HELP

[Montana Sky]

10 cases of beer??

10 cases of beer in the coach, 10 cases of beer
Take one out, pass it around, now theres only 9 cases of beer in the coach...

When you replace that tv Rich, let the rest of us know, with 10 cases of beer on hand you might have a full house for the evening. =)

[Snowhawk]

This seems like a good opportunity (from the little girl with a lot of new dolls) to say that I've been practicing camping... in the driveway! We haven't been able to get away for a real campout, with my stupid schedule, so... since I've had to work midnight shift all week... I've been coming home and sleeping in the camper (much quieter than the house... no phones, slamming doors, screaming bird, perpetual ::tap - tap - tap:: of a certain person's keyboard always on this forum). Ahhhh, I may just move in and use the house to store stuff.... ::snicker, snicker:: Rich talks about my not wanting to get out of the camper... but he's just as interesting to watch with all the little tweaks and improvements he's been making on both the camper AND the truck. He's like a kid in a candy store with this stuff... but I love it because he's happy keeping himself occupied until I retire (come on Halloween!!!)

[Montana_1240]

Helen,

Enjoy!

Just make sure he gets all his improvements done before you go out in it for a long trip.

And, if you have a laptop, or take a desktop PC the way we have, make sure that TAP TAP TAP, (Yes, it can get louder in the Monty when you're trying to sleep,) is agreed to be done only within certain hours.

Your comments do bring home a point, though. Times sure have changed! Used to be, all we had to accomplish what you've done was a tent in the back yard!


Steve

[richfaa]

Think I have installed all the goodies for now..old whats-her-name-is still out in the camper..can I name the Montana in a alienation of affection lawsuit???We are stumped on the slightly less than perfect Sat signal.Have checked every connector and cable that I can get to.I am suspicious of the cable in the docking station..it is marked cable/Sat//however the Sat cable has to be RG-6..the cable connector can be RG-59..I pulled the panel and the cable that I could see is not marked as to the type. I suspect that the cable is RG-59..and yes there is a difference..there will be a slight loss if it is RG-59..I will run a stright RG-6 into the Sat receiver to prove this point soon as Helen moves out of the camper/////

[Parrothead]

Rich are you using the surround speakers when you have sat. hooked up? We found this changes the picture just slightly when on sat or cable. We had one of our receivers hooked up at the stick house temporially with R-5.9 and I couldn't tell the difference when we switched to R6. Maybe if they had been side by side I could have.
Happy trails....................

[richfaa]

We use the surround sound when watching a DVD and did not notice a difference..will check again and you do need to compare side by side to see the difference between RG-59 and RG-6 for short runs, 50 feet or less.There is a loss in RG-59 and you will note a slightly fuzzy and grainy picture.

RG6 vs. RG59

RG59 is a lower grade of coaxial cable than RG6, consisting of a smaller center conductor, a smaller insulating dielectric, and a single outer shield. However, it delivers acceptable performance for CATV. RG-59 has a 22 AWG center conductor.

RG6, on the other hand, has a larger center conductor (18 AWG), a dual or quad shield (2 braids and 2 foils), and a much larger insulating dielectric. The benefits of using RG6 cable include: more bandwidth, lower susceptibility to interference, and lower attenuation per foot. All of these characteristics allow it to handle a higher bandwidth than RG59 cable. RG6 delivers exceptional performance for CATV, satellite, and all other video applications and is considered the cable of choice for digital TV.

As cable TV companies add new channels and begin to introduce two-way communication, the bandwidth limitations of RG59 will make it obsolete. RG6, on the other hand, is rated at up to 1.5 gigahertz (GHz) - about double the rating for RG59. The superior protection provided by four separate electronic shields within the cable also ensure that signals traveling through RG6 remain intact.

The EIA/TIA 570-A Residential Telecommunication Cabling Standard specifies Series 6/ RG6 coaxial cable.

[Montana_1240]

Rich,

It's be hard to believe that a piece of lowly RG-59 would be laying around the factory to get put into your rig after at least a couple years of using RG-6. But it sure seems that you may be onto something.

Tell me more about that "Docking Station." I'm not sure I get the picture. (Keep thinking of a laptop docking station and its functions, I guess.) If it adds more connectors to the mix, that could very easily be the problem. A connector with only one strand of shield touching the center lead, or a shield that isn't crimped adequately could do all sorts of bad to a system.

I dunno how you've got your TV connected. Mine doesn't go through the TiVO's receivers when anything on the home theater system is in use. And when I'm watching through the TiVO, nothing goes through the home theater system, except for the TV’s speaker output, which I could listen to on the surround speakers if I want to. I suppose the various frequencies running around the home theater system's case could leak out somehow, (probably more likely on a Quest than a this Sony,) and disturb your receiver. But it sounds like you've probably got that home theater system off when checking on the satellite picture quality problem.

