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Old 10-13-2021, 12:28 PM   #41
MikeandJo4
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From Keystone's website so it has to be true..

"Color-coded unified wiring standard".

and...

"Perhaps no other fifth wheel RV inspires its owners like Montana. Built by generations of experienced craftsmen, Montana and Montana High Country are the pinnacle of luxury fifth wheel travel. Stunning interior design, profound attention to detail, and the highest quality materials come together in this collection of unforgettable RV's. With our eyes firmly on the horizon, Montana is driven to deliver innovation that transcends expectations and delights new owners, year after year."

We're inspired alright...
 
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Old 10-13-2021, 12:49 PM   #42
randdcran
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Wow, not what I see in my rig...

They have a great publicist, I'll give them that.

But, while I'm on a roll, I'll mention all the interior trim that has fallen off over the first 3 trips, the wooden hanger holding up the barn doors to the Den that came loose and almost had the barn doors crash into the kitchen.

I agree with someone else that said these are supposed to be made to move on down the road without everything falling apart. Quality seems to be a thing of the past. I've seen quite a few articles about the bad quality from the manufactures that the dealers are having to deal with. Guess I got stuck with one of the units that didn't get the QC check.
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Old 10-13-2021, 12:50 PM   #43
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They are all wired like that willy-nilly.
As for your water tank, no way I would let it sit at the dealer it can still be used if the leak is at the top. Besides most people have water hookups anyway so the tank is not needed
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Old 10-13-2021, 12:56 PM   #44
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Calling the wiring a "Rats Nest" is an insult to any self respecting Rat.
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Old 10-13-2021, 01:03 PM   #45
randdcran
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Unfortunately, the tank was crushed so bad from the top, that the leak is at the 1/4 filled mark. If we travel with it at the 1/4 full, the rest leaks out and we end up with an empty tank. Our current trip is to the in-laws and we only have electric when we stay there. Also, we like to stay at Harvest Host places along the way and not many of those have any hookups, but the beer is usually good!

It really does blow me away how they could have crushed the tank that bad and still installed it.

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Old 10-13-2021, 01:17 PM   #46
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In the meantime, your warranty is passing by... Since they are on back order, tell them you want the warranty added for the time it is out of service.. Sitting on a lot for months is not fun.. Or have them put a different tank in and modify it if you have to. Our 5ver is BACK AT THE SHOP AGAIN FOR THE LARGE SLIDE!! PLEASE FORGIVE ME BUT I HAVE NEVER BOUGHT ANYTHING IN MY LIFE THAT HAS CAUSED SO MUCH HEARTACHE.. ONE BIG PROBLEM AFTER ANOTHER... WE JUST DROVE 4 HOURS AND WERE SETTING UP WHEN THE STINKING BIG SLIDE BROKE AGAIN.. THIS WILL BE THE 3RD TIME REPAIRING.. THE BEDROOM SLIDE ALSO BROKE... THE BLACK WATER TANK EXPLODED! MY TRAILER IS JUNK JUNK JUNK... NEVER AGAIN...
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Old 10-13-2021, 01:26 PM   #47
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Storage

I'm sorry to hear about all those problems. Not something I'm looking forward to experiencing beyond the problems we have had.

I told the dealer/service that we have an RV garage I had built to protect this large investment, and I wanted to bring it home before one of our famous hail storms hit. The response from the dealer was that they were more concerned about another RV hitting it while it was on the lot.

