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09-03-2018, 10:54 AM
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#1
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Established Member
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Douglass
Posts: 30
M.O.C. #20643
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PDI vs. "the owner"!
As I posted earlier I am at the point of pulling the trigger on a 3791RD....but honestly the thing that is holding me back is quality concerns. I monitor this forum daily, and have for several months, and for the most part the situations many of you are in with your coaches is...and I am directing this at the manu....completely unnecessary and unforgivable. I mean just pick a part of the coach and do a search for it on this forum and someone (typically more than one) has had an issue...wow. Truly can't believe there will be a customer service rep (many reps) to help y'all with your service issues at the rally....if I was that/those reps I would be packin', cause he will surely be the brunt of all the owners frustrations....anyway that is not the purpose of this post...So I tell salesman I want to do an obsessive compulsive PDI before purchase...to which the salesman says "you will have to speak with the owner, but I'm sure it will be fine", but I am finding out the owner will not resolve any issues if found until the unit is purchased...is this common? I wouldn't think so...
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09-03-2018, 11:06 AM
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#2
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Established Member
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Full Time
Posts: 18
M.O.C. #19919
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Every manufacturer whether its a fifth wheel, truck or other consumer good is going to have complaints. You will hear many more complaints than positive comments. This forum tends to be the same. We purchased a new 3950 over a year ago and have had a few problems but nothing earth shattering and we have been using it full time since purchase. No matter what you buy there are going to be some "bugs" that will have to be worked out.
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09-03-2018, 12:47 PM
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#3
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Site Team
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Oro Valley
Posts: 4,085
M.O.C. #20477
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dke1955
As I posted earlier I am at the point of pulling the trigger on a 3791RD....but honestly the thing that is holding me back is quality concerns. I monitor this forum daily, and have for several months, and for the most part the situations many of you are in with your coaches is...and I am directing this at the manu....completely unnecessary and unforgivable. I mean just pick a part of the coach and do a search for it on this forum and someone (typically more than one) has had an issue...wow. Truly can't believe there will be a customer service rep (many reps) to help y'all with your service issues at the rally....if I was that/those reps I would be packin', cause he will surely be the brunt of all the owners frustrations....anyway that is not the purpose of this post...So I tell salesman I want to do an obsessive compulsive PDI before purchase...to which the salesman says "you will have to speak with the owner, but I'm sure it will be fine", but I am finding out the owner will not resolve any issues if found until the unit is purchased...is this common? I wouldn't think so...
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There are plenty of places to buy - walk away from this dealer now.
Folks with issues tend to post more than those without. The RV industry is not known for their high quality but most units wind up pretty decent. It helps if you are inclined to do some of the work yourself.
Other options are to tent camp, rent RVs or stay in hotels.
__________________
Zack and Donna plus Millie and Ranger
2018 3160RL
"Life is too short to stay indoors, enjoy the ride!"
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09-03-2018, 01:09 PM
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#4
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Salem
Posts: 7,670
M.O.C. #2283
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All campers have problems. That is nothing new but the owner won’t fix anything until the unit is sold and then he doesn’t haft to unless he wonts to. Now let me think, naw don’t think so, see ya later make that never.
Lynwood
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09-03-2018, 01:33 PM
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#5
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Bastrop
Posts: 2,892
M.O.C. #20753
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Wow. We have bought more campers than I care to count. Everyone we did a PDI and made a punch list of things needing repair before money exchanged hands. If the Owner will not fix it before you purchase you can bet it will sit in line forever to be fixed.
I would walk away and let them know why and in any case post their name here to warn others.
__________________
Mocha, one-eyed toothless, hurricane survivor, Pirate dog
2019 20th Anniversary Edition 3701LK
B&W 20K for Ford OEM Puck
2018 Ford F-350 Lariat CCLB PSD DRW KJ5CQH
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09-03-2018, 01:33 PM
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#6
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Site Team
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Carmichael - CA
Posts: 7,693
M.O.C. #4831
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It can't be emphasized enough. Do a complete PDI and have all the identified issues resolved BEFORE you sign the contract!!!!!! Otherwise you likely will have problems getting them serviced after. Of course there may be problems which you don't find until you start using the unit and those will have to go through the warranty process. But those should be minor if the PDI was done and everything fixed then.
If the dealer is unwilling to fix it until you buy it, walk away!!!!
__________________
Carl (n Susan)
There is more to life than fuel mileage.
2012 Montana 3700RL Big Sky Package towed by a 2015 Ford F350 6.7L PSD 4WD CC LWB
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09-03-2018, 01:45 PM
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#7
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Montana Master
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Sequim
Posts: 553
M.O.C. #17176
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As others have said if they won’t let you do a PDI and fix problems before you sign on the line,walk away there are other dealers out there that will take care of problems before you sign.