Having experienced a problem with a screw that was sunk through one of our surround speaker leads, (let the dealer find and fix that one,) I wouldn't put it past that happening to a piece of RG-6, either. Talk to a satellite repair guy to see if he can't stop by with a tester to check to see if there's an open, short, or piece of RG-59 lurking in your wiring. You could by pass the amp in the bedroom, too. No telling whether it’s inducing a problem that could be felt on the entire cable…Since it is able to switch from a solid DC path when off, to a powered one that kills satellite reception when on…..

Unless, of course, you just wanna go playing around the Monty that much longer.

Steve

[richfaa]

IMG]http://i6.tinypic.com/14ugwtg.jpg[/IMG]

See pic of docking station

Well they had a bunch of blue awnings laying around so why not a few reels of RG-59. For a cable ony input RG-59 is fine ..Until I can prove different We are assuming it is RG-59

[Montana_1240]

Rich,

OH! So THAT is a docking station.

Then it only replaces the other connectors the rest of our Monties have on them, and probably doesn't add extra connections.

I suppose it is possible that some RG-59 was lying around. But isn't coax almost always labeled along its entirety? Maybe some doesn't have the printing close together. But surely it should all be labeled.

Regardless. Someone with the proper coax tester should be able to get a reading on the integrity of the rig's cabling. And my mind would be made up on getting Keystone to make it right, should there be some strange readings on the tester. (Sacrifice a short segment to an electrical supply shop to see if they can tell by looking!)

I know that we used testers that'd diagnose problems with phone wiring, as well as CAT-5 and CAT-5E cabling. We'd know if there were an open, short, or even a problem with capacitance or resistance. Plus, we'd have an idea how far along from the point of testing the problem existed.

The cost of the test should be paid by Keystone, if it turns up a problem. And it sure seems like you've eliminated everything else.

Tell Helen you're gonna be busy in the Monty for a while longer!


Steve

[richfaa]

yes coax is nearly always marked but I see no markings on this one and can only pull about 1 foot out through the docking station wall.My eyeball test will tell the tale.I will tun the RG-6 from my dish to the input of the sat receiver then to the TV completely eliminating the camper cable . I can get one of my former, still working, colleagues to bring a tester from work and ring the cable out to prove what kind of cable it is..It is not that big of a problem..most folks would not even be able to tell the difference ..but I can and the Technician in me will not rest till I have a answer to the problem...

You can tell the difference between RG-59 and RG-6 by visual inspection.You need to have both types of cable side by side. The RG-6 is a bit thicker cable and the connector, because it is a thicker cable is also a bit larger than the connector on the RG-59. If you just look at one without the other to the unpracticed eye you may not be able to note the difference. What I see in the camper tells me the cable IS RG-6 although unmarked.My guess is that the slight loss I see is in the camper"circuitry" I have the so called latest print but I am dubious as to its accuracy.This issues is a mole hill that I am making my personal mountain...but....that's ole Rich..

[Montana_1240]

Rich,

I can imagine how it must be grating on you. With me being the TV addict that I am, I know it’d drive me up the wall not being able to get the best picture I could out of the stuff I’ve got in here. A foot with no marking is probably not according to normal standards. But I’ve bought coax that was made by companies no less reputable than Belden Cable. Who knows what Chinese prison slave laborers created the cables we have in here….

With satellite signals being digital, there should be no reason it won’t give you the same picture quality you have in the house with the equipment.

Speaking of which, I missed whether you’ve tried that dish on your house or not. I think it’s a different dish. But that’d show up if you run a direct feed to the Monty's receiver from the dish. Which is what you’re planning on doing.

I didn’t want to suggest cutting a piece of the stuff out. I always had doubts about my crimper’s ability to give me the same quality of connection that a cable installer’s tools and connectors can do. I’ve had a few times when a cable installer stopped by and replaced a couple of my crimped ends to solve a leaky signal problem. (A “problem” I doubted was existing, since my house was nowhere near any signal source that could have interfered with the cable company’s signal…But that’s history, now.)

Sounds like you have the people on hand to deal with what you’ll need to root out the evil demons in that system.