Gives ya a warm feeling all over when they say stuff like that...
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Old 10-13-2021, 02:36 PM   #48
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Well I think of just the little stuff like my cheap door and the fake wood sticker covering is lifting at all the edges, my closet poles that have repeatedly collapsed and pulled out of the wall with very light load of clothes hanging on them, my black tank flush vacuum valve failing & pissing water under the sink after 6 months of use, the horrible TV/antenna/satellite connection/cable run that apparently the majority of owners admit never works unless you modify it..etc and just that small stuff is frustrating. The major issues have been worse for others but it makes me wonder how I was so easily led to believe Montana was still a quality product. As stated by others most units are mass produced, poor quality and way over priced. I have a four year extended warranty that sounds great but would require weeks or days of moving out in order for them to work on it. Thank the Lord I am able to deal with most issues myself but that leaves alot of well earned money spent on a useless warranty that just isn't practical for most people who live in their units. I owned a beautiful Foretravel diesel pusher prior to the fifth wheel and that was some exceptional quality when built. The good ole days.
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Old 10-13-2021, 05:24 PM   #49
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I had a 2000 Terry 25W bought new for 11 years and the only thing we had to do to it was replace tires and brake shoes, and lube the axles. Took the family all over the country in that. I sure miss Fleetwood and was bummed when they folded their towable division in 2008. My 3820FK has had a lot of issues but Keystone has stood behind it and my CW service dept. has been good to deal with. We do experience the long waits for repairs but I'm chalking that up to the pandemic.
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Old 10-13-2021, 05:54 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dfb View Post
In the meantime, your warranty is passing by... Since they are on back order, tell them you want the warranty added for the time it is out of service.. Sitting on a lot for months is not fun.. Or have them put a different tank in and modify it if you have to. Our 5ver is BACK AT THE SHOP AGAIN FOR THE LARGE SLIDE!! PLEASE FORGIVE ME BUT I HAVE NEVER BOUGHT ANYTHING IN MY LIFE THAT HAS CAUSED SO MUCH HEARTACHE.. ONE BIG PROBLEM AFTER ANOTHER... WE JUST DROVE 4 HOURS AND WERE SETTING UP WHEN THE STINKING BIG SLIDE BROKE AGAIN.. THIS WILL BE THE 3RD TIME REPAIRING.. THE BEDROOM SLIDE ALSO BROKE... THE BLACK WATER TANK EXPLODED! MY TRAILER IS JUNK JUNK JUNK... NEVER AGAIN...
That's sad to hear dfb.
My only suggestion is get rid of it and buy one of the older ones. One in the error around 2010 plus or minus when all the slides were hydraulic
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Old 10-13-2021, 07:45 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeandJo4 View Post
From Keystone's website so it has to be true..

"Color-coded unified wiring standard".

and...

"Perhaps no other fifth wheel RV inspires its owners like Montana. Built by generations of experienced craftsmen, Montana and Montana High Country are the pinnacle of luxury fifth wheel travel. Stunning interior design, profound attention to detail, and the highest quality materials come together in this collection of unforgettable RV's. With our eyes firmly on the horizon, Montana is driven to deliver innovation that transcends expectations and delights new owners, year after year."

We're inspired alright...
I've said this before, marketing is in control of the company. They write checks that engineering and manufacturing can't cash. Their focus is on the front end, meaning sales, and have little concern for the back end, meaning the end user. Marketing uses words geared towards anticipation. Manufacturing and quality control are hands on and real world. Both ends need to meet closer in the middle. Currently they are at each end of the pendulum. I've worked under these conditions before and it's a dysfunctional business model. As long as the dollars roll in nothing will change. I challenge any representative that supposedly follows these posts to chime in.
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Old 10-13-2021, 08:02 PM   #52
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[QUOTE=randdcran;1235860]They have a great publicist, I'll give them that.

But, while I'm on a roll, I'll mention all the interior trim that has fallen off over the first 3 trips, the wooden hanger holding up the barn doors to the Den that came loose and almost had the barn doors crash into the kitchen.

We bought a new to us 2021 3855br and previous owner “fixed” the loose trim with a glue stic.
We are practically neighbors, hope to see you camping someday. Tomorrow I’m going to pull my panel and look at the water heater before it snows.
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Old 10-13-2021, 08:27 PM   #53
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Our 2015 was 77k... it books at 46000. We have it for sale for 39,000.. no bites..
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Old 10-14-2021, 12:13 PM   #54
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Yes! We almost moved to 5 acres in Franktown at one time, but ended up in Fort Lupton. I too need to look at winterizing. I'm not sure how this is going to work with taking it to Loveland when the tank arrives. I'm guessing I'm going to have to winterize multiple times this winter, and hopefully get a few trips in it south for the warmth.
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Old 10-14-2021, 12:14 PM   #55
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P.S. what are you doing up at 2:27 am?? LOL
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Old 10-14-2021, 01:27 PM   #56
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With our eyes firmly on the horizon, Montana is driven to deliver

There is the problem. Just maybe they should keep their eyes on the camper they are building.
What bovine fertilizer.
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Old 10-31-2021, 05:17 PM   #57
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Is this the new normal?

