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Old 03-12-2015, 05:02 PM   #21
grayghost03
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I agree, pay your money, take your chances. We to have the 2015 356 bunkhouse, zero problems, no slide issues, no water leakage from fresh water tank, nothing, and we live in it. So this makes the second Montana line 5ver without an issue. Third Keystone product. So far so good. Haven't spent anything on the three, other then a bunch of add on :-) I am a firm believer in maintenance and keeping everything lubed and tight. Leave nothing to chance
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Old 03-12-2015, 05:08 PM   #22
Artemus Gordon
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Ok this post won't be liked by some! I apologize in advance! Having been in Customer Service, you can't please some people. Molehills become Mountains. People expect way too much of some products. They seem to equate "what they paid" as enough to expect perfection. I spent 10 xs what my Montana costs on boats that had issues very similar to RVs. Range Rovers, BMW, Bentleys have issues. Why because they are machines, built by humans. Things go wrong, things fail. Now as far as fixing, yes you must point out the issues ASAP! Not two years later, like some tend to do. You also have to understand the law, is not entirely consumer friendly. If manufacturer gives you a time to get it fixed, and you hesitate, you might lose opportunity. Just because time is not convenient, sorry they offered to fix it. Go before a Judge he will say, "Mr Arnold they offered to fix it Christmas Day! But Judge I like to spent that one day with family! You know what I mean, it's your responsibility to let them fix it! Last it's not brick and mortar. It's a glued together, screwed and stapled faux house, riding down the perfect smooth freeways in North America! My best friends are upset because a piston strut went out on their three year old trailer storage door. All this is the price of admition for all this fun we are having! Yes they should build them better, yes they should have better warranty's, but those few company's that did all that, are either broke or could not get their price and now exist under a company named after a Norse God! Thank you! Lol. Last thing! "Why does Newell and all the other high end builders, have parts departments"? Because things break and go bad...sadly!
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Old 03-12-2015, 06:27 PM   #23
JnSWells
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Well here's our take on the subject. Purchased our 2012 Montana February, made the mistake of waiting till April to have a few minor fixes. Was July when we finally got to use it, Campingworld Portland, Or, slowwww! Fireplace has quit and been repaired 4 times under warranty. Norcold refrigerator was worked on through warranty five different fixes, none worked. The freezer would have a 2 inch icicle in the front within a day of starting and would have ice all around the seal. Finally replaced it with a new one after Trailer Life Magazine intervened on our behalf. Replaced leaking Lippert front jack, for $700 last year now it's leaking hydraulic fluid again. Taking it in for that and a leaking bedroom slide. This is our 4th fifth wheel and the only one with so many problems. I forgot storage compartment door leaked after bad rain, clean out for black tank wasn't hooked up and flooded basement with first use, emergency window replaced after leaking and hot water tank only works on gas... Replaced on/off switch and high temp reset switch..Hopefully that fixes it. What about those rusty lugnuts?
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Old 03-12-2015, 07:24 PM   #24
bigskyjimmy
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It sounds like you are mostly Disappointed at Camping World and Norcold , Dimplex , Lippert and Suburban Or frustrated with all bad luck with a lot of things(I would be Too) I get the leaking slide issue and the black tank nozzle is Keystone's fault but it sounds like you are mostly Disappointed with The vendors and Camping World and also I live in WA on the Coast and the lug nut issue is easy to keep a handle on I just spray ANTI Rust(Fluid Film Brand works AWESOME) on them every once in a while and I also spray it on my truck chrome Lugs
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quote:Originally posted by JnSWells

Well here's our take on the subject. Purchased our 2012 Montana February, made the mistake of waiting till April to have a few minor fixes. Was July when we finally got to use it, Campingworld Portland, Or, slowwww! Fireplace has quit and been repaired 4 times under warranty. Norcold refrigerator was worked on through warranty five different fixes, none worked. The freezer would have a 2 inch icicle in the front within a day of starting and would have ice all around the seal. Finally replaced it with a new one after Trailer Life Magazine intervened on our behalf. Replaced leaking Lippert front jack, for $700 last year now it's leaking hydraulic fluid again. Taking it in for that and a leaking bedroom slide. This is our 4th fifth wheel and the only one with so many problems. I forgot storage compartment door leaked after bad rain, clean out for black tank wasn't hooked up and flooded basement with first use, emergency window replaced after leaking and hot water tank only works on gas... Replaced on/off switch and high temp reset switch..Hopefully that fixes it. What about those rusty lugnuts?
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Old 03-12-2015, 08:52 PM   #25
sambam
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Artemus Gordon