Before I saw that diagram, the way I was made to see the wiring as going was from the Monty’s input connector, through the double-connector plate by the LR TV, and then to the amp in the bedroom. From the amp in the bedroom to the bedroom TV and to the living room TV, with a jumper to the antenna. How it all actually worked was what had me going. I knew that if you turned the amp on, it’d kill the satellite dish power signal. And I felt that its jumper to the antenna might just be seen as some sort of bad thing for the satellite signal. (Like having an unterminated run of CAT-5 in an Ethernet system, which then acts as an antenna, causing signal problems and errors.) As it happens, I never used the Monty LR-to BR wiring for feeding my receivers. Which left the LR TV disconnected from the Monty’s cable, except for the short piece that went to the outside Cable/Satellite connection. And since others have used it with no problems, it must work.

If you pull the plates off from behind the TV, you may have extra cable to see labels. (I'm used to my arrangement where I can pull slack outta the holes, plus see through openings near where the outside Cable/Satellite feed comes into this Monty.) None of which will matter, though, if there’s a staple or screw passing into a cable at any other point. Not necessarily enough to kill the signal…Just enough to disrupt the expected capacitance or resistance.

Keep us up on what you dig up on this. I know I wouldn’t sit still for it.

Good Luck,
Steve

[richfaa]

That same dish, through the same receiver, delivers a crystal clear picture to a Tv outside of the camper. I agree with you about the connectors and I have the proper tools to do the job.I have many times changed out connectors to solve a problem. Tomorrow I will pull the plates in the cabinet above the TV. Oh I even changed out the amp(had a spare one laying about, no improvement,There is a mismatch somewhere and although I may not be able to correct it, I am not pulling cable through the walls,I will have identified the trouble..I am having fun...Sort of like I am back at work again...but not getting paid..I always enjoyed the quest for the problem...

[Montana_1240]

Rich,

Then you have a good dish with a functional LNB. Clears away that question!

Yeah, I wouldn't have tried pulling coax, myself. While they say the cables are loose in th ceilings, I would be scared to death of losing one during a pull!

Then the trailer's TB cables go into the slide. At that point, I'm sure I'd run into a hitch.

That's one reason I haven't thought seriously about putting a dish on the roof. There's a fat chance that such could be installed without having cable hanging out of the ceiling, and slung over to the entertainment center slide, looking god awful ugly all the time! IMHO....

Plus, if I had cables run for one of those, I’d also want a bunch cable ready for a possible Satellite Internet dish for future use. All that wiring would likely run a bundle!

I'm guessing that if you're anything like me, you enjoy this work because you can take a break whenever you want to, AND sip a cold one during the break!

Sure beats work!


Steve

[richfaa]

I called and asked Keystone for the latest print on the Sat/Cable/Ant wiring and they sent the same one we had dated 5-1-04..two years old and apparently there is no other. We know the print is not correct because on my 06 3400 we can get sat on both front and rear Tv where others can not so the print is not to be trusted. I have checked everything we can without tearing out the walls including changing out the splitter and the amplifier. The slight decrease in picture quality, and I do mean slight is within the camper wiring..a miss-match or a feed back loop somewhere.When I go on the factory tour"again" at the fall rally..I will have camera in hand and see how that mess is wired.We are not going to spend any more time on something that is just a minor annoyance to me and most folks would not even notice..At least I have satisfied myself as to where the problem is//// Now I can move on to the RV-Cam installation.

[Montana_1240]

Rich,

I’m surprised that Keystone even HAD a print for any wiring diagram. Though I suppose that there should be some documented plan to start with…Which is then turned over to the line, where the workers, (who don’t use diagrams from what I’d been told,) do their magic.

I have also heard of folks using the existing wiring, (if my memory serves me,) and have used two receivers with satisfactory results.

I’m sticking with the KISS principle in my house, when possible. `And I’ll make any and all excuses I can to avoid trying to find room for a second receiver in the BR!

I hope you get a chance to see the wiring as it happens. When I was through there, both times, the line is closed down, and we never went up above a rig while it was stationary but in the process of being wired. I wanted to poke around and see how the speakers in an entertainment center were wired, but didn’t get a chance, either time. There were some ready to be installed way on the side of the building, and then the ones that were already installed on the rigs waiting on the line. Nothing in-between to look at. Luckily, I figured it out during all the times I’ve taken the TV out.

I have a feeling you’ll have to ask directly for the ability to dig as deep as you need to. Good luck!

I still think that there might be a staple or a screw impinging on a piece of coax, somewhere. Or, like you suggested, some RG-59 in the midst. Glad the problem isn’t so annoying as to make you wanna dig into it even more thoroughly than you already have!

Have fun with that camera! Your rig looks great, BTW. I love “Spy Cars.” I’d love to do much the same, too, so Kim could get full use of her Delorm software and GPS with her laptop. But I doubt her laptop would take too kindly to our kids’ drooling on it while they visit with us in front.

Steve