This is a long one, sorry.

I purchased my 2021 3120RL Legacy in December of 2020 from Tacoma RV. I've had nothing but problems with it since I bought it, I've only been able to take it out on 2 trips this past year due to it being in their service center for most of July, all of August and 2 weeks in September.

A list of my problems.
~Ceiling fan didn't work
~LED light strip on the front had 4 LED lights out.
~Automatic Transfer Switch would only power one side of the coach.
~Several drawers wouldn't auto close (7 total)
~Shower facia has large scratches on it from initial assembly.
~Large awning, when completely opened has a tear in it about the size of a 50 cent piece.
~Stairs area extremely squeaky (going to the bedroom).
~Drivers side middle hydraulic jack leaking.
~Coach will not stay level.

After first trip to service.

Nothing was done about:
~Stairs
~Drawers - They said they fall within the expected standards.
~Hole in awning (blamed me, although we couldn't inspect this during our PDI due to my rig being parked between 2 other rigs.

Addressed:
~Replaced ATS.
~Replaced wrong hydraulic jack, even though they put blue tape on it.
~We decided not to have them replace Shower facia, as we assumed it would cause more problems.
~Ceiling fan fixed
~Replaced LED light strip with a different colored light strip. So now it didn't match.

During my first attempt to pick up, I pointed out that they replaced the wrong hydraulic jack, even after pointing it out and completely proving it, the Service Manager was still trying to convince me that they replaced the correct one. He also tried to convince me that having the wrong color LED strip on the front was acceptable. Meaning, My LED's were all white LED's that turned amber. they put a strip that is amber LED's that turn amber. So the new strip is excessively brighter and more orange color.

They keep it to replace the leaking hydraulic jack that they didn't replace the first time.

2nd attempt to pick it up. They replace the correct hydraulic jack. While I was waiting for that, I made enough of an issue out of the LED lights, they they agree to replace all 3 with all amber/amber LED's. They only replace the 2nd lower strip. The top strip is still the white/amber strip. They now tell me that Keystone only has the white/amber for the top and they no longer stock the lower strips in white/amber. So my 2 lower strips are amber/amber and my top doesn't match and it's white/amber. These lights have 1 purpose in life, to look at. And they don't look correct.

During this 2nd trip, we discover that they damaged my Anderson hitch receiver by using a ball that was too short and it damaged the aluminum receiver so much that I couldn't get the retaining pin to lock into place. It wouldn't slide all the way in, therefore, I couldn't take it home.

That damage cost me over $200 as we were not able to make our Labor Day trip because of how they damaged my Anderson hitch and I couldn't get my money back from my reservations.

3rd trip. Come to pick up 5th wheel after replacing the Anderson hitch only to find out that they damaged the brand new Anderson hitch again. The underside is all chewed up again, and the retaining pin, with a lot of effort, barely closes due to damage. I take it after voicing my frustration because I haven't had my rig since the middle of July, it's now the 2nd week of September.

I go home. After a week of my trailer sitting stored under my carport, I notice that the Hydraulic jack that they replaced is leaking all over. And it doesn't match any of my other Hydraulic jacks, which I knew when I picked up, but ultimately found out it was the wrong jack.

Schedule service again, Take it back to have the hydraulic jack replaced again, this one ends up being same day service, turn around is about 3 hours and they put the correct Hydraulic jack on this time because it now matches the other 5.

Currently, my trailer leans towards that drivers side after sitting for a duration of time. 1 week of time, will make the drivers side sag 2". Meaning, when I go out there and hit auto level again, only the drivers side goes up and it goes up about 2". You can see this on the new hydraulic jack as it leaves a little oil residue on the shaft of the jack.

This is my 3rd trailer. My first 2, both made by Forest River, I honestly never had a single problem with either of those. I came to Keystone Montana because of the claim that they're the #1 selling luxury 5th wheel for "however" many years in a row.

My warranty expires in just over a month and I'm very scared about the problems that are going to continue to arise.

Is this the new norm?
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Old 11-01-2021, 10:44 AM   #58
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Unfortunately this looks similar to our rig, a 2020 294RL, and I'm guessing the wiring mess is pretty common across most Montana models. The craftsmanship is horrible, just slapped together. I'm actually quite surprised I haven't heard of life threatening issues with the wiring. I've found wires not properly spliced, not terminated, loose in their connections etc. These things are a fire hazard waiting to happen. I know owning a trailer comes with a certain amount of DIY responsibility, but for the price we pay for these units we should not have to Q&A their entire installation. I'm considering dropping the aluminum support structure holding the basement walls, crawling in there and completely rearranging their mess.
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Old 11-01-2021, 12:26 PM   #59
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Unfortunately this looks similar to our rig, a 2020 294RL, and I'm guessing the wiring mess is pretty common across most Montana models...... I'm actually quite surprised I haven't heard of life threatening issues with the wiring. I've found wires not properly spliced, not terminated, loose in their connections etc. These things are a fire hazard ......
You are correct. Here's my lengthy fire post from 4 years ago: Our dog woke my DW last night (I wasn't home), to a haze of smoke and strong electrical smell. The smoke detectors did not activate! She got our 5yr old granddaughter out, along with the dog. DW pulled out the 50a shore power.

DW saw smoke coming up behind the stove and she called the fire dept., which arrived before I did. They found "light" smoke and determined a breaker had tripped. That breaker services the TV and the fridge.

I noticed a strong electrical and plastic smell when I arrived after midnight. The FD couldn't find any active burning and suspected a bad electrical connection, and suggested not connecting back to shore power, with which I wholeheartedly agreed, until we could get to a repair shop.

This morning, we found light soot in the drawers next to the stove so I pulled them and the one under the stove and found a melted 120v connector. It joins the sheaved flexible wire to the solid Romex cable inside the kitchen slideout . The connector was screwed to the floor, along with two other similar ones. I have no idea why it failed, but thankfully, the breaker tripped before it started a fire on the floor or the wall 2" away. Also, the gas line runs right next to the wires. There is a lot of soot within an 8" radius.

I've never seen this type of connector before, and I suspect it's only used in the RV industry. I'm familiar with residential steel or plastic junction boxes; I used a steel box to make the repair. I'll likely get a bigger junction box and eliminate the other two connectors, too. BTW, the FD checked the smoke detectors and they worked. I find it strange that sometimes cooking on the stove trips one of the detectors but last night's smoke did not.

Bottom line: We love our fire safety dog Blu, and are thankful no one was hurt, or worse.
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Old 11-01-2021, 01:17 PM   #60
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More woes...

Wow, these stories are becoming too common and scary.

The dealer/service center finally received the fresh water tank to replace in my Montana. We have an appt. this Thursday to have it replaced.

Now for the latest issue. I went out to get the 5th wheel to get it ready to role on Thursday, it is parked in our RV garage with the slides out. I tried to get the slides to go in, but they would just start and then stop. That's when I noticed the batteries were low. Hmm, this has been plugged into shore power. Now noticed I don't have any shore power.

I checked the breakers in the RV garage and in the 5th wheel and they all look ok.

I had noticed that the cover to the transfer switch in the basement had fallen off and was laying down under the transfer switch. Not sure how this happened, but I noticed it when the basement panel was opened up for the service guys to check for the water leak.

I kicked on the generator and had power to the rig from the generator. I turned off the generator and grabbed my meter. I have both legs of power from shore power and neutral at the input of the transfer switch, but the contact isn't pulling to supply 220 to the output of the transfer switch.

After researching issues like this and finding a troubleshooting youtube video from the manufacturer of the transfer switch, I pushed on the transfer switch manual button and had power to the rig. So, something is broken in the relay that pulls the transfer switch for shore power.

I contacted the dealer/service for my appt. Thursday and I'm hoping they have the part.

Just another issue for a 1 year old Luxury 5th wheel that should not have all these problems, double ugh!! Haven't been able to use this fancy 5th wheel for almost 4 months now.
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