__________________
Dan & Sandy Huhn
2016 Montana 3720 2015 Chevy 3500 SWD Duro Max
Prev 2012 High Country 313RE 2012 Chevy 2500 DMax
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09-03-2018, 02:03 PM
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#8
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Montana Master
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: SWFL
Posts: 965
M.O.C. #17801
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dke1955
As I posted earlier I am at the point of pulling the trigger on a 3791RD....but honestly the thing that is holding me back is quality concerns......So I tell salesman I want to do an obsessive compulsive PDI before purchase...to which the salesman says "you will have to speak with the owner, but I'm sure it will be fine", but I am finding out the owner will not resolve any issues if found until the unit is purchased...is this common? I wouldn't think so...
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Maybe common with a smaller dealership. My experience was with two larger dealerships.
I wouldn't have even asked and would have shown up with my list. If they objected, I would have said, "Then we'll buy elsewhere. Cancel my offer to purchase and refund my downpayment (if any)."
While dealerships report they do a PDI, it ain't like the one I did (see previous posts). I take a literal view of the words. PDI refers to your inspection prior to delivery. If you accept the unit prior to the dealership repairing any problems, you've lost all your leverage. I found 13 items needing repair during the PDI I did at Lazy Days. They got on it and fixed the 9 biggest, and agreed to fix the remaining later, and I signed the contract. They never questioned my PDI rationale.
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09-03-2018, 02:19 PM
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#9
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Carson City
Posts: 2,017
M.O.C. #21963
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If I was told that someone wanted to do an OC PDI, I would have concerns as well. As a dealer, a nit picky customer is a pain. Fully functioning components and good fit and finish is reasonable. Beyond that, I would tell you to have a nice day, or, not give you the best deal expecting you to cost more than average customers.
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09-03-2018, 02:57 PM
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#10
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Bastrop
Posts: 2,892
M.O.C. #20753
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Montana Man
If I was told that someone wanted to do an OC PDI, I would have concerns as well. As a dealer, a nit picky customer is a pain. Fully functioning components and good fit and finish is reasonable. Beyond that, I would tell you to have a nice day, or, not give you the best deal expecting you to cost more than average customers.
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You must not be in need of money.
__________________
Mocha, one-eyed toothless, hurricane survivor, Pirate dog
2019 20th Anniversary Edition 3701LK
B&W 20K for Ford OEM Puck
2018 Ford F-350 Lariat CCLB PSD DRW KJ5CQH
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09-03-2018, 03:10 PM
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#11
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Site Team
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Wilsey
Posts: 18,799
M.O.C. #11455
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Two things. First, if I were you I would find another dealer. When we bought our 2017 they took the Moryde steps out and cut a hole and mounted the folding steps we wanted and remounted a door before we bought the unit. That was extreme and we had a relationship over several years of having issues fixed there. On the other hand, they found an issue with our AC installation and have told me they now take the AC's off of every new units when the first arrive to fix if necessary, so fixing rigs when something is wrong is the sign of a good dealer. What is your dealer planning on doing, stick someone who doesn't notice something? Second, be careful of using this forum as a reason to worry about buying a new unit. This is the palce to bring problems, not a place to express satisfaction. There are thousands and thousands of members of this forum and the serious problems, numerically are not that large a part of the whole.
__________________
Dick, Joyce, Diego, Picatso and Gustav
2017 3720 RL, and 2013 HC 343RL
Pullrite Hitch, IS, Disk Brakes, 3rd AC, Winegard Traveler, Bathroom door mod, Dometic 320, couch for desk swap, replaced chairs, sun screens, added awnings, etc.
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09-03-2018, 03:07 PM
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#12
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Montana Master
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: SWFL
Posts: 965
M.O.C. #17801
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Montana Man
If I was told that someone wanted to do an OC PDI, I would have concerns as well. As a dealer, a nit picky customer is a pain. Fully functioning components and good fit and finish is reasonable. Beyond that, I would tell you to have a nice day, or, not give you the best deal expecting you to cost more than average customers.
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First step is a negotiated purchase order and probably a deposit. You don't sign a contract till you take delivery, whether the unit is on the lot or being ordered. It's not going to "cost more" if you do a PDI.
Is it nit picky to find gaps in the roof sealant at the front and rear caps, screws instead of nuts and bolts to install the front door steps, one of which was rubbing against the gas line, a TV that wasn't properly adjusted to rise high enough so the remote could point to the sensor, one of six slides that was not adjusted properly and rubbing on the vinyl floor, only 1 of 2 batteries installed (residential fridge requires 2), leaking kitchen sink drain, cracked kitchen counter (Corian)?
I wouldn't have found all those issues, and more, without doing a proper PDI. It's no different than doing a punch list on a new house IMO. I'll take the very small risk of pissing off a difficult dealer to do my due diligence.
