for over 20 yrs. and we worked with frame flex for yrs. Steel is strong but it still bends with the right amount of weight and how the structure is built. I once had a car builder tell me his frames don't flex because I asked him why he didn't have a certain bar in place. I told him there is no such thing as no flex. I took one of his cars and put what we call a wedge bar in. When I did this I only put one long bar (about 8' long) with no supports just to show him. We took the car out on the track at speed for 10 laps and when I got back even I was astonished at the results. That bar was bent badly. He could not believe it until I sent him pictures of the end result.

So what is done with flex is to use it in your design so that you can get the most of it. I believe lippert does this as well as they can in most instances. But if you have a day on the assembly line at Lippert when the welder isn't at his best, doesn't care, or been told not to do this, is where the problems arise. I do not know the answer to how to accomplish the fix for these problems as the frame needs to be built strong enough to minimize the flex, but yet keep the materials light enough to keep within the range needed to haul. Thats for the engineers to deal with.

But I do know that I hope I never run into the problem as it is not an easy thing to deal with. I think maybe what we need here is to hear from some of the members that have had the problem and if they understand what was done to fix the trailer to let us know what they did.

Dave

pineranch · 10-18-2012, 07:02 AM

Check out what the OEM is looking at.

http://lci1.com/index.php?option=com...186&Itemid=114
Mike

Champ_49 · 10-18-2012, 08:29 AM

Pretty interesting Mike. I like the suspension upgrade kit in place of the wet bolt upgrade. But a little skeptical on it. Going to check it out at Camping World in Robertsdale on the way down next week. Also pretty good idea on the slide mechanisms also.

Dave

**DQDick** · 10-18-2012, 11:43 AM

Thanks Mike, that's interesting information.

mazboy · 10-19-2012, 03:26 AM

boy, there is a lot of input here about flexing. Of course there is always some flexing. All i wanted to do is inform NEW 2013 owners that there may be a problem with there 5th wheel. Mine is the 3rd one that had to go back to the factory and have the front end rebuilt. As for mine, they had to replace the WHOLE left 37 foot wall.
Beware of this issue if your 5th wheel was built august, 2012!

If your front end caulking is breaking loose from the trailer you have an issue!

**Carl n Susan** · 10-19-2012, 05:56 AM

This is not unique to August 2012 builds. My August 2011 built rig just had its left side replaced. The Keystone/Montana comment was "..we have never seen this before...". Sure!

woodtic · 10-19-2012, 06:35 AM

I belive I may have a flex issue in the front as well. The calking and pannel on the front pulled away from the ODS propane tank door my first trip out. Blocked the pannel in place with styrofoam block and re-sealed. I never figured out why this happened but after reading this topic I have an idea. I have also noticed some flex with the pin when hooking up. Seems like it's getting a little worse as time goes on. I'm not too worried as I'm still covered under the 1 year warreny. I'll have lots of isssues for the dealer to work on when I take it to them in April. Thanks for posting this topic. This is a great forum and I have learned a lot from being a member.

Montana3800RE · 10-19-2012, 09:36 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by Carl n Susan

This is not unique to August 2012 builds. My August 2011 built rig just had its left side replaced. The Keystone/Montana comment was "..we have never seen this before...". Sure!

As you stated that Keystone has never heard of this issue before, BS on that one. As I have stated before, I have Frame Flex issues as well with the front wardrobe comming apart etc. Next time you hook back up to the TV, go into the front wardrobe when it is being lowered down onto the TV and you will not believe how much movement and creaking is going on, as Keystone told my dealear it is within tollerence, BS on that statement. Ours is going back in this month and we will see where it goes from there, I don not want it back untill it is fixed and also in a timely fashion. The money you pay for these things and the problems you have is crazy. I have pulled Horse Trailers with Living Quarters most of my life and never had any issues with them falling apart or flexing in the front end, with Horse trailers there is alot more hitch weight as the axels are always kept under the animals you haul. So I hear Keystone is going to a larger frame and still haveing problems, and also going bigger? I think they need some new engineers at Lippert. Happy Safe Travels

**Rondo** · 10-19-2012, 06:07 PM

Ron-- Are your horse trailers gooseneck or pinbox hitch as in a fifth wheel? If they are goosenecks they are built differently in the frontend than the fifth wheel. Take a look at the dimensions of the steel used between the two. You'll see quite a bit of diffference!

Montana3800RE · 10-20-2012, 02:35 PM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by Rondo

Ron-- Are your horse trailers gooseneck or pinbox hitch as in a fifth wheel? If they are goosenecks they are built differently in the front end than the fifth wheel. Take a look at the dimensions of the steel used between the two. You'll see quite a bit of difference!

The last Living Quarters we owned and sold lat year was aluminum, and the frame work under the gooseneck was steel, 2x5 steel tubing from the hitch to the drop wall then down in front of the drop wall to the floor. The Montana 5ver is also steel tubing but much lighter material and a 10 or now a 12" main frame, doubled up around the holding tank location. The main frame on a aluminum horse trailer you can see when you are driving down the road is extruded aluminum about 8", extruded aluminum roof rails, floor and wall studs etc. when welded together become very strong. Yes we all know that they are trying to make these things as light as possible, but what about safety? that is always #1 I thought? but I guess not the way these things are flexing and tearing up the inside of the wardrobe and the potential if not noticed to just break completely in the pin box area when traveling down the road resulting in you know what

You may also like: