Hybrid Furnace conversion?

[DonandBonnie]

Just read an ad for a hybrid RV furnace marketed under the brand name Cheap Heat. It says that you can flip a switch to heat your coach with either cheaper campground electric or your own propane. It sounds like it works the same way that we can change our hot water heater over. They also say it will work on both 50A or 30A systems.

The website, www.rvcomfortsystems.com, shows various models ranging from $195 to $695. It also says that installation should be done by a certified technician who is qualified to work on RV furnaces. No mention of what the installation would cost.

If the ad is true, with our normal winter propane usage this unit could probably pay for itself in less than one season. Is there anyone out there in MOC land with experience or knowledge of this or any other hybrid furnace?

[Ozz]

Yes, I looked into that, the guy wanted me to install them here in the K.C. area. It is a pretty extensive... and expensive retrofit. Very labor intense. I can't remember what I did last week, but as I recall through the fog of my memory, it seems it was around $1,500 or more.
You have to get to the furnace ductwork/plenum add the electric elements, safety high limits, controls and wire the power to the breaker panel.
I passed on both the installs and one for my rig.
I really like the Excalibur 2 speed fan and 2 level heat Propane furnace. If mine quits, I will install one of those baby's.

Here it is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GbPGp9eZ1U

[Ozz]

Ripped off from the Heartland Forum:

If you take in to account the cost of electricity then you have to do some "figuring".

First for the LP furnace, it is either a 35,000 or a 40,000BTU/hr unit. Our cost for Propane at this Campground is $2.60/gal, so the cost per running hour works out to be:


and the "Cheap Heat" units come in 2 outputs, a 307,260 and a 409,680BTU/day. We are long-term so we DO have to pay for electricity ($0.07/kWh). So for the smaller unit the cost per hour is:


and the larger unit is:



But that is now the whole story, since the rating are different lets look at the output per hour and the electric heaters are only putting out a fraction of the BTUs per hour. So if we take into account the fact the electric heater will have to run longer to output the same BTU the cost of the smaller unit changes to:


and the larger unit is:


So you are really only saving $0.13/Hr, and that means that you would have to run the furnace for 6,773 hours or 282.2 days straight just to recover the cost of the basic kit.

If John's estimate is close the to recover the cost of parts and install, it would take 11,538 hrs or 481 days of continuous use.

Ozz here.. well it looks as if all the figuring the guy did didn't want to come along to our forum. But I will leave it up, it has some good info, this guy is a math and electrical engineer person.

[DonandBonnie]

Ozz, I knew you would have the low down on this. Thanks. We could probably save some money with this conversion, but the payback would be over several years instead of several months. That's assuming that electric rates would remain the same. We would probably trade in and upgrade our coach before we reached the payback. Also with regulatory changes on the horizon the predictions are that electric rates are going to skyrocket over the next couple of years.

[Ozz]

The vent-less near 100% efficient Propane space heater seems to be a good idea, I piped in one and have used it working on my Monte, but haven't used it long term while on the road. You just can't beat heat coming out of the ducting, and I really don't know why as an option, they don't invent one for RV's. Maybe some day.

[DQDick]

If it's really cold outside you still have to run the furnace to keep the tanks and pipes warm and cost and installation makes no sense at this time so, at least for now, we've left ours alone.

[DonandBonnie]

Dick, from what I've learned from their website this furnace uses the same channels within the rig to distribute heat as would the propane system. We don't think that heating the tanks and pipes would be an issue. After reading Ozz's response, for us the payback would not be worth the cost.

[DQDick]

My comment was in response to Ozz's sugestion of a non-vented propane heater, not the replacement furnace. We don't use our furnace enough to ever justify the cost of the change, but that's just us.

[WaltBennett]

I found that at 20 degrees outside, running two electric ones on medium and the fireplace on high with the furnace set at 65, everything stays warm but the furnace isn't cycling on and off every ten minutes. It does kick on enough to keep the belly warm and prevent freezing, but not so much that makes us sweat/chill/sweat/chill all night. I'm positive this is all floor plan dependent, but our thermostat is located in a corner, sort of on an outside wall. (One of my 'sometime to do projects' is to relocate the thermostat to where it can work better.)

[Ozz]

Walt, I found a drafty wall inner-space when I changed my original thermostat out, the thermostat was reading the draft temperature and false-sensing the temperatures.
I advise everyone here to just pull the thermostat... (remove the screws holding it to the wall), and stuff some small-bubble packing material, or anything really, in the hole to stop the draft on the sensing thermostat. You will notice the difference.
When I change thermostats in residences I run into this ALL the time, I just use the packing in the new thermostat box and stuff it in the hole.

[DQDick]

Good advice. Montana's almost always have them on an outside wall with little or no insulation behind them.

[MAMalody]

I have often thought about this conversion. I am full-time and my home park (I winter there) electric is included in the rent so there is only a savings factor for me and no need of a propane/electric comparison, per se. It still looks like it would take me two to four years to recover the cost, based on installation costs. The problem is my dealer has never installed that and I can't get a "firm" estimated. I have been unable to find anyone in the area (WA) who has installed it. Does anybody know anything about the quality. This is also hard to find info on.

[Ozz]

Mike the quality is excellent, it is a well engineered product. The problem people have is getting it installed correctly, no one has done it you will run across, and for a tech to do the job, it will be slow: Costly for the customer, and the typical RV Tech is under so much pressure from the Service manager, you will likely get a sloppy job, things not done correctly.
I would pass on it for that reason. This is a job that HAS to be done correctly. You can find testimonials from people that had it done on the guys web-site, but I imagine he was hovering above those installs, and down the road a few hundred miles there could be problems with it, then you are really up the creek because NO ONE would be able to troubleshoot the problems.

[mhs4771]

Ozz, sounds like another "Side Line" for you. You could become a Traveling Installer and place a decal on after completion: "Installed by the Great and Powerful Ozz"

[Ozz]

I am getting lazy in my old age, and not becoming any brighter as well But I like the slogan..