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09-03-2018, 05:10 PM
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#13
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Carson City
Posts: 2,017
M.O.C. #21963
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phillyg
First step is a negotiated purchase order and probably a deposit. You don't sign a contract till you take delivery, whether the unit is on the lot or being ordered. It's not going to "cost more" if you do a PDI.
Is it nit picky to find gaps in the roof sealant at the front and rear caps, screws instead of nuts and bolts to install the front door steps, one of which was rubbing against the gas line, a TV that wasn't properly adjusted to rise high enough so the remote could point to the sensor, one of six slides that was not adjusted properly and rubbing on the vinyl floor, only 1 of 2 batteries installed (residential fridge requires 2), leaking kitchen sink drain, cracked kitchen counter (Corian)?
I wouldn't have found all those issues, and more, without doing a proper PDI. It's no different than doing a punch list on a new house IMO. I'll take the very small risk of pissing off a difficult dealer to do my due diligence.
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What I said was an obsessive compulsive pdi. Way different than a fair inspection to ensure the unit is as advertised, in brand new condition. Some people have unattainable expectations. They usually apply those expectations onto others and not themselves. These trailers are not Mercedes and never will be.
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09-03-2018, 02:57 PM
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#14
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Montana Master
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Lake Gaston
Posts: 8,773
M.O.C. #12156
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You are bringing the dollars, if the dealer does not want to cooperate, walk away.
__________________
Mike and Lorraine
2002 3655 FL, 2005 3650RK
2010 3665RE, 2015 3910FB
F350 crew cab dually 6.7
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09-03-2018, 03:32 PM
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#15
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: New Castle
Posts: 112
M.O.C. #22550
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The industry has gotten sloppy when you spend 50, 60 , 70,000 $ and more the quality is terrible, that is no excuse Simply they don't care
I would send mine back if I had that choice
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09-03-2018, 03:38 PM
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#16
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Established Member
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: North Augusta
Posts: 30
M.O.C. #21463
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My family owns a 2018 3790RD and a 2018 3791RD. Both purchased January 2nd 2018 from CW Myrtle Beach. Both have been on five trips each from the coast to the Mountains. No problems with the 5W's or the F-250's
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09-03-2018, 03:42 PM
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#17
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Montana Master
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Hixson
Posts: 3,436
M.O.C. #11397
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We have bought 3 new Montanas from one dealer and have NEVER been asked for one penny until a thorough PDI was done by us and any issues however minor corrected. Run from this dealer if they say otherwise!
__________________
2018.5 Montana 3791RD
Full Timers 9/1/2010 through 1/16/2020.
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09-03-2018, 04:29 PM
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#18
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Site Team
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Wilsey
Posts: 18,799
M.O.C. #11455
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Quote:
Originally Posted by w5352
My family owns a 2018 3790RD and a 2018 3791RD. Both purchased January 2nd 2018 from CW Myrtle Beach. Both have been on five trips each from the coast to the Mountains. No problems with the 5W's or the F-250's
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But for a Camping World those folks are outstanding. A number of folks here have purchased there and there used to be a member who worked there.
__________________
Dick, Joyce, Diego, Picatso and Gustav
2017 3720 RL, and 2013 HC 343RL
Pullrite Hitch, IS, Disk Brakes, 3rd AC, Winegard Traveler, Bathroom door mod, Dometic 320, couch for desk swap, replaced chairs, sun screens, added awnings, etc.
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09-03-2018, 03:39 PM
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#19
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 378
M.O.C. #21337
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A good dealer relationship is key to RV purchase.
If you are not comfortable with them, and that what it sounds like, walk away and find another one.
Mike
__________________
Montana 3123RL Legacy 'Boon-docking Edition'
RAM 3500 Mega Cab Cummins Diesel DRW
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09-03-2018, 05:13 PM
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#20
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Site Team
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Omaha
Posts: 6,795
M.O.C. #7560
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The dealer should have done his own PDI on the unit before it went on to the lot. It sounds like this dealer just wants to sell and not to take care of any problems that may arise with the unit. In respect to the industry getting sloppy, this is across the whole industry and if one works with the manufacturer and does not threaten them with lawsuits and etc they normally will work with you. If threats are put out by the customer or even the dealer, the manufacturer will just turn their backs. I have seen this with Keystone as well as numerous other companies. The biggest problem is a lot of the dealers. They want to be able to sell a unit but they do not want to do any repairs especially under warranty items. Keystone pays specific pay for warranty items and repairs and the dealers high prices for service repair is more than what Keystone will pay. The problem is the service techs that work for the dealers don't even get a third of the money a dealer charges and that is why there is a shortage of service techs nationwide. If your dealer does not want you to do a PDI or wants you to sign for the unit BEFORE the PDI just look at them and laugh, turn around and walk away. There are other dealers that WILL work with you on pricing and service.
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