Ok this post won't be liked by some! I apologize in advance! Having been in Customer Service, you can't please some people. Molehills become Mountains. People expect way too much of some products. They seem to equate "what they paid" as enough to expect perfection. I spent 10 xs what my Montana costs on boats that had issues very similar to RVs. Range Rovers, BMW, Bentleys have issues. Why because they are machines, built by humans. Things go wrong, things fail. Now as far as fixing, yes you must point out the issues ASAP! Not two years later, like some tend to do. You also have to understand the law, is not entirely consumer friendly. If manufacturer gives you a time to get it fixed, and you hesitate, you might lose opportunity. Just because time is not convenient, sorry they offered to fix it. Go before a Judge he will say, "Mr Arnold they offered to fix it Christmas Day! But Judge I like to spent that one day with family! You know what I mean, it's your responsibility to let them fix it! Last it's not brick and mortar. It's a glued together, screwed and stapled faux house, riding down the perfect smooth freeways in North America! My best friends are upset because a piston strut went out on their three year old trailer storage door. All this is the price of admition for all this fun we are having! Yes they should build them better, yes they should have better warranty's, but those few company's that did all that, are either broke or could not get their price and now exist under a company named after a Norse God! Thank you! Lol. Last thing! "Why does Newell and all the other high end builders, have parts departments"? Because things break and go bad...sadly!
Good post. Puts things in perspective. I guess when you spend 10's of thousands of dollars on something, you want everything to be right. Coming from a guy that's worked in manufacturing his whole life, I get that the human element is a major factor, also. I still choose to live the RV lifestyle in spite of the pitfalls and unexpected occurrences. Overall, I think about the good times I've had in my campers and want to continue the lifestyle, come what may. It's never going to be perfect. I feel for some of the others here who have had myriad issues, like Rich and now Virginia. The fact that they forge ahead in spite of the issues is testimony to how wonderful it all can be.
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Old 03-13-2015, 01:01 AM   #26
Tom S.
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Artemus Gordon

Ok this post won't be liked by some! I apologize in advance! Having been in Customer Service, you can't please some people. Molehills become Mountains. People expect way too much of some products. They seem to equate "what they paid" as enough to expect perfection. I spent 10 xs what my Montana costs on boats that had issues very similar to RVs. Range Rovers, BMW, Bentleys have issues. Why because they are machines, built by humans. Things go wrong, things fail. Now as far as fixing, yes you must point out the issues ASAP! Not two years later, like some tend to do. You also have to understand the law, is not entirely consumer friendly. If manufacturer gives you a time to get it fixed, and you hesitate, you might lose opportunity. Just because time is not convenient, sorry they offered to fix it. Go before a Judge he will say, "Mr Arnold they offered to fix it Christmas Day! But Judge I like to spent that one day with family! You know what I mean, it's your responsibility to let them fix it! Last it's not brick and mortar. It's a glued together, screwed and stapled faux house, riding down the perfect smooth freeways in North America! My best friends are upset because a piston strut went out on their three year old trailer storage door. All this is the price of admition for all this fun we are having! Yes they should build them better, yes they should have better warranty's, but those few company's that did all that, are either broke or could not get their price and now exist under a company named after a Norse God! Thank you! Lol. Last thing! "Why does Newell and all the other high end builders, have parts departments"? Because things break and go bad...sadly!
I agree 100% and will add a few thoughts. If, out of the 80 some thousand Montana's that have been sold, 10 people have a problem with the "flitchit valve", and post it here, all of a sudden, we tend to forget about the other 79,990 owners who haven't had a problem, and we declare a state of emergency. Of course if 10 people have a problem, it's likely others have, because not every Montana owner belongs to this site. But over 14 thousand do, and 10 out of 14,000 is still an insignificant statistical number. Yet people like to complain when something happens, and the internet is the perfect forum for that. That doesn't make those ten people bad, but we need to look at things in the proper context. For example, what would we think if, after those ten people listed their "flitchit vavle" woes, just ten percent of the other members here posted they had no problems whatsoever? Math says that's 1,400+ posts with no issues vs 10 with. Still a pretty insignificant number in the grand scheme of things. Of course if you happen to be one of the 10, the other 1,400 doesn't matter to you.

Again, I am not trying to belittle anyone, and for each of us, when something breaks, doesn't work right or falls off, we're upset. And making a post to tell others of our problems helps us feel better, even if it does nothing to remedy the issue. Just remember though when you read those posts that 'stuff' happens. Think about the numbers, and put things in the proper prospective.

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Old 03-13-2015, 04:51 AM   #27
richfaa
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Yes we have had bad luck but it is appearing we are in good company here by the post showing up. I just had a leaking front and rear seal replaced on my Ford Truck. I got to find out who made the seals and blame then for the failure not Ford although Ford fixed it as though they were the responsible party.
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Old 03-13-2015, 05:58 AM   #28
richfaa
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There are 848 pages of members on the forum and 10 per page so we have over 8K Registered members. However many of those have dropped out and only a fraction are active posters.

The MOC is a excellent representative sample of Montana Owners and it does not take large numbers to set trends good or bad. The TV Nelsion ratings are good example . Anyone with data collection experience will understand that.

There are also other Keystone sites on other forums and I read them all. The post on them good and bad reflect what we see on the MOC.

The Young's and myself for example have posted our experiences as have others in that they may help others. We have seen over the years a very small number of Members whose only purpose was to bash Montana and they were dealt with by the administrators.

If the trend is to no longer do that let the Mission statement reflects that. I have already decided that once the issues we have already posted on are addressed good or bad we will no longer post problems of any kind. We can take care of ourselves.
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Old 03-13-2015, 06:05 AM   #29
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quote:Originally posted by Slink

Let's have folks report who have spent $500.00 or less on their unit in one year with exception of tires or normal maintenance. Is Keystone and their dealers taking care of business, or is it all flash and no substance. Let's hear the good things on the product, is it worth it to continue buying keystone products?
Purchased my 2014 in January. Three of my issues were not related to any subcontractors of Keystone, but only related to cheap sloppy workmanship.

The kitchen water lines had a knife cut across them which caused them to start leaking about a month after purchase. Had to have licensed plumber replace defective lines and install valves. On second trip the entire closet clothes rod collapsed and was destroyed. I rebuilt the entire assembly myself using oak wood/rods for under $120.00.

The third cheap sloppy workmanship issue is the roof, which is still not resolved by Keystone. Enough has been written about this issue to last us all a lifetime and is obviously of no interest except to us few victims of this defective workmanship.

So have I spend less than $500.00 on my own repairs? Probably. Is a Montana still a good value? I think if you can purchase one at a discounted price of under $50,000 then it would be worth buying a new one.

Here is my take on Keystone though. I think they are starting down the road of not honoring their warranties and producing some pretty sloppy workmanship. But their units are priced accordingly. If we were to purchase another FW it would be a "higher end" from someone else besides Keystone RV.

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Old 03-13-2015, 06:30 AM   #30
Artemus Gordon
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Tom, the "flitchit valve", is from a third party in China and have vexed Keystone for years. While mine still operates properly, I have replaced three "Svenson Valves" in my comode! Every time someone asks if they can use my toilet, I tell them "No", not till I get a new Svensen valve! Lol
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Old 03-13-2015, 06:58 AM   #31
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Glad to see we still have humor, good job everyone, it seams as a whole Keystone still has a good product. It is still my opinion that regardless of all the different sub contractors for Keystone it is Keystones responsibility to take care of all warranty work and be reimbursed from their subs without putting their customers through hell(in some cases). Years ago I worked for a dealer in Kansas City and it was my task to recoup all monies we put out and returning warranty parts to various manufacturers, but we took care of the customer 1st as long as it was under warranty. Holiday Rambler an Airstream maybe it's time they go back to this. Thanks to all for responding
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Old 03-13-2015, 07:48 AM   #32
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And, I too have to chuckle. We have a $50,000 plus Montana, and our neighbors have a $250,000 plus motor home from a very well known manufacturer. The problems they've had make ours pale by comparison. And the technology going into some of those big rigs....level control, ride control, steering control (for windy conditions) and on and on, and it breaks every so often. Actually, makes me very glad to have our "low tech" Montana. Reality is, things happen. Just hope nothing is too bad.....!
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Old 03-13-2015, 08:36 AM   #33
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Just went through 10 Montana's at lazy days. Did not see any I would trade mine for. Did see a couple I would consider but they had REDWOOD or MOBILE SUITES letters on front and sides.
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Old 03-13-2015, 08:52 AM   #34
bigskyjimmy
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Freak'in HILARIOUS.....thank for the Laugh Artemus
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quote:Originally posted by Artemus Gordon

Tom, the "flitchit valve", is from a third party in China and have vexed Keystone for years. While mine still operates properly, I have replaced three "Svenson Valves" in my comode! Every time someone asks if they can use my toilet, I tell them "No", not till I get a new Svensen valve! Lol
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Old 03-22-2015, 09:13 AM   #35
wrehfield
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Bought new a 2012 Mountaineer 29 foot. immediate problems and no help from Tacoma RV.
Would not buy another Montana nor deal with that dealer again.
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Old 03-22-2015, 09:46 AM   #36
bigskyjimmy
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Sorry to hear that, Tacoma RV has a great reputation(#1 Towable dealer in Wa State) and I have bought 2 New Monty's there and know many more folks that have bought from there and I have had a great experience with the sales and Service and Parts dept but I guess they dropped the ball in your case,Hopefully they can do better for ya
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quote:Originally posted by wrehfield


Bought new a 2012 Mountaineer 29 foot. immediate problems and no help from Tacoma RV.
Would not buy another Montana nor deal with that dealer again.
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